Women won't admit they dont know what they want with equality

[Ulax]

20 minutes ago, Tron said:

I mean I was drunk so maybe you're onto something. But I think any guy in my position would think shes on some dumb shit. Maybe not all would have felt an injustice or anger to my extent. 

Sure man. Sounds like you're pretty assured that any guy would have thought she was acting stupidly but may have had a different level of response.

As a side note, I think its important for me to note that I'm not intending to communicate that you were wrong to react, or feel the way you did. Or that another guy's potential reaction is better.

I can tell you my perspective about what is at the cause of why you felt dehumanised. Would you like that?

 

[Tron]

1 minute ago, thepixelmonk said:

With that level of mental gymnastics, you're certainly a pro.

bruh you're a punk to me. get outta my thread lil boi 

[Tron]

5 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Sure man. Sounds like you're pretty assured that any guy would have thought she was acting stupidly but may have had a different level of response.

As a side note, I think its important for me to note that I'm not intending to communicate that you were wrong to react, or feel the way you did. Or that another guy's potential reaction is better.

I can tell you my perspective about what is at the cause of why you felt dehumanised. Would you like that?

 

sure go for it. I know I got issues and past traumas and whatever. Definitely working on it, but that "woman power" bs wont help anyone

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tron

[Ulax]

15 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

That's okay. But don't try to change how he feels or tell him to feel a certain way. Not a right thing to do. He is entitled to how he feels. Just offer him a perspective but also sympathize with how he feels. Is that okay? 

 

 

As I read your comment, I felt frustrated because my desire to be understood isn't met. 

I'm not intending to communicate an invalidation of feelings or that someone's feelings are wrong. I understand you have a different perspective on that which you seem confident in.

I would like to maintain harmony between us. A solution could be for you to contact a moderator, or report my posts as a means of getting a third party to decide whether my comments are inappropriate.

[thepixelmonk]

21 minutes ago, Tron said:

bruh you're a punk to me. get outta my thread lil boi 

LOL no thx "lil boi"

Edited October 4, 2022 by thepixelmonk

[Tyler Robinson]

13 minutes ago, Ulax said:

I would like to maintain harmony between us. A solution could be for you to contact a moderator, or report my posts as a means of getting a third party to decide whether my comments are inappropriate.

Just suggesting you something is so bad? You mean to say that you cannot even accept a simple suggestion. I only requested you to not tell him to not feel the way he feels. That was just a simple request. I'll leave it here. I'm not interested in targeting you or making you feel inappropriate. No I never said that. I was just cautioning you. Maybe take a chill pill. I'm all for harmony always. Please take my suggestion instead of ignoring me. I meant everything for good reasons. Don't assume that I'm blaming you, just pointing out something that you did that you could slightly change a bit. I hope you can be criticized and you don't make big out of little corrections people make of you. If you feel so bad about my comment, I'll leave it here and won't reply anymore. Go ahead. 

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Tron]

1 minute ago, Tyler Robinson said:

Just suggesting you something is so bad? You mean to say that you cannot even accept a simple suggestion. I only requested you to not tell him to not feel the way he feels. That was just a simple request. I'll leave it here. I'm not interested in targeting you or making you feel inappropriate. No I never said that. I was just cautioning you. Maybe take a chill pill. I'm all for harmony always. Please take my suggestion instead of ignoring me. I meant everything for good reasons. Don't assume that I'm blaming you, just pointing out something that you did that you could slightly change a bit. I hope you can be criticized and you don't make big out of little corrections people make of you. 

I appreciate you having my back. Thank you for your time and understanding

[Ulax]

7 minutes ago, Tron said:

sure go for it. I know I got issues and past traumas and whatever. Definitely working on it, but that "woman power" bs wont help anyone

@Tron Okay sure.

So my perspective is that every emotion we feel is an expression of a need. If we feel a positive emotion, then that is a result of a need having been met. If we feel a negative emotion, then that is a result of a need not being met. Further, all communications are an expression of a need as well; either its a result of a need being met or a need not being met. Actually everything we do is an expression of a need.

