Breaking: Shooting In Iraq, U.S. Embassy Staff Leave Baghdad

[Fleetinglife]

@Mesopotamian

Meso, just to check if you are doing all right, if your are fine and okay there? 

I have heard some foreign analysts online say that this is in fact the beginning of a another low intensity Iraqi Civil War, after the followers of an influential Iraqi nationalist Shia religious cleric Muqtada al-Sadr stormed the Presidential Palace/or government building after apparently the former president from the Shia religious group just stepped down and resigned from his post in the country, from all the current news I am seeing coming in judging from their content viewed only on face value. 

There is allegedly open shooting and confortations on the streets in Baghdad between the security forces of the country and the armed part of the protestors, seemingly from all the news and information incoming. 

I will keep people updated here if something also major happens. 

Alleged image and photo of US military transport helicopters evacuating the staff from their Embassies residency in Baghdad:

 

 

 

Edited September 1, 2022 by Leo Gura
Correcting horrible title grammar

[Mesopotamian]

Hello there thanks for checking on me.. I just came back to the forum again. I'm fine and I hope you're too I'll try to comment soon on the topic again and elaborate.. 

[LSD-Rumi]

Iran is a the cause of 90% of all the  suffering and unstability in the Middle East, it just won't stop spreading its infulence on any unstable country. Iraq, Yemen, Lebanon, Syria. It wants to control all the surronding countries with any means. In Lebanon, you have Hezbullah, in Yemen you have Houthi rebels. In Syria, you have militias, in Iraq, it controls Shias.

[Fleetinglife]

6 hours ago, Mesopotamian said:

Hello there thanks for checking on me.. I just came back to the forum again. I'm fine and I hope you're too I'll try to comment soon on the topic again and elaborate.. 

Thanks first and foremost, for answering back and responding, so that we know that you are doing fine and that you are okay! Very glad to hear from you, that everything is alright there personally with you in terms of physical safety and security. Be in no rush or hurry to comment, write and try to explain things or in detail there for us immediately, only when you are personally ok and feel like it! 

BTW will always be there for the solidarity Meso! 

 

Edited September 1, 2022 by Fleetinglife

[Fleetinglife]

4 hours ago, LSD-Rumi said:

Iran is the cause of 90% of all the  suffering and instability in the Middle East

If that is even a partially true personal assessment, then Israel and Saudi Arabia could go a long way in dismantling and ending the Apartheid of Palestinians and reforming/or abolishing their backward dynastic monarchy that launches aggressive and brutal military and economic blockade campaigns on their smaller, religious minority southern neighbors respectively, in counteracting that Shia extremist ideology allegedly all coming from Iran, as a central operating hub for it, from having any fertile soil, fuel, basis or appeal as protector of Shias across the Middle East from having even half of the influence that it now has.

Also, don't forget the role of Saudi Arabia has had and still has to an extent in acting as a tacit financial and ideological platform for a time in spreading and promoting Sunni extremism and fundamentalism not just in the Middle East but also in parts of Africa, Europe and Central Asia.

Edited September 1, 2022 by Fleetinglife

[Mesopotamian]

3 hours ago, Fleetinglife said:

Thanks first and foremost, for answering back and responding, so that we know that you are doing fine and that you are okay! Very glad to hear from you, that everything is alright there personally with you in terms of physical safety and security. Be in no rush or hurry to comment, write and try to explain things or in detail there for us immediately, only when you are personally ok and feel like it! 

BTW will always be there for the solidarity Meso! 

Thanks again for the solidarity here. It is nice to learn that good people like you do think about my safety

Let's get back to business:

On 8/30/2022 at 2:50 PM, Fleetinglife said:

I have heard some foreign analysts online say that this is in fact the beginning of a another low intensity Iraqi Civil War, after the followers of an influential Iraqi nationalist Shia religious cleric Muqtada al-Sadr stormed the Presidential Palace/or government building after apparently the former president from the Shia religious group just stepped down and resigned from his post in the country, from all the current news I am seeing coming in judging from their content viewed only on face value. 

Muqtada Alsadar is today the strongest man in Iraq, has a wide populous base, and a militia. He's playing power games though, and it's been many years where he learned that he can have the biggest mass in the street, bigger than any other populous mass. 

He seems to be playing power games, reminding everyone that in case they don't take what he wants in account, he's going to be causing chaos.

