A book better than GEB

[Flyboy]

1 hour ago, Virtually said:

@Flyboy Are you planning to read McGillChrist's "The Matter with Things"?

He published it relatively recently

If recall correctly, it took him something like 10 years to write. it deals with the nature of reality and perception, building upon his previous work with the "master and his emissary", but with a deeper and more ontological take as far as I know

 

I didn't want to bring this up, but YES   $142 later, it is the most expensive book on my shelves, and holy moly is it a monster (1500 pages in 2 parts).  Given how difficult TMAHE has been, I'm daunted.  But this has been the most worthwhile reading "on the relative" that I have ever done, so I will take on this epic challenge once I've processed this first one a bit.  I have a lot of internal work to do find the sneaky ways in which my left brain tells my right brain to shut up, and further to let my right brain really flourish and figure out how to get them to cooperate healthily (which is probably a lifelong endeavor).

 

19 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@Flyboy You make some good points, however, I have listened to McGilchirst and I'm well aware of his positions.

I agree, he's an exceptional mind. I have his books on my bookshelf.

But none of that reaches the levels that I am now exploring. I am way beyond science now and I deliberately make an effort now to throw away all human teachings. They just hold me back. I don't need any human models or explanations of myself.

Hopefully some day you will reach this stage in your development.

Suit yourself brother.  We're on different paths, but I hope we end up in the same place eventually.  I personally intend to be very careful about closing myself off to learning from others, no matter how deep I think I am.  But I also understand that some things don't have the "signal to noise ratio" as you put it (The Book of Minds comes to mind... ugh).  I'm just suggesting McGilchrist's signal ratio is pretty fucking worthwhile, imo, and that his ideas are not easily summarized, so actually reading the book will have a different effect than reading "about" them.  Cheers.

[Chuco]

People who write books write it more for themselves more than for anyone else. 

 

I would know...I'm a writer.

[hyruga]

 

11 hours ago, Chuco said:

People who write books write it more for themselves more than for anyone else. 

 

I would know...I'm a writer.

Indeed. I skimmed through part of the book. The book was very well written and it fulfilled all the left brain and right brain info and analysis. Of course it did. The author spent 20 years to write it and also procrastinated for 20 years before releasing it. ?

Strong analysis and argument present inside the book. Lacks practicality though.

 

[Leo Gura]

On 9/7/2022 at 3:56 PM, Flyboy said:

I'm just suggesting McGilchrist's signal ratio is pretty fucking worthwhile

Signal to noise ratio for him is great and not the issue.

There is a deeper issue at work.

If you're gonna read McGilchirst, start with The Matter With Things.

Edited September 11, 2022 by Leo Gura

[Tyler Robinson]

10 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Signal to noise ratio for him is great and not the issue.

There is a deeper issue at work.

If you're gonna read McGilchirst, start with The Matter With Things.

There's another problem besides poor signal-to-noise, the information in pop-(history, psychology, economics, etc.) books often is simply wrong or deceptive. Even scholarly books can misinform you or give you a very biased perspective; with millions (tens of millions?) of PhD's in the world, you can find a book that will say almost anything you like.

Thankfully, the experts in each field effectively review the books for you. An there are more widely-respected, serious scholarly works of true genius than you can read in your lifetime. The signal-to-noise generally is very high, misinformation is low, and writing by the very best is often very engaging.

In other words, if all you read is the very best humanity has to offer, you still won't live long enough to read more than a fraction of it. So why waste your time on anything else?

[omar30]

@Leo Gura

read the quran it's beyond any human level books.

[Flyboy]

On 9/11/2022 at 4:51 AM, Leo Gura said:

Signal to noise ratio for him is great and not the issue.

There is a deeper issue at work.

If you're gonna read McGilchirst, start with The Matter With Things.

What is the deeper issue?

The Matter With Things is next on my list.  For the record, I don't always agree with McGilchrist.  Like Hofstadter, he circles around the reflections in life that point toward the infinite.  Too close to the singularity and he starts to miss the mark, especially regarding the nature of self and the final collapsing of duality.  A great example is his disdain for schizophrenia (as a left-brain dominated condition), even though in many ways schizophrenia borders on enlightenment from "the other side".  He doesn't connect that the whole picture loops back on itself if taken far enough in either direction.  But that's where I come in, and his understanding is always in service to my own, not a replacement for it.  

And really, the value here is in appreciating the magnificence of this relative experience, in its great depth and complexity.  Enlightenment goes beyond this, but does not in any way negate the value of this understanding, but is instead enriched and mutually supported by it (even if such support is not ultimately needed).  This is just an exceptional work within intellectualism of the currents of the relative world that lead to the absolute.

[Leo Gura]

7 hours ago, omar30 said:

@Leo Gura

read the quran it's beyond any human level books.

Dude, I invented the Quran.

6 hours ago, Flyboy said:

What is the deeper issue?

The deeper issue is accessing Infinite Intelligence. That's what I care about. And you will not access it until you transcend books. Why use a middleman when you can go straight to the source?