Every person has the same set of needs. However, given our life experiences and biology we all develop different strategies for meeting our needs.

So, through the lens of my perspective, it may have been that the lady, in saying what she said from the car to you, was trying to meet their need for significance, i.e. that she mattered. Maybe when she was young she learnt that the only way she could reliably meet her need to matter was by adopting the strategy of telling other people what to do.

And, perhaps for you when you heard what that lady said to you, you felt dehumanised because your need for acceptance switched from being met to being unmet. Perhaps, when you were young a parental figure told you what to do in a similar kind of tone to that woman, and you believed they didn't accept you in that moment. So, you unconsciously learnt that when people talked to you in that way, that you were not acceptable.

Returning to the idea of the person of the similar age to you in the same circumstance having a different reaction. That person may have felt compassion instead because they had a different life experience or biology. Perhaps, a parental figure never spoke to them in that tone, and they always felt accepted no matter what. Hence when the women speaks to them from the car there need to be accepted is still met. Hence, they instead guess at an understanding that the lady speaking from the car is trying desperately to meet a need to matter. And with that, the person meets a need for understanding which evokes the positive feeling of compassion.

The above are all guesswork from me. What I'm trying to communicate is less about the exact need that is at play. Instead I want to communicate the idea that when trying to understand why people act in certain ways, its less important to think about what they say, and instead think about what need is being expressed.

For example, when a person says, 'women power' in a jubilant and excited manner, its not really because of something inherent to 'women power'. Instead it is an example of people meeting a need. So, its really a celebration of survival.

Hence, from my perspective, nothing is actually ever said that is personal towards someone else.

Does this all make sense to you? I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it.

----------------------

If you want me to recommend a book, that provides a more in-depth understanding of this perspective, I can do so to. Would you like that?

[Tron]

12 minutes ago, Ulax said:

@Tron Okay sure.

So my perspective is that every emotion we feel is an expression of a need. If we feel a positive emotion, then that is a result of a need having been met. If we feel a negative emotion, then that is a result of a need not being met. Further, all communications are an expression of a need as well; either its a result of a need being met or a need not being met. Actually everything we do is an expression of a need.

Every person has the same set of needs. However, given our life experiences and biology we all develop different strategies for meeting our needs.

So, through the lens of my perspective, it may have been that the lady, in saying what she said from the car to you, was trying to meet their need for significance, i.e. that she mattered. Maybe when she was young she learnt that the only way she could reliably meet her need to matter was by adopting the strategy of telling other people what to do.

And, perhaps for you when you heard what that lady said to you, you felt dehumanised because your need for acceptance switched from being met to being unmet. Perhaps, when you were young a parental figure told you what to do in a similar kind of tone to that woman, and you believed they didn't accept you in that moment. So, you unconsciously learnt that when people talked to you in that way, that you were not acceptable.

Returning to the idea of the person of the similar age to you in the same circumstance having a different reaction. That person may have felt compassion instead because they had a different life experience or biology. Perhaps, a parental figure never spoke to them in that tone, and they always felt accepted no matter what. Hence when the women speaks to them from the car there need to be accepted is still met. Hence, they instead guess at an understanding that the lady speaking from the car is trying desperately to meet a need to matter. And with that, the person meets a need for understanding which evokes the positive feeling of compassion.

The above are all guesswork from me. What I'm trying to communicate is less about the exact need that is at play. Instead I want to communicate the idea that when trying to understand why people act in certain ways, its less important to think about what they say, and instead think about what need is being expressed.

For example, when a person says, 'women power' in a jubilant and excited manner, its not really because of something inherent to 'women power'. Instead it is an example of people meeting a need. So, its really a celebration of survival.

Hence, from my perspective, nothing is actually ever said that is personal towards someone else.

Does this all make sense to you? I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it.

----------------------

If you want me to recommend a book, that provides a more in-depth understanding of this perspective, I can do so to. Would you like that?

that all seems entirely plausible. I know from my higher perspective that she is obviously coming from a place of insecurity or a need to feel self righteous. And yeah, the feeling unacceptable when someone comes at me like that is entirely plausible to. My dad was really hard on me as a kid, but ironically didnt really look out for me very well. So I have established this nature of being tough and not wanting people to fuck with me. And it especially made me mad regarding that certain topic. Because as we established previously, I have my criticisms towards the women equality movement. 

