why psychedelics can allow some people to awaken and others not?

[Naol]

Hi There, 

I am wondering why it seems that psychedelics are allowing me and other people to awaken to some truth, but does not seem to generate awakenings for others. I just had an awakening a few minutes ago (and others by the past) and it seems that shrooms ALWAYS lead me to awakenings, if I put myself in the right conditions (alone, in a cosy room, feeling secure). But when I listen to McKenna for example, I feel like he did not have that much profound awakenings, I think that is why Leo puts him in green stade (spiral dynamics). How is that possible as he took so much mushrooms and other psychedelics? I was also listening to his brother, and had the same feeling, thus he is taking a lot of psychedelics too. Plus, my bf is also taking psychedelics, but he does not seem to have awakenings like I have. I think he has some stronger feeling of being and make sense of a lot of stuff in his life thanks to mushrooms, but it is not that much about the nature of consciousness. Strong dosing, same setup, we are both listening to Leo since a long time now and are very open to his understanding of what God is.

So...How to explain that some people seem to awaken more easily to some truth thanks to psychedelics and others don't? Is that just a story about how open you are and how much you want to know the truth? Any thoughts about that? @Leo Gura do you have some ideas? 

PS : Do you know if Peter Ralston really tried psychedelics seriously? I do not understand what makes him think that psychedelics cannot lead to truth? Really curious about that, coz I thought about this strongly during my trip and I don't see what could be superior to the truth I realized, or how it could be an illusion. 

Thank you! 

Sorry if my english is not amazing, I am not a native

Edited August 27, 2022 by Naol

[Carlos Cardenas]

Getting prepared before the psychedelics consumpsion helps to have more profound experiences. Some of the suggestions for getting prepared include: no meat, no alcohol, no coffee or tea or other stimulants, no sex, no drugs several days before.

12 hours ago, Naol said:

Sorry if my english is not amazing, I am not a native

What is your first language?, btw.

[Naol]

Yes that could explain a small part, but that is still is far from explaining it completely... I am French

[Carl-Richard]

McKenna had a period where he was scared away from psychedelics. I think he started hitting on the more spiritual ramifications of tripping, and he didn't like it. I believe McKenna used psychedelics primarily as an insight-making tool, of the intellectual and visionary kind, not as a self-help tool. So intention and cultural machinery matters a lot. You might hit on the same insights without it (like I think McKenna did), but you might interpret them differently and find them undesireable, which is of course not a surprise. Hardcore ego deconstruction is no joke.

Edited August 28, 2022 by Carl-Richard

[Tyler Robinson]

Just now, Carl-Richard said:

McKenna had a period where he was scared away from psychedelics. I think he started hitting on the more spiritual ramifications of tripping, and he didn't like it. I believe McKenna used psychedelics primarily as an insight-making tool, of the intellectual and visionary kind, not as a self-help tool. So intention and cultural machinery matters a lot. You might hit on the same insights without it (like I think McKenna did), but you might interpret them differently and find them undesireable, which is really not a surprise. Hardcore ego deconstruction doesn't come naturally to everyone.

What teachings of McKenna resonated with you the most?

 

[Leo Gura]

19 hours ago, Naol said:

I am wondering why it seems that psychedelics are allowing me and other people to awaken to some truth, but does not seem to generate awakenings for others.

Basically it's function of genetics, metabolism, and brain chemistry. You can't assume these are the same across people. They can be very different.

Quote

 PS : Do you know if Peter Ralston really tried psychedelics seriously? I do not understand what makes him think that psychedelics cannot lead to truth? Really curious about that, coz I thought about this strongly during my trip and I don't see what could be superior to the truth I realized, or how it could be an illusion. 

He has tried some. I think his problem is simply that his brain chemistry isn't suited to it or they have not much effect on him.

This does happen. Some people have very high tolerances or just not much happens.

Ralston is an unusual guy so you shouldn't expect this brain chemistry to be normal. He's basically a freak of nature. This can have its pros and cons. He has certain strengths and weaknesses, as we all do.

Edited August 28, 2022 by Leo Gura

[Carl-Richard]

2 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

What teachings of McKenna resonated with you the most?

[Tyler Robinson]

11 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

I kinda came to similar conclusions during my contemplations. 

