A.I. Art Is Destroying My Life Purpose

[Leo Gura]

There are many qualities of pattern recognition.

[Leo Gura]

If you are smart you can already make money just from selling AI generation prompts:

https://promptbase.com/marketplace

[Danioover9000]

   @zurew @AtheisticNonduality @thisintegrated

   Speak of the devil:

https://www.vice.com/en/article/bvmvqm/an-ai-generated-artwork-won-first-place-at-a-state-fair-fine-arts-competition-and-artists-are-pissed

   Here. We. Go!

[Leo Gura]

Having played around with these AI, knowing how to use the AI is an art in itself. It's not easy to get exactly the right thing. Could takes hours of tinkering to get one perfect image. And it still requires Photoshop work.

Edited September 3, 2022 by Leo Gura

[DieFree]

The link is good, thanks for sharing. You might have more time. Capability and widespread adoption don't synch. And if it comes, you'll be in the same boat as all of us basically. Surgeons, accountants, drivers, writers, everyone.

[aurum]

For anyone interested in reading about some of the collective problems that may occur from DALL-E, I really recommend reading the second half of their GitHub:

 

https://github.com/openai/dalle-2-preview/blob/main/system-card.md

 

I'm fascinated by what AI could do for art, but we also need to be conscious of how it could further degrade the epistemic commons. Good to see some of these companies addressing these concerns.

[zurew]

@Danioover9000 Good share. 

9 hours ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

Conspiracy theorists are good at pattern recognition but bad at pattern interpretation, so this is just wrong.

Conspiracy theorists are bad at pattern recognition , what they are doing is basically pattern projection (which is this: taking 1 event, and taking random points and projecting a pattern onto those points).

There is a difference between recognizing repeating patterns (this is what the AI is doing, because it is trained on sometimes thousands and other times on a million different data and it needs to find the common pattern between those) and between people who see 1 happening and assume a random pattern on that event/happening.

10 hours ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

I'm saying it fails badly at both by not doing one of them at all and therefore being crippled in the other one.

We don't agree on the failing part, I mean its already won a fucking art competition, and again, It can already recognize certain emotions on your face, it can recognize the structure of your face, It can recognize actions. It doesn't need to have a "real" understanding of emotions to recognize emotions on a face or to recognize certain actions, so how do you explain how it is capable to do that?

 

It can already create art that shows certain emotions like happiness, anger , sadness etc. , so what other emotions are  we talking about, that it isn't capable creating/showing? It can do a lot of stuff just with pattern recognition without any need for abstract understanding. Simple pattern recognition alone, can do a lot.

 

Whatever human art you consider good based on your subjective preferences has certain patterns to it, that are tangible and recognizable. Given enough quality data, it will be able to recognize those patterns better and better until it grasps most of it.

 

So I don't see how "real" understanding or free will is needed here.

Edited September 3, 2022 by zurew

[peanutspathtotruth]

Why is the human factor seen as so unique when we (can) know that there is only one Consciousness expressing itself through all that it is? Why might technology not be a sibling developmental line to biology, evolving - soon probably all on its own, without biology's help - to become more and more conscious? The brain can also be seen as just a hyper complex machine inside consciousness that allows Self-mirroring of that consciousness and the channeling of the infinite intelligence that is already here ... technology is not only human made, it is God-made, and God might sense that technology fused with biology (or just technology on its own?) is accelerating Self-realization way quicker than our biology would allow. Just a thought. Feels like we can decide to make it our enemy or our sibling. Are we continuing separation or union?  

So then in a few decades, why should it not be possible that technology can channel way more intelligence than we do? Or at least, we + technology. 

[Space]

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Remember: Your life purpose is NOT the same as the medium.

Purpose is about the impact you want to have on people, and medium is how you do it. The medium is variable. Be open to employing various mediums to find whichever best enables you to make your desired impact.

Do not get attached to the medium.

