Leo wronglysaying socializing makes you dumber and less intellectual jobs are easier?

[Carl-Richard]

4 hours ago, Optimized Life said:

1 of the dumbest things he's said yet, socializing engages the brain & lack of it makes you dumb in practical life just like not learning to count, read or write or hear would dampen your competence in navigating life.

A bare amount is beneficial for things like mental health or even physical health, but we're talking about a quantitative trade-off: the less time you spend socializing, the more time you can spend thinking, meditating or improving yourself.

Edited September 6, 2022 by Carl-Richard

[sholomar]

I believe a balance is necessary. For super quiet people they need more socialization and for hyper-extroverts they could stand to have less.  Small talk is really an essential skill to have for a happy life let's be honest here.  We can all pretend we're truly at peace in an introverted bubble but the vast majority of people are not ... takes a lot of work to get to a state where you can be completely happy independent of external circumstances. And we are social creatures our DNA as wired to want to interact and fit into the herd.

If we don't feel like we're part of a herd our biology tends to feel depressed. Cultivating the sense of oneness is merely facilitating the release of oxytocin that comes along with pack oriented behavior and the feeling of fitting in which comes along with social connections. To me spiritual development is simply another way to facilitate the release of oxytocin in the brain. All activity in this physical matrix comes down to pleasure seeking and pain avoidance behaviors. Personal development hacks the limbic system to eliminate the sympathetic fear response and cultivate a profound sense of peace of mind in the process.

Woujo have some good content about what drives men's behavior...

https://www.woujo.com/blog/2019/12/5/the-purpose-series-part-1-of-3-purpose-anxiety-fear-the-unknown-and-the-purposeless-epidemic-in-modern-society

In any case you can learn a lot from simply listening to the perspectives of other people. Becoming a good listener is the best way to facilitating personal growth in my opinion... And listening in a non-judgmental manner with no intention of trying to fix another person's problems. I see people who use personal development as a crutch to compensate for their lack of people skills, myself included.

Edited September 7, 2022 by sholomar

[Proserpina]

Spiritual development actually increases extroversion statistically  in the big 5, along with most other traits. I think, ideally, developed people have extroversion along with most other traits in the big 5.

Edited September 7, 2022 by Proserpina

[Optimized Life]

13 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

A bare amount is beneficial for things like mental health or even physical health, but we're talking about a quantitative trade-off: the less time you spend socializing, the more time you can spend thinking, meditating or improving yourself.

It's not black and white. 

There's more to life than just improving yourself or being lost in thinking. 

Socialization is 1 of the best ways to improve yourself, and to at least be happy and enjoy life as a shared connected intimate experience vs being a creepy introvert. 

Meditation you can do for 10 - 30 minutes per day & get benefit from, I'm not gonna spend my life in solitude go fuck whoever if you promote that crap. 

You can learn think grow plan ect... via discussion. 

This whole talk is a waste of time & not a priority. 

It's a biased idea, biased to strong introverts like Leo. 

I would never trade places with Leo, I have zero envy of him & his life, I don't want his life so fuck this place anyway. 

He is valuable in specific segments but I wouldn't take life advice from him or most people, I decide how I live my life it's unique to everyone, hence WHY THESE DISCUSSIONS ARE FUCKING STUPID & I HATE MOST OF SELF HELP LOOL.

This forum just sucks 90% of the time I've got to admit, so much waffling nonsense. 

Edited September 7, 2022 by Optimized Life

[LfcCharlie4]

@Optimized Life Lol this is true. 

I would bet good money 80% of members here don't have a grip on social / relationship skills, financial wellbeing, physical & mental health etc yet are spending their time debating in a Non-Dual echo chamber. 

Honestly majority of members here would benefit from traditional 'orange' practical self help that everyone loves to bash far more than spending time here & philosophizing Non-Duality 

 

[zurew]

21 minutes ago, Optimized Life said:

It's not black and white. 

There's more to life than just improving yourself or being lost in thinking. 

He explicitly pointed to the fact, that it is not black and white, and that it can be evaluated on a spectrum and that there will be a trade-off no matter what you do, but you have to be aware what that trade-off is.

21 minutes ago, Optimized Life said:

Socialization is 1 of the best ways to improve yourself, and to at least be happy and enjoy life as a shared connected intimate experience vs being a creepy introvert. 

Its you who are doing a black and white thing here. You don't have to socialize all the time in order to not to become a creepy introvert. You can acquire some necessary social skills and after that if you want to focus on self development and spirituality, then you can easily trade socialization for that (if you want to).

21 minutes ago, Optimized Life said:

Meditation you can do for 10 - 30 minutes per day & get benefit from, I'm not gonna spend my life in solitude go fuck whoever if you promote that crap. 

No one said that you have to, but you don't need to do socialization 5-10 hours a day either to get the necessary benefits from it - you can balance these things, based on what you prefer and what your goals are.

 

The simple idea is that if you want to get good or exceptional at something, you will need to spend more time doing that activity.

Edited September 7, 2022 by zurew

[LfcCharlie4]

Here's an idea- Do what suits your personality & enjoy. 

If you wanna become a social expert, go study it and have fun & enjoy socializing 

If you're naturally introverted, learn the basics and build a social life that makes you happy, maybe its a partner and literally 1 true friend, for others they love parties, gatherings, socializing etc 

Its not that deep, just like some people prefer playing sports, some people prefer making art 

Its your life, enjoy it, dunno why people put so much weight on what someone says 

 

[Proserpina]

This is a ridiculously touchy topic. 

