"How do I deal with family?" - Shunyamurti

[puporing]

Some answers from Shunya that may be of some guidance if you are still balancing this aspect:

1:00:16 - 1:08: -

 

[Oeaohoo]

Thank you for my “warning points”. I only make things personal when they are personal: so much spiritual teaching is just personal beliefs and values masquerading as absolute truths. For example, you just want a nice cosy and safe spirituality, listening to Matt Kahn and Shunyamurti talk about “love” and how “beautiful” everything is. I used to listen to Shunyamurti but this is precisely why I stopped: he is leading a feminised communal cult of banal and sterile conformity.

I practice a spirituality of transcendent destruction. As an example, here is a parody of your “Great Sage” Shunyamurti:

A Wisdom Teaching from A Great Sage

It’s a great joy, and certainly not a great jouissance, to be typing this today.

A Sat Yogi is one who sits in the past. As the great sages - and remember, to be a sage is to see-ages - tell us, the good days are over.

I think the religions call this state “fallenness”: one is no longer willing to open one’s heart to love, to live on fifteen carrots a day, to donate one’s soul to the community…

But there is hope: once one has realised the futility of life in the ego, gone through the zero point and turned it into a hero point, the Sat Yoga Institute will be ready to welcome you with open arms. 

Of course, I don’t really need to be telling you any of this: if you wanted to you could download your own hodgepodge of psychoanalytic conundrums and new-age messianism, but your consciousness is choosing to project itself onto a guru-figure who can give you the answers that you already have.

…but you don’t want answers, do you? You want jouissance. Well *puts on funny hat*, “you can’t always get what you want, but if you try some times, you’ll find — you get what you need!”

May we save the universe from our cosy, rich Costa Rica ashram, collapse the quantum wave function and re-dream the energy field - w i t h o u t… d e l a y…

Namaste

P.S. “Thank you Shunya, that was such a beautiful teaching; you always say just what I needed to hear. I know you have a new book and retreat coming out soon, could you tell us all some more about that?”

[puporing]

You're actually projecting all this stuff onto me. But thank you for reminding me how projection works and how endless it can be.

I did not share this clip because I didn't know the answers from within, but because I wanted to share this perspective with the forum as it is a common kind of question that come up, through Shunya's voice/video.

No hard feelings, I think you could do a lot better with how you expressed yourself to others, and seems like you're already doing a better job. 

Edited October 12, 2022 by puporing

[Oeaohoo]

33 minutes ago, puporing said:

You're actually projecting all this stuff onto me. But thank you for reminding me how projection works and how endless it can be.

I generally find that “projection” is just a label used to deflect unwanted criticism. It also brings with it the assumption that we all live in our own private fantasy bubbles and that there is no even relative reality to things. It implies that the only reason anybody could take issue with somebody else is because they are projecting their own issues or “complexes” onto them. In truth, there are many other reasons why two people can fail to relate to each other.

If I am projecting onto you, I am projecting my anger at living under a smothering gynocratic tyranny… But only because you have demonstrated yourself as an appropriate target! I would also like to say that the path of the warrior, which of course is completely misunderstood and mocked today, generally involves projection: one projects the inner enemy (the soul commanding to evil) outwards so that, in fighting it outwardly, one can fight it inwardly. There is nothing wrong with this so long as you are conscious that you are doing it.

I think there’s a lot more that could be said about projection. Taking your view of spirituality to its conclusion, aren’t we always projecting anyway? You are just God projecting yourself outwards onto another character, who just happens to be projecting onto you through a forum!

34 minutes ago, puporing said:

I did not share this clip because I didn't know the answers from within, but because I wanted to share this perspective with the forum as it is a common kind of question that come up, through Shunya's voice/video.

No hard feelings, I think you could do a lot better with how you expressed yourself to others, and seems like you're already doing a better job. 

I understand. My parody of Shunyamurti is regarding his teachings in general.

No hard feelings either.

[puporing]

Am I the one deflecting criticism or perhaps you are? There's a baseline standard to participating on this forum and I am simply tasked to maintain the bare minimum standard. This is not a free-for-all kind of place. But differing views and feedback are allowed when expressed with respect, there's no need for name-calling and such to make your point, people will actually take you more seriously. If that standard is against your values then perhaps this place is not the best for you, but I have faith in you. Notice how your mind is constructing all these justifications to try to get out of taking some basic responsibility to how you wrote in the seperate post.