Now his political wing won the election,  yet other political Shiite are not letting him also have a subordinate as the Iraqi PM. That would be solidifying his position as the ultimate leader of IRaq, making him sort of similar to the Iranian situation, and for that, he actually gave his followers 24 hour to do whatever they want to do, by claiming that he resigned from his post. Next day, and after they turned Baghdad into a complete chaos, he went on TV and expressed his dissapointment in his ,militia and followers! ordering them to go home in less than 60 minutes! As if he had nothing to do with what was happening! 

 

On 8/30/2022 at 2:50 PM, Fleetinglife said:

There is allegedly open shooting and confortations on the streets in Baghdad between the security forces of the country and the armed part of the protestors, seemingly from all the news and information incoming. 

That's true, there was sever fire in the "not-so-green" zone.. it continued for the whole night until he appeared again on TV the next day at around 12 PM maybe?

So what's happening is that now everyone is complementing him and sort of sucking up to him for ordering his followers to go home, even his rivals, and the Iraqi president, and current PM, they are all applauding him for that!

Now we are in the next phase, are they going to listen to what he wants and go to a new election? 

It is really dark and complicated, yet after the chaos night, I believe everybody is going to try to take what he wants in account in order not to upset him again..

 

Also his resignation came as a reaction for his deceased father's friend and disciple,  himself a religious man living in Iran, and the latter when he resigned, he said that Muqtada doesn't represent his father anyways, and that all the current followers of Muqtada and his deceased father should follow the Iranian Murshad Khaminie.. And that's when Muqtada made a statement, scolding that man, and announcing resignation, and that's when the chaos started and storming the green zone...

 

Yet Basically, as I stated before, Iraq is probably the biggest looting operation in the history of humanity, and at the end, everybody is going to come together so that the oil flow continues..

Today I've read headlines that even the US is making statements that goes with some Muqtada's Demands.

 

 

Edited September 1, 2022 by Mesopotamian

[Mesopotamian]

35 minutes ago, Mesopotamian said:

Today I've read headlines that even the US is making statements that goes with some Muqtada's Demands.

Some Iraqi news was quoting from:

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/

[Mesopotamian]

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/removing-all-militias-baghdads-international-zone

[Fleetinglife]

On 01/09/2022 at 10:13 PM, Mesopotamian said:

Thanks again for the solidarity here. It is nice to learn that good people like you do think about my safety

Let's get back to business:

Sorry for not responding and answering you shortly after in this thread, I was busy going out and making arrangements with some friends and going out and planning what I was going to do for the next exam term I have in September - that I took up my time the day before and yesterday - and I didn't want to write and answer you in the late evening and night hours here because I was unsure of what the exact difference in the timezone hourly gap is and the fact that I didn't want to bother you checking up message threads in the night hours, and also the fact that I felt a little bit too much exhausted and tired after those days to think and write long and in-depth  Hope you can relate and understand!

On 01/09/2022 at 10:13 PM, Mesopotamian said:

Muqtada Alsadar is today the strongest man in Iraq, has a wide populous base, and a militia. He's playing power games though, and it's been many years where he learned that he can have the biggest mass in the street, bigger than any other populous mass. 

He seems to be playing power games, reminding everyone that in case they don't take what he wants in account, he's going to be causing chaos.

Now his political wing won the election,  yet other political Shiite are not letting him also have a subordinate as the Iraqi PM. That would be solidifying his position as the ultimate leader of IRaq, making him sort of similar to the Iranian situation, and for that, he actually gave his followers 24 hour to do whatever they want to do, by claiming that he resigned from his post. Next day, and after they turned Baghdad into a complete chaos, he went on TV and expressed his dissapointment in his ,militia and followers! ordering them to go home in less than 60 minutes! As if he had nothing to do with what was happening! 

Interesting. I had a discussion with a friend the other day who is a bit of a know about, about this topic, about the context of relatively recent historical events in Iraqi politics, and he told me if I understood correctly that this al-Sadr guy had acquired a religious status of an ayatollah himself in the context of the Shiite faith if that is true from religiological and factographic perspective and not a false assumption and claim, and implicit backing of Iran up until a point. He also told me that because of the relative power vacuum leftover by the devastation of the Islamic State (ISIS) in Iraq and the role of Iranian Quds Revolutionary Guard Special Forces in militarily defeating it and dismantling it, that as a result of the aftermath of that, Iran has, and the overall type of its Shiite-dominated religious cleric government there, garnered a relatively very popular and favorable status among the Shiite population of Iraq, to the point that Iranian Revolutionary Guard regular and special forces are allowed and almost implicitly understood in an informal agreement, between them and the populace and their religious militia there, to be able to almost pass virtually unchallenged, unrestrictedly and without a bat of an eye through the borders of Shiite religious regions of Iraq going straight through them then into Syria and Lebanon if they so wish, with some minimum border checks and regulations there between Iraq and Iran in those said regions. 

