'No self' Psychedelic = Salvia

[ardacigin]

Since many people here are into psychedelics, I've decided share some of my early experiences with them.

Although it is not a really a psychedelic I recommend it to people, if you really want to get a sense of what 'no self' is, salvia is the way to go. The issue is that this is an advanced and shocking psychedelic that can create traumatic trips for the uninitiated. This is definitely something your mind will resist experiencing. (unless you are highly awakened) A trip sitter is advised.

Most other psychedelics do preserve the inherent sense of being a self to a degree. That illusion is rarely dispelled so completely. Salvia obviously doesn't FULLY represent what awakening is all about but I see a lot of people who have a big talk about how 'easy' no self is.

Well, that entirely depends on the depth of the insight. I wouldn't say Salvia brings about the deepest insight into no self but it is definitely one of the more advanced and profound variations of no self.

Be careful if you are going to try this psychedelic and personally, You shouldnt try it unless you already have some permanent awakening under your belt. Not only you go deeper that way but the experience leaves you empowered rather than traumatized. 

So if your friend offers you some salvia at a party, just say 'no' just in case ;))

Also, keep in mind that Salvia provides only a highly dysfunctional depth of no-self. Actual awakening will allow you to combine the depth of this insight with everyday life. It might sound crazy but this is why I recommend people to actually meditate rigorously.

You'll start with baby steps and with time and practice, you'll mature your consciousness to such high levels.

The fact of the matter is that if you want such high levels of understanding in general, you need to dedicate yourself to spirituality and integrate your entire life with contemplation and meditation. Otherwise, it will be impossible.

Much love,

 

Edited October 18, 2022 by ardacigin

[BipolarGrowth]

Salvia was ironically one of the most pleasant psychedelics I’ve ever tried. It’s interesting that you relate it to the no self insight specifically. Maybe it’s because I already had some permanent shifts related to the sense of self by that point, but to me it didn’t seem to do a whole lot other than provide a certain type of insight more along the lines of what experience is capable of rather than any of the traditional spiritual insights. It exposed me to some new forms of sensations for sure which were enjoyable. 

[RMQualtrough]

I used Salvia extract many times. It is kind of a children's toy. It can easily destroy your mind and plunge you into unspeakable terrors that would give an older man a heart attack (like BipolarGrowth, for me personally I never encountered real terror). But, fact is I used this drug a lot and never once sobered up and felt "damn I encountered something real there". After sobering up, it FELT like I'd just taken a drug and lost my mind for a bit. Many people I know also took this drug, and once sober, again did not seem to have anything serious to ponder on.

n,n-DMT is the only drug where sobering up, it is still like "something serious happened there. That wasn't only drugs."

LSD, mushroom analogues, nothing really leaves the sensation that anything with any real gravity happened, except freebasing DMT. That is genuinely fucked and I wouldn't even recommend it to people to be honest. It's nothing like Salvia extract, it's real in a way.

[Leo Gura]

Salvia produces some serious amnesia, so yeah, very deep no-self.

Edited October 18, 2022 by Leo Gura

[ZenSwift]

3 hours ago, RMQualtrough said:

n,n-DMT is the only drug where sobering up, it is still like "something serious happened there. That wasn't only drugs."

LSD, mushroom analogues, nothing really leaves the sensation that anything with any real gravity happened, except freebasing DMT. That is genuinely fucked and I wouldn't even recommend it to people to be honest. It's nothing like Salvia extract, it's real in a way.

 

Very intriguing. 

[Breakingthewall]

interesting. It was the first psychedelic that I used and it is really shocking, its strength is enormous, but the sensation is negative, it has a demonic flavor. you stop being yourself completely, that's true, and you become a kind of strange nightmare. then you come back and it is true that there is a feeling of: I have ceased to be me. By the way, what other psychedelics have you used as a tool in your process?

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

it has a demonic flavor

Not so much demonic but alien for sure.

It's the most non-human of the psychedelics. And mercilessly so. It has no qualms raping your mind.

Edited October 19, 2022 by Leo Gura

[ardacigin]

10 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

interesting. It was the first psychedelic that I used and it is really shocking, its strength is enormous, but the sensation is negative, it has a demonic flavor. you stop being yourself completely, that's true, and you become a kind of strange nightmare. then you come back and it is true that there is a feeling of: I have ceased to be me. By the way, what other psychedelics have you used as a tool in your process?

Basically all of them apart from 4 aco dmt and 2CB. I never found them back in the day but I feel completely content with my psychedelic exploration and I've learned quite a bit from them. Actual awakening happened  thanks to my meditation practice afterwards and my entire life changed along with my view on psychedelics.

