Ever lived in an intentional community? How was it?

[Ethan1]

Curious to hear experiences with living in an intentional community. I was wanting to look into some kind of lifestyle with:

• Intentional Communities
• Eco villages
• Communes
• Cohousing
• Shared housing
• Hostels

[Tyler Robinson]

Ripe for abuse. Cult mechanics

 

[Ethan1]

Was that from your firsthand experience?

[Tyler Robinson]

No. Leo told me this  if I correctly remember. 

I kept that in mind. 

 

 

 

(Leo told me not to be a part of a hippie commune or similar groups because these so called organized  groups are ripe for abuse, Ego games and cult dynamics. Most hypocritical people being part of such groups. That's what his opinion was when I asked him about it.) 

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Ethan1]

I feel ya, I was mostly curious to hear 1st hand experiences. 

The good, the bad, and any cool cult related stories too.


(Hippies are cool. Probably he is right in a certain context of hardcore hippies. Probably are some decent loving, compassionate, and emotionally attuned people too that don't fully identify as the label hippie too.)

Edited October 4, 2022 by Ethan1

[Tyler Robinson]

There are a ton on YouTube you know. Just type cult in search. You'll get a million. Very deep experiences. You will learn a lot. 

 

Also look into pyramid multi level network marketing schemes. They are similar cult type dynamics and a lot of it is pure scam. 

 

[Ethan1]

Yeah, I feel you on that. Comes down to due diligence and clear boundaries.

Good points, still distracts from the original topic at hand I was intending. I was looking for firsthand experiences. I'm not sure all communities and groups are cults or intend to enforce mind control tactics. 

( Btw even if you were ever in a cult, gang, MLM, military, witchcraft, etc. I'd still treat you with love & respect. Knowing healthy discernment at the same time. )

Edited October 4, 2022 by Ethan1

[mr_engineer]

I've been a part of a community-lifestyle for a week when I took a retreat. It's awesome! I saw what's possible, even though it was simulated, so to speak. 

I want to be a part of a community. And I got all the data-points for whether it's possible or not and what it would take to make it work, in that retreat. 

Intentional-communities are the future of humanity. As fiat-currencies collapse, there will be more and more of a push to localize supply-chains. And for people to come together and fix this mess. So, I highly recommend staying ahead of the game on this issue. If you're the expert on something that everyone wants, that's in-demand in the future, you can get very rich! 

[Tyler Robinson]

1 hour ago, Ethan1 said:

Knowing healthy discernment at the same time. )

If you're very strong, that is. 

 

[Ethan1]

@mr_engineer Amen to that brother, if I ever get the funds to create some of this stuff I sure as heck would. Create an environment focused on inclusivity. I took many classes in real estate and had my license a while back. This stuff gets me excited... Truly love the systems thinking behind all of it.

Bad ass! I was thinking about getting on google my maps & creating some kind of system of data points. I've been playing around with ArcGIS for a few years too. There truly needs to be some kind of system out there for the public to help connect all the dots and access it. Also, theres a cool site called iOverlander if youre ever traveling. That has helped a ton!

I've got a pimped out RV I'd be willing to contribute so I'd sure welcome anyone who wanted to come crash over at it or go on camping trips at no cost as long as they were respectful and fun to be around. Built a hydroponic system inside it too so I could grow stuff in the winter. 

[Tron]

one of my buddies is trying to start something like that. He originally invited me as people getting together to just talk and share. and as some time went on he kept implementing more rules. How to speak, making meetings every 2 weeks mandatory so we could all keep the core strong. It was just going down a weird path that I wasn't really ready to commit to.

I gave it a shot because I was new to the city and he's an old friend. I've known him since high school. But he's trying to be some kind of shaman now, but he still has his ego of being 'the guy'. He's a very charismatic guy and very magnetic.

I'm not saying he's starting a cult, but I decided to leave because I didn't feel comfortable with how he was controlling everything. And due to our history I didn't see him as an appropriate leader. I saw him as an equal. 

 

Besides I didn't wanna feel obligated to that. I was just looking for people to socialize with. 

So yeah, I just know when people are trying to control me, and I know when it doesn't work. 

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tron

[Ethan1]

@Tyler Robinson yep, Ethan means strong.

Again, not sure the point of the topic was to presuppose cult mentality to distract. The intent here is not to use presuppositions that's not cool. 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Ethan1

[Tyler Robinson]

@Ethan1

4 minutes ago, Ethan1 said:

@Tyler Robinson yep, Ethan means strong.