So it seems like at a cursory glance at what you explained to me and wrote that that al-Sadr guy maybe is in some ways possibly more deeply connected and in touch with the religious power structures currently residing in Iran and maybe using them as a sort of legitimization tool and conduit for garnering approval and support for his Shiite follower base in Iraq, if I am not too mistaken to assume and speculate that, albeit without any solid proof or evidence from my side still backing that claim, on a relatively still flimsy and loose connection and hypothesis.

Perhaps he was just testing the waters for his support among the Iraqi Shiite population overall with that call to that armed uprising brief attempt and stunt of his and to maybe see how far willing is Iran also ready to go to possibly back him and support him.

On 01/09/2022 at 10:13 PM, Mesopotamian said:

That's true, there was sever fire in the "not-so-green" zone.. it continued for the whole night until he appeared again on TV the next day at around 12 PM maybe?

So what's happening is that now everyone is complementing him and sort of sucking up to him for ordering his followers to go home, even his rivals, and the Iraqi president, and current PM, they are all applauding him for that!

Now we are in the next phase, are they going to listen to what he wants and go to a new election? 

It is really dark and complicated, yet after the chaos night, I believe everybody is going to try to take what he wants in account in order not to upset him again..

 

Also his resignation came as a reaction for his deceased father's friend and disciple,  himself a religious man living in Iran, and the latter when he resigned, he said that Muqtada doesn't represent his father anyways, and that all the current followers of Muqtada and his deceased father should follow the Iranian Murshad Khaminie.. And that's when Muqtada made a statement, scolding that man, and announcing resignation, and that's when the chaos started and storming the green zone...

 

Yet Basically, as I stated before, Iraq is probably the biggest looting operation in the history of humanity, and at the end, everybody is going to come together so that the oil flow continues..

Today I've read headlines that even the US is making statements that goes with some Muqtada's Demands.

Maybe the storming government and officials building's stunt was an attempt at a show of loyalty to Iran? Possibly? Maybe? Perhaps? And also to send a clear message maybe to his rivals among his Shiite support base in Iraq of how much influence and support he really has among them and to whom they are willing enough to truly support, back, and make daring stunts and attempts for, through a show of a general call to an uprising among that part of the population.

But if the oil flow export continuity is the sine qua non for the stability generally for the mutual respect for plurality and degrees of tolerance and mutual co-operative co-existence of Iraqi politics, as you say,  I don't think, IMO, just shared concerns and economic survival interests alone of continuing to reap the benefits indefinitely, and without a further plan for future economic transformation, transition and also further re-organization and re-structuring, of that type of that raw material and natural resources export-heavy and intensive dependent economy can be the only predictable binding factor there if there are sudden eruptions and disruptions in the world market for that, not indefinite guarantee for stability there to be suddenly pulled like a rug underneath the stability for the whole political scene there if some massive changes and transitions happen in the meantime on the world demand market or some massive world economic organization crisis erupts in the years to come.

But hopefully, it doesn't soon and the worst possible imagined outcomes don't come to pass, and some people like yourself still have plenty enough time left in the meantime to keep their options open for elsewhere, for temporary residency or migration in the world for example, until things would stabilize themselves there and truly transform the diverse, and often at conflicting interests odds, society there and solidify for good, to make Iraq a very wanted and sought after destination and a prosperous region like some other states in the Middle East. Hopefully, I wish for that to come to pass as soon as possible rather than later for you as well!

