In search of a better definition for be/exist

[Myself]

I am dissatisfied with the definitions of be and exist since their definitions are circular.

In other words the verb be is defined as exist which is defined as be. So essentially the definition of be is be which is a useless definition.

Can we come up with a more profound definition?

What precisely are we expressing when we claim that something "is".

 

For example:

What makes this claim true:

    This sentence exists.

And this claim false:

    This sentence doesn't exist.

 

What is the fundamental difference in your mind between being and not being. 

What condition do all existing things fulfill that all nonexistent things don't?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Someone here]

Existence =being .and being =Existence.  It's a perfect tautology. It's a feature not a bug. Since everything ultimately circles back into itself. 

[Leo Gura]

That's not a bug, that's a feature.

You cannot define Being because Being is Absolute.

The definition of Being is not a verbal one. It is Awakening itself.

The only way you can know what Being is by Awakening, and no other way.

Quote

Can we come up with a more profound definition?

Yes. That's called Awakening.

Quote

What precisely are we expressing when we claim that something "is".

You'll know the moment you Awaken. And not until then.

- - - - - -

You are not appreciating the depth of this matter of Being, is-ness, and existence. You treat it as something trivial.

You cannot be satisfied without Awakening. Nothing finite will ever satisfy you, because you are Infinity.

[Myself]

4 hours ago, Someone here said:

Existence =being .and being =Existence.  It's a perfect tautology. It's a feature not a bug. Since everything ultimately circles back into itself. 

You might as well just say existence is existence. This is true just like red is red, but it is utterly meaningless. It's like saying jogoboy is jogoboy. The question remains what is jogoboy? What is existence? And can you define it with words other than itself?

Edited August 27, 2022 by Myself

[Someone here]

26 minutes ago, Myself said:

You might as well just say existence is existence. This is true just like red is red, but it is utterly meaningless. It's like saying jogoboy is jogoboy. The question remains what is jogoboy? What is existence? And can you define it with words other than itself?

Words are not subtle enough.
Existence cannot be elaborated. It cannot be defined AT ALL .because we only got one existence. So what are you going to define existence relative to, when all that there is ,is existence? 

To define something..you need to have something else in order to define it in terms of that something else...but what else is there but existence?  Hence it cannot be defined.  It can only be experienced . Meaning you can't know it linguistically. Only by direct consciousness/being. 
 

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Myself said:

You might as well just say existence is existence. This is true just like red is red, but it is utterly meaningless.

It's not meaningless.

Believe it or not, you are not conscious yet that A = A. You will only become conscious of it upon Awakening.

[Myself]

23 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It's not meaningless.

Believe it or not, you are not conscious yet that A = A. You will only become conscious of it upon Awakening.

How am I not conscious that A = A? It doesn't equal anything else as far as I understand.

Edited August 27, 2022 by Myself

[Leo Gura]

7 minutes ago, Myself said:

How am I not conscious that A = A? It doesn't equal anything else as far as I understand.

Because you are trying to equate A with B via definition.

To define anything is to say A = B.

You're not yet realizing that reality is undefinable. Everything is itself. A = A, B = B, and so forth. But you have not awoken to the absoluteness of this truth.

It seems so simple and obvious, and yet you are not conscious of it. This is a devilishly tricky matter.

[Myself]

17 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Because you are trying to equate A with B via definition.

To define anything is to say A = B.

You're not yet realizing that reality is undefinable. Everything is itself. A = A, B = B, and so forth. But you have not awoken to the absoluteness of this truth.

It seems so simple and obvious, and yet you are not conscious of it. This is a devilishly tricky matter.

Existence isn't just about things being equal to each other right? The donkey in my room is itself yet it doesn't exist. 

[Inliytened1]

20 hours ago, Myself said:

You might as well just say existence is existence. This is true just like red is red, but it is utterly meaningless. It's like saying jogoboy is jogoboy. The question remains what is jogoboy? What is existence? And can you define it with words other than itself?

You must become it.  You ARE existence.  You are speaking of (speaking - hmm) 2nd order.   1st order is Being.  When we say red is red we are pointing to something.  When we say something is itself we are pointing to something.   There is a shift in Consciousness.  Red isn't just red, red is you.  You ARE red.   Remember the phrase "Be the ball?" Well, I would contemplate that very seriously ? 

Edited August 28, 2022 by Inliytened1

[Myself]

3 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

You must become it.  You ARE existence.  You are speaking of (speaking - hmm) 2nd order.   1st order is Being.  When we say red is red we are pointing to something.  When we say something is itself we are pointing to something.    Red isn't just red, red is you.  You ARE red.   Remember the phrase "Be the ball?" Well, I would contemplate that very seriously ? 

How am I red? 

[Inliytened1]

11 minutes ago, Myself said:

How am I red? 

You are thinking in 2nd order as if red is "other".  When we say red is red we mean at the level of Being.  1st order.  In order to grasp red is red requires becoming red.  At the level of Being all is One.  Being is pure Infinity.

Edited August 28, 2022 by Inliytened1

[Myself]

6 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

You are thinking in 2nd order as if red is "other".  When we say red is red we mean at the level of Being.  1st order.  In order to grasp red is red requires becoming red.  At the level of Being all is One.  Being is pure Infinity.

Is red green?

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, Myself said:

Is red green?

Are you asking me sincerely or are you playing games?  If you are playing games take it elsewhere because that means you are not really interested in discovering Truth for yourself. 

[Myself]

9 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Are you asking me sincerely or are you playing games?  If you are playing games take it elsewhere because that means you are not really interested in discovering Truth for yourself. 

It's a serious question. If all is one and red is all then there is nothing besides red. But there is also green so what do we do with that?

[Inliytened1]

9 minutes ago, Myself said:

It's a serious question. If all is one and red is all then there is nothing besides red. But there is also green so what do we do with that?

Again your conflating 1st and 2nd order.   In 2nd order there are distinctions.  There are differences.   Such as red, green and blue.  But at 1st order all of this collapses into pure oneness.   But at that point you ARE the oneness.  You are not some separate object or entity looking at the oneness because there are no distinctions.   

So to say red is red is to say there is nothing outside It to describe it.  It is itself. 

Edited August 28, 2022 by Inliytened1

[Myself]

10 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Again your conflating 1st and 2nd order.   In 2nd order there are distinctions.  There are differences.   Such as red, green and blue.  But at 1st order all of this collapses into pure oneness.   But at that point you ARE the oneness.  You are not some separate object or entity looking at the oneness because there are no distinctions.   

So to say red is red is to say there is nothing outside It to describe it.  It is itself. 

But red is just a part of reality so I can't be it.

[Inliytened1]

7 minutes ago, Myself said:

But red is just a part of reality so I can't be it.

In a sense that's true because if you understood what was being said here your entire reality would break apart.   But hey you would be God realized ?

 

Edited August 28, 2022 by Inliytened1

[Myself]

8 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

In a sense that's true because if you understood what was being said here your entire reality would break apart.   But hey you would be God realized ?

 

I am the creator of my creation and nothing else.