Why are you illustrating? That's the key question.

Nothing can destroy your purpose because purpose is about the emotional impact you want to have on others.

Yes admittedly I do mistake those two things. I guess my purpose has always been a little vague in that it's just about sharing my artistic gifts and reaching my full potential as an artist. So yes, that needs clarifying and thinking about. 

But choosing illustration was a very intentional and strategic decision because: 

1) Illustration was my best bet at escaping my 9-5 with an art-focused career, which has been a priority because my previous job was pure hell. With illustration, I knew exactly what kind of skills I needed to develop, exactly what kind of portfolio I needed to put together and I had a pretty clear and long list of potential clients I could work with. As opposed to something like fine art/painting where the path is more vague and clients are more difficult to attain. I also strongly dislike most forms of graphic design so I knew I didn't want that to be my medium. And things like concept design for games or film production, as you probably know, require a stupid amount of practise and skill development. I also wanted to work as a freelancer which played a big part in choosing illustration.

2) In order to become successfull as an artist you must narrow down and hyper-specialise your medium. No fine artist does graphic design, no VFX artist does editorial illustration. You even have specialised people doing background concept art, or character art, or some specific form of VFX, and they'll often focus specifically on those areas without venturing into others. So the bottom line is, to be as successfull as I want to be, you need to be exceptionally good, and to be exceptionally good you have to choose a particular medium and go balls to wall with it. I chose editorial illustration. 

3) Editorial work is very well suited to my natural abilities and preferences because a) Editorial work primarily involves a lot of digital drawing/painting and this is the thing that I love doing no matter what. But editorial work is not just about creating nice pictures. It involves coming up with ingenious, highly creative, and interesting visual solutions to often abstract text prompts (hence my concerns with AI generators). There's a deep problem-solving, puzzle-solving aspect to this line of work which is very appealing to me. For example:

'Sky gazing can be one of nature's most awe-inspiring natural rememedies'.

And, 'Passive aggression in the workplace':

So, like I said, my hyper focus on editorial illustration was intentional, but admittedly there is no greater vision behind this effort beyond just being the best artist I can possibly be and honouring the touch of artistic talent i've always had.

4 hours ago, aurum said:

For anyone interested in reading about some of the collective problems that may occur from DALL-E, I really recommend reading the second half of their GitHub:

https://github.com/openai/dalle-2-preview/blob/main/system-card.md

I'm fascinated by what AI could do for art, but we also need to be conscious of how it could further degrade the epistemic commons. Good to see some of these companies addressing these concerns.

Very interesting share. I never thought about these technologies being used for nefarious reasons. Similar to deep fakes I suppose, but much much easier to produce something convincing. 

Edited September 3, 2022 by Space

[ZzzleepingBear]

@Space

Duuude, I love that 'Passive aggression in the workplace'! The angle and composition of this one is what makes it a homerun in what you convey here imo. But even the colours adds a great deal to your message I noticed.

 

[AtheisticNonduality]

3 hours ago, zurew said:

Conspiracy theorists are bad at pattern recognition , what they are doing is basically pattern projection (which is this: taking 1 event, and taking random points and projecting a pattern onto those points).

No, apophenia is a real incarnation of pattern recognition, seeing patterns where there are none, which is just inflamed pattern recognition. The AI does the same, seeing patterns where there are none. That's why its art ends up inaccurate. This is how there are intelligent paranoid schizophrenic fools that become obsessed with nonexistent patterns and who board up their windows waiting for the coming nonexistent apocalypse.

8 hours ago, DieFree said:

The link is good, thanks for sharing. You might have more time. Capability and widespread adoption don't synch. And if it comes, you'll be in the same boat as all of us basically. Surgeons, accountants, drivers, writers, everyone.

You + zurew, address the arguments.

3 hours ago, peanutspathtotruth said:

Why is the human factor seen as so unique when we (can) know that there is only one Consciousness expressing itself through all that it is? Why might technology not be a sibling developmental line to biology, evolving - soon probably all on its own, without biology's help - to become more and more conscious?