Edited October 12, 2022 by puporing

[Oeaohoo]

7 minutes ago, puporing said:

Notice how your mind is constructing all these justifications to try to weasel out of taking some basic responsibility.

I’m just offering my perspective. I find that the notion of “projection” is thrown around a lot in spiritual communities without a lot of thought having gone into what it really means, or indeed where the term comes from (the dubious motivations of Freudian psychoanalysis). You aren’t interested in discussing this subject, either because you don’t want to waste your time on me - which is completely understandable, I don’t really want to waste my time on you either - or because you believe that such a discussion could only be falling into “the mind”, which is just typical New-Age brain rot masquerading as spiritual attainment. My sense is that in appealing to “projection” and “the mind playing tricks”, you’re just parroting spiritual platitudes whose real purpose is to keep you exactly as you already are.

[puporing]

I am not simply parroting, perhaps it is a convenient way for you to label it as such to invalidate what I'm saying. 

[Oeaohoo]

Just now, puporing said:

I am not simply parroting, perhaps it is a convenient way for you to label it as such to invalidate what I'm saying. 

You invalidate what I say by calling it “projection”; I invalidate what you say by calling it “deflection”. What’s the difference? This is the problem with reducing everything to psychoanalytic mind games; something Shubowmurti incidentally loves to do…

You say projection, I say deflection - let’s call the whole thing off! 

As to the main point, I’ll be less rude on this forum. I just like to provoke people into considering a different perspective on things which they think they understand. The more someone is convinced they already understand, the more provocative one has to be!

[puporing]

I choose not to argue with you out of love, maybe one day you'll understand. 

I am not unaware of some of the things you say, I just don't say them out of love, but it doesn't mean you can't express yourself or the fact you're saying them also out of love.

Shunyamurti is me, Matt Kahn is me, Leo is me, Eckhart Tolle is me, and when I share them I am simply expressing myself through what has already been incorporated as Self, no substantial difference than you making a post/reply. One day you'll understand.

I know you want to be heard, and I am impressed by your way of words and passion when not taking into account the medium. Thanks for agreeing to the adjustment which takes away a bit of your self-expression.

Edited October 12, 2022 by puporing

[Oeaohoo]

1 minute ago, puporing said:

I choose not to argue with you out of love, maybe one day you'll understand.

Fair enough. My only question is: How versatile is your Love if it can’t tolerate a bit of hate?

3 minutes ago, puporing said:

Shunyamurti is me, Matt Kahn is me, Leo is me, Eckhart Tolle is me, and when I share them I am simply expressing myself through what has already been said. One day you'll understand.

I am not arguing with you here, just responding with my own perspective, but to me it is just the opposite. None of them are me. Not even I as a human am me. I don’t believe (“believe” originally simply meant “to hold dear”) in a pantheistic conception of God because the Absolute is beyond all forms. This is another reason for my polemical effacement of others and my own private self-effacement.

[puporing]

10 minutes ago, Oeaohoo said:

Fair enough. My only question is: How versatile is your Love if it can’t tolerate a bit of hate?

Well you think I don't for some reason.  

There lies a contradiction with Consciousness that needs to simultaneously love what is/where it had come from and love what it evolves itself into.

10 minutes ago, Oeaohoo said:

I am not arguing with you here, just responding with my own perspective, but to me it is just the opposite. None of them are me. Not even I as a human am me. I don’t believe (“believe” originally simply meant “to hold dear”) in a pantheistic conception of God because the Absolute is beyond all forms. This is another reason for my polemical effacement of others and my own private self-effacement.

That's fair. You should find out the truth for yourself, if that is an interest of yours, and it is a life long pursuit. 

Edited October 12, 2022 by puporing

[Oeaohoo]

1 minute ago, puporing said:

That's fair. You should find out the truth for yourself, if that is an interest of yours, and it is a life long pursuit. 

(Again, not arguing!) I don’t see it as a process of finding out the truth so much as shedding all attachments to anything other than the truth. The truth is staring us all in the face; we just all have our reasons for not wanting to see it… 

[Arthogaan]

Great part of the video. Answers are obvious really but always comforting to hear them in a concise way. Reassuring. Thank you.

[puporing]

4 hours ago, Arthogaan said:

Great part of the video. Answers are obvious really but always comforting to hear them in a concise way. Reassuring. Thank you.

I'm glad you can find those answers. And you're very welcome.