Edited September 4, 2022 by Fleetinglife

[Mesopotamian]

On 9/4/2022 at 1:39 PM, Fleetinglife said:

I had a discussion with a friend the other day who is a bit of a know about, about this topic, about the context of relatively recent historical events in Iraqi politics, and he told me if I understood correctly that this al-Sadr guy had acquired a religious status of an ayatollah himself in the context of the Shiite faith if that is true from religiological and factographic perspective and not a false assumption and claim, 

Hello again! sorry for the delay. For the above, well, we can assume that he's a mimi-ayatollah for Iraq, and certainly trying to compete with giants who are not only older than him, but also more knowledgeable and reputable. The thing that gave him a push is that his dad was a reputable cleric whom allegedly was killed by Saddam Hussain's guys, and this is where he is gaining the authority from.

and yes he was backed by Iran until late. In the following photo, you can see him siting between the Iranian Ayatollah, and General Sulaimani who was assassinated by a US drone strike

Yet right now, it seems that the honeymoon has ended, and that's when his father's disciple who himself living in Iran decided to resign from his post, and in his final statement, he said that all Muhammed Alsadir followers in Iraq (Muqtada's assassinated dad) should follow the Iranian Ayatollah.

On 9/4/2022 at 1:39 PM, Fleetinglife said:

He also told me that because of the relative power vacuum leftover by the devastation of the Islamic State (ISIS) in Iraq and the role of Iranian Quds Revolutionary Guard Special Forces in militarily defeating it and dismantling it, that as a result of the aftermath of that, Iran has, and the overall type of its Shiite-dominated religious cleric government there, garnered a relatively very popular and favorable status among the Shiite population of Iraq, to the point that Iranian Revolutionary Guard regular and special forces are allowed and almost implicitly understood in an informal agreement, between them and the populace and their religious militia there, to be able to almost pass virtually unchallenged, unrestrictedly and without a bat of an eye through the borders of Shiite religious regions of Iraq going straight through them then into Syria and Lebanon if they so wish, with some minimum border checks and regulations there between Iraq and Iran in those said regions. 

I mean this could be true yes, although there are no solid reports of that and I haven't heard or seen any videos of such operations. What's better is just flying directly to Syria over Iraq using civilian jets and going undetected.

On 9/4/2022 at 1:39 PM, Fleetinglife said:

So it seems like at a cursory glance at what you explained to me and wrote that that al-Sadr guy maybe is in some ways possibly more deeply connected and in touch with the religious power structures currently residing in Iran and maybe using them as a sort of legitimization tool and conduit for garnering approval and support for his Shiite follower base in Iraq, if I am not too mistaken to assume and speculate that, albeit without any solid proof or evidence from my side still backing that claim, on a relatively still flimsy and loose connection and hypothesis.

I recently knew about his dad's disciple https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kazem_al-Haeri , a "true knowledge seeker" and his resignation and last statement in which he challenged Muqtada's eligibility .

Basically Mr. Muqtada has authority as an heir of his dad. (Link to his dad's page : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_al-Sadr 

On 9/4/2022 at 1:39 PM, Fleetinglife said:

Maybe the storming government and officials building's stunt was an attempt at a show of loyalty to Iran? Possibly? Maybe? Perhaps?

no not really, Muqtada won like 70 seats in the recent election, yet the other Shiite wing who has stronger ties with Iran wanted to deprive him the chance to form the government, and the armed wing of that political wing started shooting at his followers at that night.

On 9/4/2022 at 1:39 PM, Fleetinglife said:

But if the oil flow export continuity is the sine qua non for the stability generally for the mutual respect for plurality and degrees of tolerance and mutual co-operative co-existence of Iraqi politics, as you say,  I don't think, IMO, just shared concerns and economic survival interests alone of continuing to reap the benefits indefinitely, and without a further plan for future economic transformation, transition and also further re-organization and re-structuring, of that type of that raw material and natural resources export-heavy and intensive dependent economy can be the only predictable binding factor there if there are sudden eruptions and disruptions in the world market for that, not indefinite guarantee for stability there to be suddenly pulled like a rug underneath the stability for the whole political scene there if some massive changes and transitions happen in the meantime on the world demand market or some massive world economic organization crisis erupts in the years to come.

The country is run on bigotry and injustice and nobody actually cares for the future as long as everyone is getting their share of the treasure. All the security forces are there shutting the mouths of people on behalf of the whole world, suppressing and killing those who have opinions, I can see ISIS was probably a cry for justice, where the Iraqi government was really overthrown once more time by people driving Toyota pick ups, but then this government was restored and protected once again by sheer force, in the meantime tens of thousands were killed, millions were displaced, just in order for the corrupt government to come back to rule Iraq once more and for the oil to continue to flow.