 

1 hour ago, Ethan1 said:

 

Oh, I thought it meant stunningly handsome. Nevermind. 

 

[mr_engineer]

@Ethan1 Think like an entrepreneur. Focus on the problems at hand that mainstream-society is facing right now. With the currencies and supply-chains. Intentional-community has the potential to solve all of that! And then, design a system that solves those problems. 

Another system that has a lot of blood on its hands, is the single-family home. It's becoming more and more obsolete, as the two parents aren't proving to be enough for the children. There will be a push for community, especially by conscious single-mothers. 

[Ethan1]

@Tyler Robinson I feel ya. You're the meaning maker

@mr_engineer Yeah, I mean getting back to the basics. Coming up with alternative forms of living. Like some form of parallel system. I'm having to brainstorm ideas to truly think outside the box. Divergent thinking. As of now, rent is the biggest obstacle for most people. If people would come together and stop dumping $1000+ per month on rent to landlords that don't really care about the wellbeing of their tenant. All they care about is receiving the payment from them. Now, build tiny villages. Work together and build a collection of tiny homes. Storage systems for people who are living out of their car because they have no better options. Then add on from there to local meet ups. People don't need much to live on. Eventually the whole housing market would crash because no one is willing to pay $1200+ a month in rent when they have alternative options for a fraction of the price. Leading to a pickle where there's a domino effect in the market. Loads of vacant properties. No longer is most of their income going towards rent. 

Single family home.. Yeah, that's been a big problem for a while. I could see a system similar to hostels. Build like a self-serving hostel village or something. I think people would truly stay in tiny cabins if they were properly built. Then create a network across the country where people can live on the property. Focus on volume. Then do something similar to Earthships or habitat for humanity. Also, similar to how Thousand trails works. The question is with all of the logistics and planning the layouts.

Thousand trails is literally $500 for a year access to like dozens of RV parks. Unlimited access. Unlimited 30 amp utilities. 100's of campsites. Literally the lowest way to cut rent and travel in this country that I'm aware of. Tons of people live in the system for nearly less than $50 a month in rent. The only catch is you can only stay at one place for 2 weeks at a time. Unless you have some kind of advanced membership. SOoo some kind of system simlar. Still thinking of ideas. 

Yeah, it takes a village to raise a child so I could see it being a helping hand for single-mothers who feel completely socially rejected by society. Heck they are raising the next generation and most men don't recognize the consequences. 

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Ethan1

[aurum]

3 hours ago, Ethan1 said:

Curious to hear experiences with living in an intentional community. I was wanting to look into some kind of lifestyle with:

• Intentional Communities
• Eco villages
• Communes
• Cohousing
• Shared housing
• Hostels

They're certainly not all cults. Cult is a strong accusation.

More likely than a cult is just the challenge of such close relationships. You don't need to be in a cult for relationships to be draining or toxic at times. Especially when you're practically living on top of each other and need to work together.

It's definitely not just going to be paradise. More like a lot of conflict, arguing, fighting etc.

You have to decide what it most important for you. For some people, they value the vision of the community enough to deal with the drama. You will certainly be forced to work on your communication and conflict-resolution skills if nothing else.

Co-housing will likely be the least intense of everything on that list. It's relatively normal living compared to ecovillages, intentional communities and communes. The latter can get very, very extreme depending on which one you join. Hostels aren't really intentional communities, they're more like hotels where people sleep in the same space.

 

[Tyler Robinson]

@Ethan1 you're daydreaming. Retreat costs are exponentially higher than your monthly rent. High end retreats. Owning a home is a stable financial decision. 

What happens when you are in the hospital or in another city and somebody comes and occupies your silly tent. How do you provide a stable roof for your kids? 

Heck even in privately owned apartments, there are robberies, home invasions and frequent breakins. That's why people own guns, security Alarms and live in gated townships. 

Housing comes with taxes, records, documents of ownership, signatures, court stamps and notarized papers. It's no joke. It also comes with insurance if you have enough money. Does a tent come with an insurance? 

Most people pay rent because they can't afford owning a home. Even in leased apartments, there's a system for electricity and plumbing and house repairs, most of the costs are borne by the landlord and that's why tenants rely on the landlord, they aren't paying rent for nothing. If anything happens, it's the landlord's responsibility, including security.