 

[Inliytened1]

21 hours ago, Naol said:

Hi There, 

I am wondering why it seems that psychedelics are allowing me and other people to awaken to some truth, but does not seem to generate awakenings for others. I just had an awakening a few minutes ago (and others by the past) and it seems that shrooms ALWAYS lead me to awakenings, if I put myself in the right conditions (alone, in a cosy room, feeling secure). But when I listen to McKenna for example, I feel like he did not have that much profound awakenings, I think that is why Leo puts him in green stade (spiral dynamics). How is that possible as he took so much mushrooms and other psychedelics? I was also listening to his brother, and had the same feeling, thus he is taking a lot of psychedelics too. Plus, my bf is also taking psychedelics, but he does not seem to have awakenings like I have. I think he has some stronger feeling of being and make sense of a lot of stuff in his life thanks to mushrooms, but it is not that much about the nature of consciousness. Strong dosing, same setup, we are both listening to Leo since a long time now and are very open to his understanding of what God is.

So...How to explain that some people seem to awaken more easily to some truth thanks to psychedelics and others don't? Is that just a story about how open you are and how much you want to know the truth? Any thoughts about that? @Leo Gura do you have some ideas? 

PS : Do you know if Peter Ralston really tried psychedelics seriously? I do not understand what makes him think that psychedelics cannot lead to truth? Really curious about that, coz I thought about this strongly during my trip and I don't see what could be superior to the truth I realized, or how it could be an illusion. 

Thank you! 

Sorry if my english is not amazing, I am not a native

Genetics and brain chemistry have a lot to do it.  It also depends on if you are ready for God to reveal itself to you.  The psychedelics are just the trigger but awakening was already in place for you.    Same for meditation.

Edited August 28, 2022 by Inliytened1

[Jowblob]

3 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

Genetics and brain chemistry have a lot to do it.  It also depends on if you are ready for God to reveal itself to you.  The psychedelics are just the trigger but awakening was already in place for you.    Same for meditation.

@Inliytened1 When i was on LSD with a friend, it was very clear for me that consciousness was alive. It showed me signs and basically said it only shows what you can handle. Consciousness knows how much information there is in you and what your intentions are, it knows where you are in evolution. That's why some people experience serious things like awakenings is because they're ready for it and they can handle it, for others it's just fun and so on is because they're unconscious.

[BlessedLion]

On 8/27/2022 at 10:41 AM, Naol said:

Hi There, 

I am wondering why it seems that psychedelics are allowing me and other people to awaken to some truth, but does not seem to generate awakenings for others. I just had an awakening a few minutes ago (and others by the past) and it seems that shrooms ALWAYS lead me to awakenings, if I put myself in the right conditions (alone, in a cosy room, feeling secure). But when I listen to McKenna for example, I feel like he did not have that much profound awakenings, I think that is why Leo puts him in green stade (spiral dynamics). How is that possible as he took so much mushrooms and other psychedelics? I was also listening to his brother, and had the same feeling, thus he is taking a lot of psychedelics too. Plus, my bf is also taking psychedelics, but he does not seem to have awakenings like I have. I think he has some stronger feeling of being and make sense of a lot of stuff in his life thanks to mushrooms, but it is not that much about the nature of consciousness. Strong dosing, same setup, we are both listening to Leo since a long time now and are very open to his understanding of what God is.

So...How to explain that some people seem to awaken more easily to some truth thanks to psychedelics and others don't? Is that just a story about how open you are and how much you want to know the truth? Any thoughts about that? @Leo Gura do you have some ideas? 

PS : Do you know if Peter Ralston really tried psychedelics seriously? I do not understand what makes him think that psychedelics cannot lead to truth? Really curious about that, coz I thought about this strongly during my trip and I don't see what could be superior to the truth I realized, or how it could be an illusion. 

Thank you! 

Sorry if my english is not amazing, I am not a native

I once took mushrooms and was shown how reality is a hallucination and woke up to God, another guy with me took the same dose and said all he saw was blackness for 3 hours and he was just anxious…
 

This is a great question I have wondered about myself. What’s confusing about your situation is that your bf and you both watched Leo’s videos and are open to the ideas of God and for me, that’s what I think sets that ground for an awakening on psychedelics. 
 

I also think dosage matters, but I’m going to be old school with it and state that it is a karmic and spiritual matter. You are only shown what you are ready for and what the universe/God wants you to see

 

Even when speaking about Enlightenment Ralston and Hawkins and many other great teachers say that “it is revealed to you, there’s nothing you do to create it” 

 

TLDR; It’s up to God and your spiritual karma

[BlessedLion]

17 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Basically it's function of genetics, metabolism, and brain chemistry. You can't assume these are the same across people. They can be very different.

He has tried some. I think his problem is simply that his brain chemistry isn't suited to it or they have not much effect on him.

This does happen. Some people have very high tolerances or just not much happens.

Ralston is an unusual guy so you shouldn't expect this brain chemistry to be normal. He's basically a freak of nature. This can have its pros and cons. He has certain strengths and weaknesses, as we all do.