On 9/4/2022 at 1:39 PM, Fleetinglife said:

But hopefully, it doesn't soon and the worst possible imagined outcomes don't come to pass, and some people like yourself still have plenty enough time left in the meantime to keep their options open for elsewhere, for temporary residency or migration in the world for example, until things would stabilize themselves there and truly transform the diverse, and often at conflicting interests odds, society there and solidify for good, to make Iraq a very wanted and sought after destination and a prosperous region like some other states in the Middle East. Hopefully, I wish for that to come to pass as soon as possible rather than later for you as well!

It is looking more and more that my ultimate goal for now is to leave Iraq forever, and I am trying to make plans for this. This country is going to go down, and one day, the US is going to find out that it is better not to get drunk on oil unless people who control it truly reform themselves and their corruption

[Fleetinglife]

4 hours ago, Mesopotamian said:

Hello again! sorry for the delay. For the above, well, we can assume that he's a mimi-ayatollah for Iraq, and certainly trying to compete with giants who are not only older than him, but also more knowledgeable and reputable. The thing that gave him a push is that his dad was a reputable cleric whom allegedly was killed by Saddam Hussain's guys, and this is where he is gaining the authority from.

and yes he was backed by Iran until late. In the following photo, you can see him siting between the Iranian Ayatollah, and General Sulaimani who was assassinated by a US drone strike

Yet right now, it seems that the honeymoon has ended, and that's when his father's disciple who himself living in Iran decided to resign from his post, and in his final statement, he said that all Muhammed Alsadir followers in Iraq (Muqtada's assassinated dad) should follow the Iranian Ayatollah.

I mean this could be true yes, although there are no solid reports of that and I haven't heard or seen any videos of such operations. What's better is just flying directly to Syria over Iraq using civilian jets and going undetected.

I recently knew about his dad's disciple https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kazem_al-Haeri , a "true knowledge seeker" and his resignation and last statement in which he challenged Muqtada's eligibility .

Basically Mr. Muqtada has authority as an heir of his dad. (Link to his dad's page : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_al-Sadr 

no not really, Muqtada won like 70 seats in the recent election, yet the other Shiite wing who has stronger ties with Iran wanted to deprive him the chance to form the government, and the armed wing of that political wing started shooting at his followers at that night.

The country is run on bigotry and injustice and nobody actually cares for the future as long as everyone is getting their share of the treasure. All the security forces are there shutting the mouths of people on behalf of the whole world, suppressing and killing those who have opinions, I can see ISIS was probably a cry for justice, where the Iraqi government was really overthrown once more time by people driving Toyota pick ups, but then this government was restored and protected once again by sheer force, in the meantime tens of thousands were killed, millions were displaced, just in order for the corrupt government to come back to rule Iraq once more and for the oil to continue to flow.

It is looking more and more that my ultimate goal for now is to leave Iraq forever, and I am trying to make plans for this. This country is going to go down, and one day, the US is going to find out that it is better not to get drunk on oil unless people who control it truly reform themselves and their corruption

Hey Meso thanks for taking the time of informing me, explaining to me and elucidating me on some of the things related to this topic of the current dynamics of Iraqi politics, internally and externally internationally, from the on the ground experiential and field empirical perspective. 

I will answer you shortly when I have the time again in more detail on some of my thoughts on each of the points and stuff that you said, wrote and asseerted here about this topic in question and how I view from an outsider's perspective, not living in there experience perspective, but from an attempt of drawing together and putting forward a comparative analysis connective thread on the similarities between yours and my countries of origin and upbringing background relatively recent political history and experience, and trying to form a relatable experientially similar connected vein that way in attempt of discussing it more in depth and throughly, and for it to seem more experientially relatable and to sound more similar and familiar from your experiential point of view as well! 

So I will get back to you in attempt of going through and discussing relatively more in detail on the last things you said and asserted here, once finish I some nearly impending stuff and obligations I have unrelated to that for some of the things I have regarding the studies on my faculty. 

Hope you can understand, I will get back to you here as soon as I finish that, no need for you to apologise as well for the delay in answering, I am myself more guilty of that more often than not than most people I presume ? So no need to ever apologise to me regarding that in this context, I would like myself to think and hold a value assertion that's it's never actually a delay or a late reply or response if it's for a good reason for a person's life! ?

Edited September 5, 2022 by Fleetinglife