A home is not just a home, it's also a secure place. You have a house alarm, an address that law enforcement can visit if you need help, it's made concrete and solid so nobody can simply bulldoze it at will.

Even the government cannot snatch it from you if you legally own it. 

What you're suggesting is fine for single Bachelors or vagabonds who are used to living out of cars and suitcases. 

But once you have a small/large family (even a bare minimum of 3 family members), you gotta have a stable roof, a proof of legal ownership, constant proper supply of gas, water, electricity and access to basic utilities in the middle of a city. 

Renting is already complicated enough with renters, roommates, tenants, landlords often getting into huge fights over the pettiest of issues. And you're talking about shared housing? You really imagine that people won't fight ever? 

You will need to bring together Eckhart Tolle's followers if you want to create a zero fight zone. Because most humans aren't that high consciousness to maintain this ultra idealistic level of harmony you're fantasizing. 

Your idea is  (its idealistically beautiful) not suitable or sustainable in the long term because you can't create enough autonomy in a commune no matter whatever benefits you ascribe to it in the sense of cheaper costs and shared living. It's based on this fantasy that humans are okay not having absolute autonomy. 

If you carried out a survey and asked most people about their housing aspirations, the most likely answer would be - a huge bachelor pad in the middle of California or by the beach. 

People want something big that they can flaunt or boast about to their friends and a tent in an Eco village is not one of those things. 

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Tyler Robinson]

I have a 24/7 security at my house so zero break-Ins. 

Two years ago I lived in a hostel. You know what happened? A robbery.

The housekeeping couple living with the owner broke into my locked room(when I was at the gym) and stole my blender, a phone charger, stuff from my backpack and 3 pairs of brand new  expensive stilettos (each worth $160). I had bought them for my birthday just a week before they were stolen (the first time I got myself heels) and had never used them. It  made me so mad, I immediately left that place. 

 

This is what happens in shared housing. Even my doormat was stolen by the girl who was sharing the house with me and she would constantly act clueless when asked about it. I was at the end of my rope dealing with such people shamelessly stealing all my stuff.. 

I have severe social anxiety so I don't go around knocking on people's doors asking them to return back my stolen stuff. Neither did I file a police report because I just didn't want to deal with the mess and drama.. I was too anxious.. I simply cannot survive in groups of people - they will prey on me and eat me up.. And I'm non confrontational and autistic. I just choose to not stand up for myself which makes it easier for most people to prey on me and get away with it. I don't confront most of the time. But this attitude can seriously cost me if I were to live in a commune. Most people will figure me out right away and start acting nasty with me knowing fully they will get away with it. 

That's why living with people needs some real big balls and the ability to socialize and influence, which I apparently lack because of my autism. 

Now you get the idea why people want a stable owned home? 

Now I live in a high end place with a privately owned home and security so no robberies since moving into my new home 

 

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Yarco]

I don't have any firsthand experience, but I've probably watched a couple dozen documentaries and series about various communes, intentional communities, etc. and done a lot of research into the topic.

Vice has a good series called Jungletown that shows what a shitshow it would be if you take a bunch of entitled millennials / zoomers and try to create an intentional community without proper planning. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZ_hwG6UuEJbYREwJlwycajHP7dDU_9Ue

Slab City is also a good cautionary tale for what I would want to avoid.

I have seen a few communes that genuinely seem like good, harmonious places to live. But they're the minority. Most are full of drama, cult of personality, and domineering leaders acting all passive-aggressive while people live in fear.

The best ones I've seen are co-housing situations where multiple families of relatively normal people with actual jobs just live together and share their income, with rotating chore lists etc so it basically just operates like a big family -- it's when you add in a bunch of artistic spiritual types who refuse to work or contribute financially, and all the sexual dynamics of young people, that things start to go off the rails. 

This is one of the healthiest examples I've seen:

Ever since I watched Zeitgeist Addendum over a decade ago and saw what Jacques Fresco was trying to do with The Venus Project, I've been interested in the idea of creating that kind of community.

I think you could do it, but you have to be absolutely meticulous about planning it out, thinking of everything that could possibly go wrong. You'd need the right kind of people. Like one engineer, one doctor, one mechanic type person that can fix anything, one farmer to oversee all food production. You'd need some kind of charter or constitution and a shared set of goals and principles. Basically think of everything you'd need to have a bunch of people go and live on Mars sustainably.

