Why Are You In A Relationship?

[ElenaO]

5 hours ago, Flare said:

You still seem to come from an place of so called co-dependence. You pretty much summed up which are your motivations for an relationships in this case. Your fear is most likely motivated trough your, which doesn't want you (especially as a woman) to live alone, not being protected.  So some of your motivations  are based on what you can get and not based on what you can give. In a relationship where one or both of you are takers, motivated by what they can get, coming out of the co-dependence frame, you gotta experience some suffering. Suffering for an relationship can be beautiful in his own way though. 

I just reviewed Leo's video on the relationships and the types. I am somewhere in between independent and interdependent in my relationships (more towards independent). Perhaps, it's hard for you to judge, since you don't know me. I am positive I could be single my whole life (except for having some sexual interactions) and be OK with that. However, the selfishness inside of me (or something else) pushes me to have kids. So I suppose that's my main motivator towards a relationship/family. Not sure how healthy is this tendency.

[Shin]

1 hour ago, ElenaO said:

 However, the selfishness inside of me (or something else) pushes me to have kids. So I suppose that's my main motivator towards a relationship/family. Not sure how healthy is this tendency.

Making babies because your ego think it will fulfill itself, is one of the worst mistake one can make.

Look at all the moms that are miserable with their kids, that don't even care about them ...

If the need to have children doesn't feel authentic, then back off.

 

Edited February 14, 2017 by Shin

[ElenaO]

Hm, I am pretty sure that I am going to be a good mom though . I understand the responsibility and everything that comes with it.

[Nahm]

To give and to experience love

[Pav]

@Samuel Garcia Abraham Maslow observed the following difference between D-love (egoic/needy/possesive love) and B-love (authentic love) in his research:

"1. B-love is welcomed into consciousness, and is completely enjoyed. Since it is non-possessive, and is admiring rather than needing, it makes no trouble and is practically always pleasure-giving.

2. It can never be sated; it may be enjoyed without end. It usually grows rather than disappearing. It is intrinsically enjoyable. It is end rather than means.

3. The B-love experience is often described as being the same as, and having the same effects as the aesthetic experience or the mystic experience.

4. The therapeutic and psychogogic effects of experiencing B-love are very profound and widespread. Similar are the characterological effects of the relatively pure love of a healthy mother for her baby, or the perfect love of their God that some mystics have described.

5. B-love is, beyond the shadow of a doubt, a richer, "higher," more valuable subjective experience than D-love (which all B-lovers have also previously experienced.) This preference is also reported by my other older, more average subjects, many of whom experience both kinds of love simultaneously in varying combinations.

6. D-love can be gratified. The concept "gratification" hardly applies at all to admiration-love for another person's admiration-worthiness and love-worthiness.

7. In B-love there is a minimum of anxiety-hostility. For all practical human purposes, it may even be considered to be absent. There can, of course, be anxiety-for-the-other. In D-love one must always expect some degree of anxiety-hostility.

8. B-lovers are more independent of each other, more autonomous, less jealous or threatened, less needful, more individual, more disinterested, but also simultaneously more eager to help the other towards self-actualisation, more proud of his triumphs, more altruistic, generous and fostering.

9. The truest, most penetrating perception of the other is made possible by B-love. It is as much a cognitive as an emotional-conative reaction, as I have already emphasised. So impressive is this, and so often validated by other people's later experience, that, far from accepting the common platitude that love makes people blind, I become more and more inclined to think of the opposite as true, namely that non-love makes us blind.

10. Finally, I may say the B-love, in a profound but testable sense, creates the partner. It gives him a self-image, it gives him self-acceptance, a feeling of love-worthiness and respect-worthiness, all of which permit him to grow. It is a real question whether the full development of the human being is possible without it."

 

More on egoic vs holistic perception of others:

"In essence, the deficit-motivated man is far more dependent upon other people than is the man who is predominantly growth-motivated. He is more "interested," more needful, more attached, more desirous. 