Now I'm conscious 24/7 and doesnt depend on a substance to deconstruct or explore consciousness.

Edited October 19, 2022 by ardacigin

[ardacigin]

10 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

interesting. It was the first psychedelic that I used and it is really shocking, its strength is enormous, but the sensation is negative, it has a demonic flavor. you stop being yourself completely, that's true, and you become a kind of strange nightmare. then you come back and it is true that there is a feeling of: I have ceased to be me. By the way, what other psychedelics have you used as a tool in your process?

The sensation isnt negative or demonic. It is a reflection of your unconscious mind. Salvia is better of explored with a more unified mind. Awakening and pre-awakening mind is not even remotely similar. My experiences of Salvia has zero negative aspects to it (basically the same as other psychedelics). I did have bad trips prior to awakening. Never had any post-awakening.

[Flyboy]

Salvia and schizophrenia (which is hyper-activation of the left hemisphere and suppression of the right, essentially) actually have a lot in common... which makes me think Salvia may block/erase the right hemisphere aspects of self (time, spatial grounding, continuity, context), while preserving the left hemisphere aspects.  This very awkward combination of "half-enlightenment" is the scary, rapey, objectified experience that results.

While both hemispheres contribute to the self-sense, I think the typical Path erodes the left hemisphere sense first, and the much more subtle and profound self-sense of the right hemisphere is the work done to finish the job prior to realization of Anatta.

Once again, see the work of Iain McGilchrist for a ton of "enlightening" perspective on how each hemisphere of the brain constructs various aspects of the self-sense and our view of reality.

[Breakingthewall]

On 19/10/2022 at 8:38 PM, ardacigin said:

Now I'm conscious 24/7 and doesnt depend on a substance to deconstruct or explore consciousness

What do you mean with conciouss 24/7? There are many levels to be "conciouss" .Could you explain the process that led you to that? what psychedelics? how often? how much meditation? I can free myself completely doing 5meo, but what is the use of being free 5 minutes a month? I want to be free all the time. I want to be a hole to infinity, not a limited ego. It doesn't make any sense to be, there's nothing there that interests me in the slightest. only freedom is worth. Is it possible?

[vladorion]

Salvia no-self is the no-self of Matter devoid of Spirit.

[ardacigin]

17 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

What do you mean with conciouss 24/7? There are many levels to be "conciouss" .Could you explain the process that led you to that? what psychedelics? how often? how much meditation? I can free myself completely doing 5meo, but what is the use of being free 5 minutes a month? I want to be free all the time. I want to be a hole to infinity, not a limited ego. It doesn't make any sense to be, there's nothing there that interests me in the slightest. only freedom is worth. Is it possible?

It is possible.  But this is a gradual process. Dont compare your initial permanent awakening with the peak of a 5 meo session. You wont use that comparison mind post-awakening anyways. 

Your liberation will unfold a little bit EVERYDAY after stream entry (or your 1st permanent awakening). As long as you keep seeing the insights everyday when you are drawing, talking, walking, playing games etc. Your entire life will be your playground.

I do have contact with 5 meo dmt insights 24/7. Thats what I meant. Now are these insights as clear on 5 meo dmt peak compared to when Im going to a meeting or hurrying somewhere to do something? Not always. But thats okay. I can taste the liberation any time. And if I want to I can go deeper in meditation any time as well. 

Now, THATS what is so life transforming. My old life seems like a memory at this point. So much delusion and suffering pervaded my life back then just like everyone else and Im thankful for this process to get kickstarted relatively early in my life. I cant even imagine what a 90-year-old Zen master is capable of :))

I'm getting more conscious literally each second and each day.

You seem interested to go deeper. We can do a coaching session if you are interested. Just DM me here for the details. Let me know if you have any more questions as well. @Breakingthewall

Much love,

Edited October 24, 2022 by ardacigin

[Breakingthewall]

@ardacigin thanks for your offer, let's see, and yes, it's about taking off little by little. I do not aspire to live in a psychedelic experience of 5 meo but to live completely free of attachment, of limitations. to live in magic, in no mind. I don't care knowing that the others are imaginary and stuff. I would say that the path includes 3 aspects: daily meditation, several hours, to educate the mind in silence, in the focus of what is. conscious detachment from everything, from the result of actions, from comfort, from future prospects. and psychedelics to deepen and undo all the knots that form the self and completely free yourself on time. As you said, the difference before/after (couple of years) is huge, but it's not enough. The freedom must be total or close