Every object is Absolute and exists Forever

[_Archangel_]

So, this is my first topic opener and for the occasion i thought about an insight  i'v never seen addressed in here (or if it has been  i didn't catch it):

Every object exist eternally and infinitly
Notice that whatever object is present in your experience (a physical object like a phone, an abstract idea, even a whole circumstance) will be present eternally and infinitly. You might say: "But i think of many things during the day and have different experiences!", actually, this is a level of delusion higher though.

Think of a unicorn. Soon you forget. Later, it seems to reappear if you think about it again, but actually, if you are perfectly present, you see that it is always there in your experience, and as is every thing else, even your frames of reference for saying that it wasn't.

You might object: "but i clearly had another thought 30 sec. ago! "<------------------now, this thought (in the istance you have it, which is Absolute aswell) became you new infinite and eternal object!, and so on for eternity
What we call memory is a particular experience that, in turn, exists Abosolutely and therefore doesn't have any correalation any other experience.
Decostructing memory is one of the keys to deconstructing reality.
You can notice this with all objects, and this what i mean when i say that every object is Absolute and exists Forever, you are just imagining they have links with each other (this aswell is another absolute thought-object)!
 
Penetrate enough this fact and you'll realize all products of coscousness are essencially the same because they are Absolute, literally. Diversity is an illusion.
This experiment points out that every bit experience, if investigated enough, loses its coordinates of time and space, and therefore its essence is revealed. Counterintuitively, after this further realization object don't stop being absolute and so they keep arising, conferming the rule


Contemplating this will shatter many illusions, expecially those stricky related to the belief in the concreteness of Space and Time.

Edited September 5, 2022 by _Archangel_

[Someone here]

If I hold a unicorn in my mind right now..it displays as a faint image. Then it fades into nothingness or my memory probably. So I don't get how abstract objects are eternal. They seem subject to time and change. 

[Razard86]

56 minutes ago, Someone here said:

If I hold a unicorn in my mind right now..it displays as a faint image. Then it fades into nothingness or my memory probably. So I don't get how abstract objects are eternal. They seem subject to time and change. 

You've only ever interacted with images. You think they are objects because you can TOUCH them. I keep telling you, you only experience yourself. When you touch an object...what are you feeling? What is feeling? Describe what is feeling? Where does it come from? What is it made of? Where does it go? Where does it arise?

All I have to do to make you think something is real is create a game when you touch a 3D object you will FEEL something. As long as I do it you will think it is REAL. If I removed all feelings, both physical and emotional you would have NO CONNECTIONS to the experience. The only reason you are not as immersed in a video game or movie is because you do not feel it physically. You can feel it emotionally so it can draw you in that way, but if they every draw you in physically THAT is when they get you.

So feelings are the reason why anything is REAL. Without feeling, everything is dead, and unreal. 

Ask yourself...why have you never experienced anything outside of you ever? When you touch a cup you feel it inside. You can NEVER feel something OUTSIDE. That's because there is NO outside. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCCzaz18imQ&ab_channel=Sadhguru

So if there is NO outside...then everything is YOU. You are alone and can only ever d experience YOURSELF. Touch someone's arm. Where do you feel it? INSIDE. Touch your arm. Notice...the touch feels similar and it arises the same and goes away the same.

When you REALLY notice this...you will realize that sex...is just masturbation. When I had sex for the first time and tested it out I realized....I was just masturbating. It was freaking hilarious. It takes away your entire draw to wanna have sex with women when there is basically no difference.

At this point you realize the REAL value from the relationship is the emotional connection. But anyway think about this...when you notice it...it may scare you. It did the opposite for me. Took me to nirvana.

Edited September 5, 2022 by Razard86

[Someone here]

3 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

You've only ever interacted with images. You think they are objects because you can TOUCH them. I keep telling you, you only experience yourself. When you touch an object...what are you feeling? What is feeling? Describe what is feeling? Where does it come from? What is it made of? Where does it go? Where does it arise?

All I have to do to make you think something is real is create a game when you touch a 3D object you will FEEL something. As long as I do it you will think it is REAL. If I removed all feelings, both physical and emotional you would have NO CONNECTIONS to the experience. The only reason you are not as immersed in a video game or movie is because you do not feel it physically. You can feel it emotionally so it can draw you in that way, but if they every draw you in physically THAT is when they get you.

So feelings are the reason why anything is REAL. Without feeling, everything is dead, and unreal. 