This dependency colors and limits interpersonal relation. To see people primarily as need-gratifiers or as sources of supple is an abstractive act. They are seen not as wholes, as complicated, unique individuals, but rather from the point of view of usefulness. What in them is not related to the perceiver's needs is either overlooked altogether, or else bores, irritates, or threatens. This parallels our relations with cow, horses, and sheep, as well as waiters, taxicab drivers, porter, policemen or others whom we use.

Fully disinterested, desireless, objective and holistic perception of another human being becomes possible only when nothing is needed from him, only when he is not needed. Idiographic, aesthetic perception of the whole person is far more possible for self-actualising people (or in moments of self-actualisation), and furthermore approval, admiration, and love are based less upon gratitude for usefulness and more upon the objective, intrinsic qualities of the perceived person. He is admired for objectively admirable qualities rather than because he flatters or praises. He is loved because he is love-worthy rather than because he gives out love."

[ElenaO]

What people are describing here sounds a little out of this world. I wonder if I've ever actually seen a couple who's experienced a B-love. Is it 1% or 0.1% or 00000.1% of people who've got a peek at it? Has any of you?

[Life Coach]

2 hours ago, ElenaO said:

What people are describing here sounds a little out of this world. I wonder if I've ever actually seen a couple who's experienced a B-love. Is it 1% or 0.1% or 00000.1% of people who've got a peek at it? Has any of you?

I haven't seen such a thing yet, and I can't imagine parcticing unconditional B-Love in an intimate relationship. It kind off is out of this world. But anytime I look at people who claim stuff like this, and every time I look at so called enlightened people I think they are out of this world too. I don't know if I ever want to become such a person. I'd rather practice the C love, named after the great Coach Corey Wayne. It's a mix between D and B love. No neediness, no drama, no codependency, but you still won't take shit from your partner and expect mutual effort and respect in the relationship.

Edited February 15, 2017 by Life Coach

[ElenaO]

@John Flores Yeah, no doubt, that's  the most important relationship one can have. 

[Elton]

@ElenaO because of the need for sex

The need to be loved and wanted

To love 

Basically sex and love for now; maybe to start a family after a decade..

[Elton]

@ElenaO 0.1% and 00000.1% is the same thing you probably ment 0.00001 %, sorry for the correction.

[ElenaO]

36 minutes ago, Elton said:

@ElenaO because of the need for sex

The need to be loved and wanted

To love 

Basically sex and love for now; maybe to start a family after a decade..

Yes, I have rather similar wishes. But it seems this doesn't lead to a fulfilling relationship. At least according to what the theory says.

[Elton]

@ElenaO yes I agree because I search for the same aspects wherever I go.

Why am I replying to your post?  

Because I see a beautiful woman in the profile pic.

[ElenaO]

2 minutes ago, Elton said:

@ElenaO yes I agree because I search for the same aspects wherever I go.

Why am I replying to your post?  

Because I see a beautiful woman in the profile pic.

Thanks

[Elton]

[Shin]

21 minutes ago, ElenaO said:

Yes, I have rather similar wishes. But it seems this doesn't lead to a fulfilling relationship. At least according to what the theory says.

 

The need for love and attention is an illusion that our mind is creating,

It is our ego that tries to access the self/god/consciousness by ineffective ways, and it can't do it any other way, because the ego by definition is what makes us act incousciously.

 

There is a reason why nothing can't satisfy us for long, and why we always tell ourself "this thing will be THE thing" (maybe not that obviously, but we ALL do it).

Basically, it is because we want to fill that void that we inconsciouly feel (otherwise we wouldn't try to), but nothing can be filled.

We have that impression because there is moments where we feel perfect happiness/peace, but these moments are always there, if we don't put any conditions on it, and if we stop seeking them.

 

I know I am repeating myself, but this is very important, if you don't try to embody this (I'm talking to everybody here), and actually feel it, you'll be going full circle all your life.

You'll never be happy and fulfilled for long, there will always be drama, there will always be psychological issues (yes, 99.9% of people are mad, including myself), you'll always crave something, and most importantly, you'll never experience the deep connection there is between all things (which blows away the love you think you want),

Which will lead you to actually do what you really want in your life, which will lead you to be (it's more about the intensity) deeply fulfilled.