Ralston blows my mind, I’m on his third book right now and I had an awakening sober from reading the first 20% of it. 
 

It’s not like any other books you read, it’s like he gets inside your consciousness and wakes you up. It’s almost like a workbook or something. 
 

Id be so interested to see what his psychedelic trips are like. But honestly probably not too much changes. Dude is so fucking conscious 

[puporing]

I think you have to "purify" your mind of the conditionings too to a large extent, deconstruction is required (unless of course you were always doing that since coming to existence). But what makes someone want to do the deconstruction? That's another question.. what is the motivation behind seeking truth or seeing things clearly/for what they really are? Maybe because whatever reality appears to be, to some people it just never seems like it answers their burning questions, nor satisfies them, hence the quest. 

Who's to say you stumbled upon Leo by pure "accident"? What if it was "your will" all along?  

Edited August 29, 2022 by puporing

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

Id be so interested to see what his psychedelic trips are like. But honestly probably not too much changes. Dude is so fucking conscious

He told me that in his youth he did so much LSD once that he couldn't tell if it was night or day. So clearly it affects him.

Edited August 29, 2022 by Leo Gura

[Brivido]

On 27/08/2022 at 6:41 PM, Naol said:

PS : Do you know if Peter Ralston really tried psychedelics seriously? I do not understand what makes him think that psychedelics cannot lead to truth? Really curious about that, coz I thought about this strongly during my trip and I don't see what could be superior to the truth I realized, or how it could be an illusion. 

A few weeks back, I watched one of his videos in which he says that in order to understand if his enlightenment was stable, he tried a massive dose of LSD.

I am pretty sure he did that in order to see if he had "become" Absolute Nothing, pure Consciousness. He wanted to see if he could maintain his awakening even during a deep LSD trip, were forms are changing constantly.

I think this statement explains why he doesn't think psychedelics can lead to awakening. Apparently, he thinks that psychedelics can only change the forms appearing in consciousness, rather than make you realize that you are Consciousness, the substance of every imaginable dream.  

He's obviously wrong, but, at least, now his position makes some sort of sense.

There are a lot of presuppositions on my part, but I thought about this while on 5-meo-malt...

[Leo Gura]

43 minutes ago, Brivido said:

He wanted to see if he could maintain his awakening even during a deep LSD trip

If I'm on a deep trip of LSD, there is zero problem maintaining awakening. The more I take the easier it gets. Lol

The problem is maintaining it when you're doing your taxes.

Edited August 29, 2022 by Leo Gura

[Brivido]

22 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

If I'm on a deep trip of LSD, there is zero problem maintaining awakening.

I get you, but if you want to understand his position, you need to put yourself in his shoes. As you said, Ralston is a freak of nature, that somehow has achieved a deep awakening through manual practice.

His statement makes sense according to his experience: he recognized himself as Consciousness, imagination, and wanted to understand if he could maintain his realization even if the scenery of the dream changed radically, as in an LSD trip.

That's actually a great test to see if you achieved a deep awakening. When you recognize every form as your own Self, you got a deep awakening.

How many people actually understand that everything they experience on a trip it's actually their own imagination, their own Self? Not many.

It took me hundreds of trips to truly get that I am imagination and that everything that I experience during a trip it's just Me. 

[Naol]

Thanks @Brivido, it would indeed explain his position

[Leo Gura]

24 minutes ago, Brivido said:

I get you, but if you want to understand his position, you need to put yourself in his shoes. As you said, Ralston is a freak of nature, that somehow has achieved a deep awakening through manual practice.

His statement makes sense according to his experience: he recognized himself as Consciousness, imagination, and wanted to understand if he could maintain his realization even if the scenery of the dream changed radically, as in an LSD trip.

That's actually a great test to see if you achieved a deep awakening. When you recognize every form as your own Self, you got a deep awakening.

How many people actually understand that everything they experience on a trip it's actually their own imagination, their own Self? Not many.

It took me hundreds of trips to truly get that I am imagination and that everything that I experience during a trip it's just Me. 

Of course I get that logic. But it's just bad logic because LSD doesn't merely change the scenery of your dream, it massively raises consciousness.

The real test of your awakening is not taking psychedelics, but something more akin to torture or getting hit in the head with a hammer.

Can you still maintain your awakening when you don't get enough thyroid hormone for example? Surgically remove your thyroid gland and then stop taking thyroid hormone supplements and see how long you can maintain awakeness without T3. That's your real test.

Or just try not sleeping for 5 days and see how awake you still are then.

Edited August 29, 2022 by Leo Gura

[Yali]

@Leo Gura Are you able to mantain your awakening while doing taxes?

55 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

The problem is maintaining it when you're doing your taxes.