But I come at guys even worse. Every job ive ever worked there was some old dude who wasnt my superior, yet theyd try to son me like I was a child, and I would come at them hard. Get in their face and tell them like it is. Maybe these things all share a common root. 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tron

[Ulax]

16 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

Just suggesting you something is so bad? You mean to say that you cannot even accept a simple suggestion. I only requested you to not tell him to not feel the way he feels. That was just a simple request. I'll leave it here. I'm not interested in targeting you or making you feel inappropriate. No I never said that. I was just cautioning you. Maybe take a chill pill. I'm all for harmony always. Please take my suggestion instead of ignoring me. I meant everything for good reasons. Don't assume that I'm blaming you, just pointing out something that you did that you could slightly change a bit. I hope you can be criticized and you don't make big out of little corrections people make of you. If you feel so bad about my comment, I'll leave it here and won't reply anymore. Go ahead. 

 

I'm picking up that you wanted more consideration of your views. Also, that you want better understanding of your views and the positive intentions you believe are behind them. Partly also because you believe that I saw your suggestion as bad, even though you were only trying to help through voicing the suggestion. Is that right?

From my perspective, I was being sincere when I said contacting a moderator could be a useful solution regarding whether my comment is inappropriate. As maybe I am mistaken in thinking that I have communicated in a a respectful manner. I thought my suggestion of a moderation could be a harmonious way of resolving our different perspectives in a way that meant both of our views were considered in an equal and fair way.

Also, reflecting on when you made your request, I didn't feel hostile after seeing it. I think its important to ensure that people are held accountable for the way they comment, and I don't think I'm an exception to that. Instead, I felt worried that I had indeed written in a way that could be classed as gaslighting. Its just that upon checking what I wrote I don't think it could be classed as gaslight.

Does this make sense to you?

[Ulax]

16 minutes ago, Tron said:

that all seems entirely plausible. I know from my higher perspective that she is obviously coming from a place of insecurity or a need to feel self righteous. And yeah, the feeling unacceptable when someone comes at me like that is entirely plausible to. My dad was really hard on me as a kid, but ironically didnt really look out for me very well. So I have established this nature of being tough and not wanting people to fuck with me. And it especially made me mad regarding that certain topic. Because as we established previously, I have my criticisms towards the women equality movement. 

But I come at guys even worse. Every job ive ever worked there was some old dude who wasnt my superior, yet theyd try to son me like I was a child, and I would come at them hard. Get in their face and tell them like it is. Maybe these things all share a common root. 

Sure thing dude.

I'll end my side of the discussion here. I enjoyed talking with you.

[Tron]

3 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Sure thing dude.

I'll end my side of the discussion here. I enjoyed talking with you.

you as well. Thanks for listening! 

[Ulax]

@Tron You're welcome

[Tyler Robinson]

18 minutes ago, Ulax said:

I'm picking up that you wanted more consideration of your views. Also, that you want better understanding of your views and the positive intentions you believe are behind them. Partly also because you believe that I saw your suggestion as bad, even though you were only trying to help through voicing the suggestion. Is that right?

From my perspective, I was being sincere when I said contacting a moderator could be a useful solution regarding whether my comment is inappropriate. As maybe I am mistaken in thinking that I have communicated in a a respectful manner. I thought my suggestion of a moderation could be a harmonious way of resolving our different perspectives in a way that meant both of our views were considered in an equal and fair way.

Also, reflecting on when you made your request, I didn't feel hostile after seeing it. I think its important to ensure that people are held accountable for the way they comment, and I don't think I'm an exception to that. Instead, I felt worried that I had indeed written in a way that could be classed as gaslighting. Its just that upon checking what I wrote I don't think it could be classed as gaslight.

Does this make sense to you?

Now we're arguing like husband and wife. Can a wife ever tell you that there's something wrong with your perspective? Or are you always the right one? 