When I percive an object I don't contact it with my sense organs . Reality doesn't actually get percived by sense organs . For example sight ..you dont see objects with your eyes..you see them exactly where they are occurring (which is a distance from your eyes ).  The visual field occurs exactly where it is occurring and not in the eyes of the perceiver.  But it's a grand illusion that cannot be seem through easily.  

it is fundamentally impossible to be sure what is the ontological  truth of our experience/existence  because the laws of physics and EVERYTHING we can possibly observe or measure could be “Just how the universe works” or “The consequences of a simulation” .and there is no way, even in principle, to tell the difference.

You know that you exist, in whatever sense of existence; I can only assume that, but I shall so assume.

If the world is a simulation, you still know that you exist. Yes, it is a different category of existence than if this were the baseline unsimulated universe.

But since neither you nor I can tell the difference, it doesn’t matter.

 

[Osaid]

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

If I hold a unicorn in my mind right now..it displays as a faint image. Then it fades into nothingness or my memory probably. So I don't get how abstract objects are eternal. They seem subject to time and change. 

I think I get what OP is pointing to.

The present moment is absolute and eternal, so by consequence, anything experienced within that has to be absolute and eternal, even if you imagine it isn't.

Past is always perceived from now. You can't view the past from the past.

Future is always perceived from now. You can't view the future from the future.

The imagination "the unicorn I imagined has changed and vanished" is an object/imagination which is only experienced now. And then any imagination of this not existing prior, is also something that is here in the now. The perception of "prior" always only happens now. You can't escape the now. Any perceivable object is always here now and forever, because that is the unescapable nature of the present moment.

 

 

 

[Someone here]

8 minutes ago, Osaid said:

I think I get what OP is pointing to.

The present moment is absolute and eternal, so by consequence, anything experienced within that has to be absolute and eternal, even if you imagine it isn't.

Past is always perceived from now. You can't view the past from the past.

Future is always perceived from now. You can't view the future from the future.

The imagination "the unicorn I imagined has changed and vanished" is an object/imagination which is only experienced now. And then any imagination of this not existing prior, is also something that is here in the now. The perception of "prior" always only happens now. You can't escape the now. Any perceivable object is always here now and forever, because that is the unescapable nature of the present moment.

 

 

 

If we want to be even more accurate ..we should admit  that even the present doesn't exist. 

The present is just the surface between the past and the present. We have an illusion that there exist three different tempuses, but it is only in language that they actually exist. The future does not exist, it is in it’s very nature not to exist. The present doesn’t exist, for it is just the border between the past and the present. What exist is the past, for that is where we observe the world. We experience through memory. The moment you see something it is already past. The moment you experience is already behind you. All that you see, hear or feel is experienced in the past. All our thoughts are in fact memories. Your whole life is not what happens now, but the memories of what already has happened.

 

 

[Osaid]

2 minutes ago, Someone here said:

If we want to be even more accurate ..we should admit  that even the present doesn't exist. 

Call it what you want. Present moment is just what I call "existence", or "perception", or "experience", or "God", or whatever "this" is.

2 minutes ago, Someone here said:

All our thoughts are in fact memories. Your whole life is not what happens now, but the memories of what already has happened.

For me, calling it memories is too dualistic, because it refers to time. Same with things that "happened". I would just call it imagination. You imagine things that happened before. You imagine an identity. You imagine how certain things work.

I agree imagination is very fundamental to understanding and perceiving reality, much more than people give it credit for. If you lost a good chunk of your memory, would you still be enlightened? Would you even be the same person? If you lose enough of your memories, you basically die. Similar to when you dream, you might imagine yourself as a knight that slays dragons, with absolutely zero memory or knowledge of your waking state self. In a sense, you (ego) die temporarily. I have yet to fully reconcile how this ties in to death and identity.

But nonetheless, it all happens from this one experience, and there are no past experiences that have "happened", all of this is perceived from this one experience now. You are just imagining things on top of the experience, which help you understand the experience. You imagine a past, and that imagination of the past might help you navigate the experience.

 

[Someone here]

5 minutes ago, Osaid said:

Call it what you want. Present moment is just what I call "existence", or "perception", or "experience", or "God", or whatever "this" is.

For me, calling it memories is too dualistic, because it refers to time. Same with things that "happened". I would just call it imagination. You imagine things that happened before. You imagine an identity. You imagine how certain things work.

I agree imagination is very fundamental to understanding and perceiving reality, much more than people give it credit for. If you lost a good chunk of your memory, would you still be enlightened? Would you even be the same person? If you lose enough of your memories, you basically die. Similar to when you dream, you might imagine yourself as a knight that slays dragons, with absolutely zero memory or knowledge of your waking state self. In a sense, you (ego) die temporarily. I have yet to fully reconcile how this ties in to death and identity.