Quote

And really, the value here is in appreciating the magnificence of this relative experience, in its great depth and complexity.  Enlightenment goes beyond this, but does not in any way negate the value of this understanding, but is instead enriched and mutually supported by it (even if such support is not ultimately needed).  This is just an exceptional work within intellectualism of the currents of the relative world that lead to the absolute.

That is fine. I can appreciate a good intellectual work. Which is why I have his books on my bookshelf.

Edited September 13, 2022 by Leo Gura

[BlessedLion]

@Leo Gura David Hawkins says something similar to what you’re saying here at 

 

@ 24:40 

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uhEFE57plE8

 

Reading books is so fun though especially juicy books on metaphysics, and things that’s raise your intelligence 

[hyruga]

Read A whole new mind by Daniel Pink. A more practical book based on right brain vs left brain.

Edited September 20, 2022 by hyruga

[Leo Gura]

On 9/19/2022 at 6:10 PM, BlessedLion said:

@Leo Gura David Hawkins says something similar to what you’re saying here at

@ 24:40

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uhEFE57plE8

That's exactly right.

[Flyboy]

On 9/22/2022 at 5:36 PM, Leo Gura said:

That's exactly right.

I think you're just scared dude.  Scared of intaking ideas which might threaten to destabilize the extensive knowledge web which you've created with your "work".  Despite how much you like to say words like "holism" and "intuition", the way you actually talk about your ideas is extremely left-brained, and lives primarily in the realm of abstraction.  You probably think that's a good thing (I did too, before deeply studying McGilchrist).  He demonstrates what a true right-brained communication is like to take in.  It's a completely different experience.

This book will teach you what art really is, and how to understand it.  It will teach you metaphor, music, poetry, and about the real nature of relationship.  The degree to which this could deepen your thinking is tremendous--I have moved past many of your ideas as I have come to understand them as relatively surface-level abstractions that miss a deeper reality.  Don't get me wrong, my left-brain LOVES your work, it is so clear within the abstraction playground--I just now realize how much more this actually misses. 

Leave your comfort zone, even if you think that comfort zone is "infinite intelligence".  In the end all grounds must drop anyway, including the Self that you project onto God/This.

[Leo Gura]

6 hours ago, Flyboy said:

Despite how much you like to say words like "holism" and "intuition", the way you actually talk about your ideas is extremely left-brained, and lives primarily in the realm of abstraction.

Lol

Dude, you could not comprehend the level of right-brained intuitive thinking that I do.

No human intellectual or academic understands how to think like I do. I've discovered modes of thinking that most humans have yet to discover. Which is why humans books are of little interest to me now. I can think like an alien.

Edited September 27, 2022 by Leo Gura

[ZenSwift]

43 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Lol

Dude, you could not comprehend the level of right-brained intuitive thinking that I do.

No human intellectual or academic understands how to think like I do. I've discovered modes of thinking that most humans have yet to discover. Which is why humans books are of little interest to me now. I can think like an alien.

I look forward to you articulating this

 

[Kshantivadin]

50 minutes ago, ZenSwift said:

I look forward to you articulating this

 

me too 

[Leo Gura]

13 hours ago, ZenSwift said:

I look forward to you articulating this

Stay tuned

[AtheisticNonduality]

57 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Stay tuned

Yep, I can think about concepts through having visions of abstract geometrical shapes, and colors and numbers and places become interconnected.

[Nilsi]

12 minutes ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

Yep, I can think about concepts through having visions of abstract geometrical shapes, and colors and numbers and places become interconnected.

Can you shape and animate your shapes at will though?

[Flyboy]

16 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Lol

Dude, you could not comprehend the level of right-brained intuitive thinking that I do.

No human intellectual or academic understands how to think like I do. I've discovered modes of thinking that most humans have yet to discover. Which is why humans books are of little interest to me now. I can think like an alien.

 

If that's the case, why is your content so cleanly abstracted, self-congruent, and simultaneously unaware of its own abstraction and assumptions?  (A great example is your "levels of consciousness" model, which is absolutely an abstraction and quite incorrect, in my opinion; another example is the way you talk about imagination [notice: abstract concept], and use it as a magic bullet to avoid any kind of felt relationship or interaction with externalities.)  You even talk about abstraction and intuition as if those are both right-brained things, seemingly failing to realize they are polar opposites (!). 

I've experienced integrated ways of thinking on psychedelics that are indeed profound, so I don't doubt such experiences.  What most concerns me is the narcissism that is becoming so evident on this channel.  Just look at this whole thread.  Your responses are so aloof and arrogant and closed-minded in such a meta way (yeah you're the MOST open-minded and enlightened person in the whole world--no one could possibly teach you anything )... if you can't see the irony your right brain isn't so good after all.

It's like you want to be THE BEST at being loving and conscious, as long as everyone knows you're the BEST at it.  UGH.  Let. Fucking. Go.

Said with the best of intentions.

 

[OBEler]

@Flyboy Leo tripped hard man.. Did you know 5 meo produces Neurogenesis? 

His left brain must have been grown with 5 meo dmt and the same for his right brain with 5 meo malt. Would be interesting to see a MRT scan of his alien brain for sure would be a good proof at least

Edited September 27, 2022 by OBEler