Your conversation with me reads like this - 

Wife says - Mr Husband should slightly change the way he says and I make a suggestion that he includes my request and understands that what he says appears a bit invalidating of my feelings. Like he is trying to say that maybe I'm wrong when I know I felt what I felt 

Husband says - Miss Wife, If you think I'm wrong, we should take this to divorce court and let them decide if I was wrong. Only then I'll hear your suggestion. 

Wife says - Do you ever listen? 

................................................. 

 

Impossible! It's impossible to tell you something because you always want a third party to decide things. And what if the third party wasn't able to judge it right. Why be so sure? 

If I genuinely felt your comments were harmful I would have reported them. I was telling you that telling others that they can feel a different way can sometimes come across as a manipulative tactic.

You could have easily replied - "yes I understand what you mean and I'll take care of it and not suggest him anything opposite of what he feels and make sure that he doesn't feel like his feelings aren't valid meanwhile also explaining him my perspective." 

Try taking my comments non judgementally next time. You have your own trauma to work on. 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Loba]

6 hours ago, Tron said:

The way women approach this shit is dumb. lay out some ground rules for what the fuck you want 

"Come here."
"Wait, no... go away."
"Wait, I changed my mind."
"No... wait, you know what never mind."

I don't know what to tell you... I'm an easily solved mystery, even to myself.  I don't know what I want, but I do know what I don't want - so that whittles it down somewhat, yeah.
I want kindness, understanding and also just to be left alone for the most part.  I think I wanna be dead, on some level.  Ever since I was a wee little girl, I always knew I deserved to be dead.

In all seriousness, though.  I don't know what to tell you - seems from my end that you're stressing over the small stuff.

[Tyler Robinson]

30 minutes ago, Ulax said:

From my perspective, I was being sincere when I said contacting a moderator could be a useful solution regarding whether my comment is inappropriate. As maybe I am mistaken in thinking that I have communicated in a a respectful manner. I thought my suggestion of a moderation could be a harmonious way of resolving our different perspectives in a way that meant both of our views were considered in an equal and fair way.

And I was being sincere in letting you know that invalidating others feelings can come across as manipulative. I meant no harm to you. I was only suggesting you. That's the only respectful way I could have taken. Did I ever signal any disrespect to you, then show me? 

Quote

Also, reflecting on when you made your request, I didn't feel hostile after seeing it. I think its important to ensure that people are held accountable for the way they comment, and I don't think I'm an exception to that. Instead, I felt worried that I had indeed written in a way that could be classed as gaslighting. Its just that upon checking what I wrote I don't think it could be classed as gaslight.

But you took it hostile at least initially? You're suggesting that someone else on the same thread should show compassion to a comment that was dehumanizing to them. 

Yet in the same breath you can't show compassion to me? You immediately judged me and took my comment in a hostile way and then when I tried to explain you a bit more, you realized that it wasn't as hostile as it initially seemed. 

That means it was only a shift in your perspective. 

Maybe you judged me as hostile, because your parent probably communicated you in ways that has made you think that anyone who criticizes you in a straightforward way is being hostile to you? 

If you healed from your trauma completely, you probably would have seen my comment in a more compassionate manner and realized that I was telling you something about invalidation a behavior we sometimes unconsciously engage in without ill intent. 

I don't think I got compassion from you though. 

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Ulax]

@Tyler Robinson I'm feeling worn out, and I don't understand how to bring a sense of ease and amicability to our communications.

So, I'm going to end my side of the discussion here.

[Tyler Robinson]

@Ulax thanks a ton. I'm ending it too.. 

[Proserpina]

Feminine is complex, bordering on mystical.  We aren’t cut and dry like guys.  We can sense multiple layers in the situation intuitively and our feelings reflect that.  When we deny our feelings, it can feel like we are denying a vital aspect of ourselves and what we have to offer.  Also you’re dealing with the collective female painbody.  

Edited October 4, 2022 by Proserpina

[RMQualtrough]

12 hours ago, Ulax said:

@Tyler Robinson I'm feeling worn out, and I don't understand how to bring a sense of ease and amicability to our communications.

So, I'm going to end my side of the discussion here.