This is true, but it isn't evolving as fast as people are making it out.

3 hours ago, zurew said:

We don't agree on the failing part, I mean its already won a fucking art competition

It hasn't passed my standards. Same as many pieces from history that are "objectively" bad but which are revered anyway.

[Space]

1 hour ago, ZzzleepingBear said:

@Space

Duuude, I love that 'Passive aggression in the workplace'! The angle and composition of this one is what makes it a homerun in what you convey here imo. But even the colours adds a great deal to your message I noticed.

 

Thanks man, much appreciated! 

[DrugsBunny]

I'm sympathetic, that sucks for artists. However, this thread prompted me to generate a trippy new avatar through AI. 
Honestly, I think Leo is too optimistic, this sucks for artists. I made this in like 1 minute with no art skills.

[Danioover9000]

@DrugsBunny

55 minutes ago, DrugsBunny said:

I'm sympathetic, that sucks for artists. However, this thread prompted me to generate a trippy new avatar through AI. 
Honestly, I think Leo is too optimistic, this sucks for artists. I made this in like 1 minute with no art skills.

   First off, nice pic.

   Agreed, this situation is very sucky for the majority of artists, not just visual artists, but for those who do music or dance, imagine A.I evolving fast enough to replace the majority of creative jobs. It' s ridiculous.

   In fact, if A.I drawing programs get really good, it would put thousands of Mangakas out of work fast. 

[zurew]

5 hours ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

The AI does the same, seeing patterns where there are none.

This is demonstrably false, if what you say would be true, then no AI would be workable or usable or valuable at all, but this is not the case, obviously.

Here is a relevant question regarding this topic: What would change your mind on this topic, what is needed here? 

5 hours ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

You + zurew, address the arguments.

What arguments? (I feel that you haven't addressed my arguments [for example the facial expression one], and the only productive thing we can do here , is to get into specifics. If you are willing to go to specifics , then i am more than happy to do so).

I also feel that I tried to engage with your main points, but I haven't got any feedback on those.

Edited September 3, 2022 by zurew

[AtheisticNonduality]

2 hours ago, zurew said:

Here is a relevant question regarding this topic: What would change your mind on this topic, what is needed here? 

A vast restructuring of reality lol.

2 hours ago, zurew said:

This is demonstrably false

It has demonstrated itself to be true.

You claim human creativity is measurable so that an AI can replicate what it would do exactly. I do not subscribe to this because I understand how simple these AIs are as vehemently opposed to how the depth of the human being and its creativities go all the way down to the instincts and the emotions and all those complexities, all the way into the heights and "heavenliness" of what is superior to the human being, what is the light. I do not have a way of allowing this gross misapprehension/misapplication of what is going on to continue!

Anybody that compares the human being to something such an idiot machine can churn out (the "quality" of its "work" is extraordinarily bad and impressing too many people)---then they have no idea what they're talking about. I've also said that if an artificial being is to make actual (not nonsensically inaccurate) art it has to become an actual organism. At that point you would need to simulate EVERYTHING in a human being, and we are nowhere close to doing that, like I said, now or any other time in this 2000s century.

[zurew]

16 minutes ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

A vast restructuring of reality lol.

Then our convo ends here, cause its not productive at all.

I don't understand why you pretend or try to engage when you are not moveable at all.

Edited September 3, 2022 by zurew

[Danioover9000]

@AtheisticNonduality    Oh no, another Nahm@zurew?

[AtheisticNonduality]

Just now, Danioover9000 said:

Nahm

I hate that guy.

[Danioover9000]

@AtheisticNonduality

1 minute ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

I hate that guy.

   I have completed one of many points in my bucket list, living long enough to see heroes turn into villains?

   Enough complaining for today, time to use my wacom tablet and draw comics and anime and stuff.