It wouldn't be that hard or expensive. I was looking at places across Canada on Realtor.com yesterday and found several places with 100+ acres and a decent fixer-upper house on it for like $250,000. Get 10 people to chip in $10k each to cover half the cost and they can be the shareholders/board of directors that have the final say and steer how the community develops, and then have people able to come for free with less rights and responsibilities. Then create some type of business that everyone works at a few hours per week to cover the mortgage and all other costs of the community.

If I did create such a community myself, I 100% would be explicitly running it as a cult with myself in an authoritarian position. I need to have the final ultimate say. If I put all the effort in to creating a community, I would want it to work the  way that I want, without people undermining or bringing drama and ruining everything I planned and worked so hard for. People can join if they think I could provide a better life and community for them than they could on their own. Otherwise they are free to try and make their own 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Yarco

[Ethan1]

Yes, I recognize there's going to be rules, guidelines, restrictions, covenants, building codes, bylaws, constitutions etc.

I recognize the responsibilities. 

Depends on the quality of people. Some people are easier to work with and some are more difficult. Even in the military I had a roommate that stole my debit card which he did the same thing with acting oblivious. Which this ended in a dishonorable discharge. I mean, even within an organization with the max number of strict rules, you can't stop people from doing something that causes problems. For him, stealing was a compulsive habit that he learned. Took him stealing from me twice to end it. Does that mean it's a flawed system. No, problems are a fact of life. It depends on how the structure is built and the quality of the system to the degree of the problems. If people are given their needs, treated with respect, and allowed to speak what's on their chest without being contradicted or shut down it's less likely people will resort to manipulation. If we're talking about a personality disorder, then that's an entirely different discussion.

@Tyler Robinson  I recognize that you have some really good points, yet it comes across as playing devil's advocate. Playing devil's advocate isn't all that bad for intellectual growth, however, it can also be a little disruptive/competitive. Seems like you desire more of a debate rather than a discussion. Personally, I don't mind a healthy debate and pointing out mistakes on both sides. I'll admit if something seems flawed or unrealistic. However, derailing a discussion seems a bit more reaction seeking or attention. No desire for a zero-sum game. I was mostly curious on direct experience from those that have lived in such places or owned/managed one. 

I guess I will have to go on a forum that focuses on such groups to get a clear picture of what's possible. I'm just tired of sitting back. I want to create some drastic change. My main intention behind this topic is about finding community and a sense of belonging. Being on this site gives some sense of that for intellectual stimulation but still it's not the real deal. I spent the past two years traveling around the country living off-grid and going place to place to get a feel for what's out there. Most Americans live to their selves with social exclusivity. Literally traveled about 20 states. Even going from town-to-town people are pretty closed off. A bit unreceptive/disconnected/preoccupied. Only been a handful of places where people lead with a sense of inclusivity/openness/attentiveness. Kind of rare to find because of how stifled most people are these days. 

@Yarco I watched the first link on Vice you sent. I see what you're saying, seems like a great deal of idealistic thinking vs practicality.  Especially how she mentioned this at 10:00. It is kind of funny watching the idealistic bubbles being popped. I mean, even that cat eating the national butterfly (23:14) seemed a bit symbolic for the whole video. I'm sure that's the main theme they were aiming to frame it as. Considering the title of the video. Overall, they make some good points.

2nd video I thought it was funny the two kids saying it was funner having more people.

Right now with the RV I have pretty much all my needs ready. Solar/generators/shore power/Gas & electric powered fridge/ Gas & electric water heater. I've camped at locations near rivers and built a pump system to allow for living without city water connection. The main problems has been with food management, water, and weather. When I was in the Rocky Mountains there was about 4 feet of snow at times. This creates difficulties with the amount of watt hours an oil radiator heater & floor heater puts out not being grid tied. Powering 1500 watts continuously. Now I've setup with lithium batteries & 2000-watt inverter 40 A MPPT controller & 400 watts solar. So technically I have the flexibility with being tied into a community and leaving if I see things not working out. I'd go put the RV in storage for like $70 month and work at a hostel to meet people. With people that have this option then I could see caravans working together as intentional communities. Leaving the person room to leave as they choose. Truly all I need is a bed to sleep in & a place to store food. Finding a community is the difficult part because people are locked to rents & fixed to one location.

Edited October 4, 2022 by Ethan1