 

To see this you just need to apply what Leo is talking in his consciousness/spirituality  videos, or Eckhart Tolle in his books (They are straight to the point, no cryptic bullshit).

It's not complicated, and everyone can access it, you just need to stop bullshitting yourself and seeking in the wrong places, the only place that needs investigation is your own life, everything else is secondary.

 

[faith]

I hope I can help

Relationships are very messy. I went through a lot with my girlfriend - fear, arguements, almost breaking up, sexual issues, etc... - you name it. Two and a half years ago I met her and I was a scared, deeply insecure person - unable to deal with loneliness, hate, lust, fear, etc... This was about the time I started to seek some kind of truth, and began meditating, too. Here is what I can tell you about relationships: there are very few bonds you can make with people in this world. You can, of course, find compassion for strangers and enemies, but there is something so divine, pure, forgiving, and empathetic about getting those really close bonds - namely, your bonds with mom, dad, and a bond with a lover. Other such bonds may include teacher-student, friend-friend, or even friend-enemy.

You can meditate in the cave, but eventually you have to descend and face the world, and you know it's not a perfect place, but the beauty is seen through relationships with people. People who say "I am above all that, and I don't need that" are unfortunately very misguided. They've compartmentalized relationships as something they don't value. But spiritual life is about encompassing it all, and so, they will eventually face it whether they like it or not. Believe it or not, but some very respected gurus out there are emotionally immature because they lived a life of solitude completely devoted to their practice, nothing wrong with that, of course, but you can see where it has its loopholes.

So here is my suggestion. Don't be afraid to jump into a relationship and get tangled up with feelings, because only hardships show us how much we have learned. I was very lucky to have found her, she is the kindest person I know and I learn a lot from her. To say something like "I don't need her because I am detached and spiritual" is an insult to her, and to our beautiful, short time together.

I hope you will be as lucky as I am to find something so beautiful in this world, I wish you love and compassion, my dear!

[ElenaO]

@ashashlov Thanks for your post! I agree. Bonding with human beings is amongst the most rewarding things in life. However, I believe that we still gotta think with whom with try to build these relationships. With some we bond, we some we couldn't. 

[Vercingetorix]

basically the fastest way to grow spiritually / dissolve your ego, if this is what you want (and I believe anyone wants this (to be happy) if you claim you don't you don't understand the meaning of it ) is to face your fears, face anything that scares you, anything that makes you feel uncomfortable, anything that angers you, anything that makes you even the slightest negative feeling  and to be in contact, to observe the sensations those feeling consists of. If you watch and accept those sensations they will suddenly disappear and you will become free from them forever!

So my advice would be, if right now you are single, explorer all the aspects of being single, anything that you dislike about it is a clue where you have energy caged that you can release and use for growth! Then after you free yourself from all the negative feelings that being single brings to you, go be in a relationship and do the same, explore all the areas in a relationship that bring you suffering and transcend it.
And after that you won't be afraid anymore, you won't be any longer a slave to your emotions, and you will be free to choose what you really want.

Edited February 20, 2017 by Vercingetorix

[ElenaO]

Interesting idea @Vercingetorix What do you mean by facing a fear? Is it that you observe the fear that you experience? Or is it that you take some action?

[Vercingetorix]

@ElenaO
first step is to understand all external situations that trigger negative emotions in us can be mapped on the body. When you think that you are lonely and you are sad about it, you are not really sad because you are lonely, but because the thought of you being lonely triggered a sensation in your body. then you react to this sensation, you are sad because you sense an unpleasant sensation. This is super important to understand because then instead of trying to solve the external problem you can work on the sensations level, which is much much easier

So I say that this fear is just an unpleasant sensation and thoughts. If you can observe this sensation and accept it, be totally with it, be equanimous to it, then you will see that after a while it just disappears! awareness alone is curative

So all negative emotions consist of just sensations and thoughts. we resist the sensations because we perceive them as bad. The way of meditation as I understand it is to learn to accept what is instead of the normal way of the conditioned mind - to resist and avert unpleasant sensations and to crave pleasant sensations. You do it by putting your awareness on the sensations instead of the usual attempt of the mind to think of solutions to the external situation that is causing the unpleasant sensation.