But nonetheless, it all happens from this one experience, and there are no past experiences that have "happened", all of this is perceived from this one experience now. You are just imagining things on top of the experience, which help you understand the experience. You imagine a past, and that imagination of the past might help you navigate the experience.

 

In your experience..is there not a yesterday or tomorrow? Can you retire right now? Why not? Oh, not old enough yet. How could that be if there is no time?

I Tell you what..Don’t go to the bathroom. Hold it in and  tell me if time doesn’t exist.

I’ll check on you tomorrow and see what you have to say about time then.

farther away we look in distance the farther away we see the past and we see it now that is now for us.

But the memory/concept of past events is also stored in our minds. But that is not the actual past event or moment, only the concept we formed about it and stored it.i understand this .

Even this concept change each time we bring it back, because our present mindset shapes and reshapes every concept we think about. It’s our mind’s relationship with the concept and we are part of it.

[Osaid]

1 hour ago, Someone here said:

In your experience..is there not a yesterday or tomorrow?

Yes, I experience yesterday and tomorrow, as imagination. Just as a child experiences Santa Claus as imagination. The difference is being able to see that your imagination is imagination. The experience itself doesn't change, how you perceive it does, it's a recontexualization.

 

 

Edited September 5, 2022 by Osaid

[Breakingthewall]

every object exists eternally because there are no objects. only apparent shapes that you see because you are excluding the infinity that is in them and staying with exactly the part that you are interested in seeing to create the appearance of an object. the same goes for you. you are the total infinity right now, but you are blind to everything except the part you want to see to appear to be you. everything is exactly the same: infinity. only that you see what suits you to see 

[_Archangel_]

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

If we want to be even more accurate ..we should admit  that even the present doesn't exist. 

@Someone here if you deconstruct everything, then yes. My insight was a step behind this.

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

What exist is the past, for that is where we observe the world. We experience through memory. The moment you see something it is already past. The moment you experience is already behind you. All that you see, hear or feel is experienced in the past. All our thoughts are in fact memories. Your whole life is not what happens now, but the memories of what already has happened.

no.
You are ok with present and future being constructs but not the past?
Whatever you call memory is experienced now. There was never a past. The past is a construct as much as future and present.
Whatever is thought to have happened in a past is actually being created now, literally.
@Osaid is on point here.

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

In your experience..is there not a yesterday or tomorrow? Can you retire right now? Why not? Oh, not old enough yet. How could that be if there is no time?

I Tell you what..Don’t go to the bathroom. Hold it in and  tell me if time doesn’t exist.

This is a classic fallacy.
If a construct exist, that doesn't mean you can bend its rules with your own limited will.
This is about understanding the nature of a construct/creation rather then its manipulation.
An Absolute kind of Will created those rules.

In the waking state you cannot walk through a wall, but still the wall is a construct of imagination and isn't concrete (of course i'm also imagining that i cannot go through it)

Edited September 5, 2022 by _Archangel_

[Jordan]

I don't really understand what you mean when you say "every object exist eternally and infinitely." Everything is constantly changing so I would think no object exists for any amount of time. Are you saying that when I experience waking up then walking into my kitchen, that is all 1 object? I think of one object to be an unchanging thing. Even if time does not exist in the way people imagine it, there is still change happening right? 

Are you just saying that the present experience exists eternally and infinitely or are you talking about objects?

[AtheisticNonduality]

All objects are permanent because Reality = Eternity, and all objects exist in reality, Reality is them. But they are also impermanent because they change.

[RMQualtrough]

Seems very volatile to me tbh.

Something similar I have considered lately though is the categorization of objects into different types of object, e.g. sight, sound, taste... As people are often afraid of what it will be like when they lose a sense like vision. The type of appearances are then different in quality, yet what is actually the difference between a sight and a sound as they happen, other than the way we choose to categorize them.

Maybe that's a mistake, and maybe similarly there's not an "every object". That might just be the result of categorization like we do between sight and sound. "Object" might be infinite and eternal rather than "every object" as though there are multiple of them. And rather than "object" which implies subject, maybe just "reality".

[_Archangel_]

@RMQualtrough

7 hours ago, RMQualtrough said:

"Object" might be infinite and eternal rather than "every object" as though there are multiple of them. And rather than "object" which implies subject, maybe just "reality".

Yes i was hinting at this at this towards the end of my post
 

 

10 hours ago, Jordan said:

Even if time does not exist in the way people imagine it, there is still change happening right? 

Are you just saying that the present experience exists eternally and infinitely or are you talking about objects?

@Jordan I would say IS reality everchanging but at they same time every moment/object appearing is in and of itself Absolute and eternal, holding the caracteristics of its creating foundation. Things appear finite when actually they are a whole by themselves.