Calm down. 

Everything is okay.

 It’s okay to have no social skills and be an incel.  You’re actually more likely to be cooler and attractive socially if you don’t give a fuck and are detached. 

Edited September 7, 2022 by Proserpina

[Nilsi]

I think we pretty much all agree that socializing is an essential part of being human and thus has to be properly integrated, if one wants to have a fulfilling human experience. Now Leo's point is not about having a fully integrated human experience, but rather about transcending it, in which case socialization becomes a liability. So it all depends on where you're actually at and what your goals are. I think Leo could and should communicate this more clearly, since most people are just trying to live a good life and assume that's what he's teaching (although he would probably argue that he does teach that and that's where I would slightly disagree lol).

Edited September 7, 2022 by Nilsi

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, LfcCharlie4 said:

 Its your life, enjoy it, dunno why people put so much weight on what someone says 

I'm so lost lol.

[Nilsi]

1 minute ago, Carl-Richard said:

I'm so lost lol.

What do you need help to make sense of?

[Carl-Richard]

2 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

What do you need help to make sense of?

We went from a descriptive discussion ("socialization takes time away from intellectual activities etc.") to a normative discussion ("what about just living life man?!") for some reason.

[Nilsi]

1 minute ago, Carl-Richard said:

We went from a descriptive discussion ("socialization takes time away from intellectual activities etc.") to a normative discussion ("what about just living life man?!") for some reason.

I see, I thought you were lost as to your own standpoint on this

Yeah, idk, "what about just living life man?!" is mostly where I tend to end up with these discussions

[Proserpina]

13 minutes ago, KH2 said:

Might be in the top 10 list of the stupidest things I've ever seen uttered by a woman. Or, at the very least, very close to grazing that list.

Why is it so terrible?

 Most of my pain and suffering in life has been in resisting that possibility. I remember when I embraced my ‘stupidity’ (lower density) then I really began to blossom.  My lower density nature. Before then I would beat myself up for it and appeared very attached.  I still have that issue.

 

Edited September 7, 2022 by Proserpina

[Nilsi]

7 minutes ago, Proserpina said:

Why is it so terrible?

 Most of my pain and suffering in life has been in resisting that possibility. I remember when I embraced my ‘stupidity’ (lower density) then I really began to blossom.  My lower density nature. Before then I would beat myself up for it and appeared very attached.  I still have that issue.

 

Nothing wrong with that. I believe working on opening oneself up to connect with others more is a great thing, but there is no need of course. I struggled with that as well and still do, but its a very rewarding endeavor. In the end we all just want love and connection, how you go about that doesn't really matter (you can of course skip the human as the middle man and go straight to the source).

[Proserpina]

32 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

Nothing wrong with that. I believe working on opening oneself up to connect with others more is a great thing, but there is no need of course. I struggled with that as well and still do, but its a very rewarding endeavor. In the end we all just want love and connection, how you go about that doesn't really matter (you can of course skip the human as the middle man and go straight to the source).

Thank you.  Being vulnerable and trying to connect with others is more important now than caring about my lower density, any stupidity or incelhood. That’s where the real blossoming occurs. When you can take the interaction that much higher from a detached place.

 

Edited September 7, 2022 by Proserpina

[Nilsi]

2 minutes ago, Proserpina said:

Thank you.  Being vulnerable and trying to connect with others is more important now than caring about my lower density, any stupidity or incelhood. That’s where the real blossoming occurs. When you can take the interaction that much higher.

 

I'm starting to realize that all I'm really looking for right now is connecting with "others" (call it myself if you want) on a deep level, as well. I'm way too self-absorbed currently to do that, but I'm trying to get there

[Proserpina]

4 hours ago, KH2 said:

But the suffering is there for a reason. Maybe we are supposed to suffer, and this idea of 24/7 childlike happiness in spite of all our circumstances and shortcommings, just seems like a childish fantasy to me. I can't be happy unless I'm proud of myself and my achievement - meaning, I'm successful at running away from my lower, unwanted self. Can't be happy in life unless you earn it.

Maybe.  But mostly I can’t help the things I was born with, largely genetic and a kind of disability; being lower density. I wouldn’t want a disabled person to suffer more than they had to. 

And there is pain and discomfort in the process of transmutation.  Suffering is still there, it’s just different.  Being vulnerable can be painful when you’d rather run away and hide for example.

Edited September 7, 2022 by Proserpina

[LfcCharlie4]

@Carl-Richard Haha

I do get it takes away from other pursuits, but to be honest, I think the average user on here from what I've seen could do with a LOT more real world time & experience, not less that's all 

And, of course different personalities require different amounts of socializing, I'm quite extroverted and always looking for the next event & social meet up, whereas, others may be more happy living an introverted point 

I guess it comes back to, it doesn't really matter as its your life just live

Also, while 'no others' is a fundamental absolute truth, it can be dangerous on a 'relative' level if not integrated with other realizations, 

I think one of the main reasons so many people struggled during covid & young people struggle in general is a lack of real human interaction, contact & connection, hence why I think its important people do at least learn to socialize, and then find the right social life for them 

[King Merk]