Mega thread - Discussion of Male role models and list your male role model

[Tyler Robinson]

I have noticed that a lot of guys are complaining about male role models and this seems to be a serious legitimate concern so let's expand the discussion on this key issue. Also list your male role models if you have any. 

 

 

Edited August 25, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Bobby_2021]

Male role models must check every single box of masculine values. Missing out on one or two may be forgiven. Any man that checks all these traits are fit to be role models.

• Charismatic & Social, especially with women.
• Sexual abundance and high status. 
• Able to amass huge wealth to provide for his people. (Rich af)
• Able to win a fight with another man. 
• Best at his craft.
• Intellectual sharpness.
• Generates results fast.
• Integrity and consistency: Man of word. Walks the talk. 

Displays emotional strength. Do not crumble under pressure.

Now how many famous men out there checks on all these. Almost none. Most are soyboys who might accidentally make it to one of these but far too behind in all else. Too weak. 

 

[Tyler Robinson]

8 minutes ago, Bobby_2021 said:

Able to win a fight with another man. 

This part is closer to toxic Masculinity. I don't like to see men fighting with each other. Let's not treat men like animals. 

 

[Ulax]

20 minutes ago, Bobby_2021 said:

Male role models must check every single box of masculine values. Missing out on one or two may be forgiven. Any man that checks all these traits are fit to be role models.

• Charismatic & Social, especially with women.
• Sexual abundance and high status. 
• Able to amass huge wealth to provide for his people. (Rich af)
• Able to win a fight with another man. 
• Best at his craft.
• Intellectual sharpness.
• Generates results fast.
• Integrity and consistency: Man of word. Walks the talk. 

Displays emotional strength. Do not crumble under pressure.

Now how many famous men out there checks on all these. Almost none. Most are soyboys who might accidentally make it to one of these but far too behind in all else. Too weak. 

 

@Bobby_2021 Disagree.

That just sounds mostly like stage orange and red role models to me.

Edit: If you were just stating your personal preference, rather than making an objective claim, then can ignore this post of mine

Edited August 25, 2022 by Ulax

[Pavement]

9 minutes ago, Bobby_2021 said:

Male role models must check every single box of masculine values. Missing out on one or two may be forgiven. Any man that checks all these traits are fit to be role models.

• Charismatic & Social, especially with women.
• Sexual abundance and high status. 
• Able to amass huge wealth to provide for his people. (Rich af)
• Able to win a fight with another man. 
• Best at his craft.
• Intellectual sharpness.
• Generates results fast.
• Integrity and consistency: Man of word. Walks the talk. 

Displays emotional strength. Do not crumble under pressure.

Now how many famous men out there checks on all these. Almost none. Most are soyboys who might accidentally make it to one of these but far too behind in all else. Too weak. 

 

Sounds like the ultimate stage red/orange man. Although I agree with the integrity and consistency part. 

[Nilsi]

3 hours ago, Tyler Robinson said:

Also list your male role models if you have any. 

 

 

Daniel Schmachtenberger, Jordan Peterson, Andrew Tate, Joe Rogan, Ken Wilber

[Ulax]

For me:

Leo Gura

Michael Sartain

Derek Scott

Richard Schwartz

Bryan Stephenson

David Tian

Patrick Teahan

Dale Carnegie

Denzel Washington

-----------------

There are some others that do influence me, but I understand a lot of it is unhealthy and mostly wish it didn't influence me as it does.

[Tyler Robinson]

Why is it necessary that guys should have a ton of women drooling over them for them to take a spot as a role model? 

Jordan Peterson has a healthy family life, married a woman he fell in love with, traditional style. 

He is not going around chasing women, but he had a great career and a good head above his shoulders. Isn't that enough? 

This new alpha male epidemic (likes of Tate) have been spreading this new trend where your worth as a man depends on how many women want your tattoo on them. 

Sounds too egoic, insecure, cheap and less grounded in healthy Masculinity. 

Edited August 25, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Kksd74628]

The problem people are making when they judge some men qualities to be orange/red or whatever is that they assosiate those things to something negative that they have in their mind. There really is no downsides of having status, being sharp intellectually and being charismatic for example. Yeah it could be cool to have more other qualities as well, but those listed aren't bad. Why not have all good qualities of all spiral dynamic stages? Instead people should see that stages in spiral dynamics build top of each others and the whole building collapses if the level in under fails.

[Ulax]

4 minutes ago, Kksd74628 said:

The problem people are making when they judge some men qualities to be orange/red or whatever is that they assosiate those things to something negative that they have in their mind. There really is no downsides of having status, being sharp intellectually and being charismatic for example. Yeah it could be cool to have more other qualities as well, but those listed aren't bad. Why not have all good qualities of all spiral dynamic stages? Instead people should see that stages in spiral dynamics build top of each others and the whole building collapses if the level in under fails.

@Kksd74628 I agree somewhat.

However, I think the main issues for a lot of men is that they think orange/ red things will bring them fulfilment and/or they engage in unhealthy versions of orange/ red.

Edited August 25, 2022 by Ulax

[Pavement]

@Kksd74628 yes. Why can’t we have all the good qualities of every stage? Would b nice. the problem is when people think that if you don’t have only those orange qualities then you’re weak or not a real man.  It’s very troublesome.  I’m sick of men having to suppress their emotions causing it to seep out in other toxic ways. 

[Kksd74628]

@Ulax

When you obtain something that you lacked you're going to feel somehow fulfilled and because nowadays men lack lot of masculine side, there has been this masculine movement if it could be phrased like that. I see fulfillment and feeling whole as synonyms and that's why I also think that if you want to be fulfilled you need to train all areas in your life. You should work on the things that you suck the most to make greatest change overall and from that perspective most of men should build themselves to be stronger, because it seems that this quality is missing from majority of men.

[Ulax]

@Kksd74628 How do you define stronger?

[Kksd74628]

@Ulax

All the ways, but maybe the most important thing is to have strong, confident and clear mindset.

[Ulax]

@Kksd74628 I pretty much agree.

What do you believe men need to do to cultivate that  mindset?

[Kksd74628]

@Ulax

There is lot to this thing and having long voice conversation about this is needed to explain it to make justice to my point, but I could give brief explanation about it. To be confident you need something to be confident about. That means you have to work on something, have dreams and achieve them. To be clear you need to know your values, passions and have knowledge to pursue those listed. To be strong you have to do that which you say, always. It doesn't matter if your hand falls to the ground you have to complete your task that you started.

[Nilsi]

25 minutes ago, Kksd74628 said:

Why not have all good qualities of all spiral dynamic stages? 

Exactly. That's the point of TIER 2.

Edited August 25, 2022 by Nilsi

[Ulax]

6 minutes ago, Kksd74628 said:

@Ulax

There is lot to this thing and having long voice conversation about this is needed to explain it to make justice to my point, but I could give brief explanation about it. To be confident you need something to be confident about. That means you have to work on something, have dreams and achieve them. To be clear you need to know your values, passions and have knowledge to pursue those listed. To be strong you have to do that which you say, always. It doesn't matter if your hand falls to the ground you have to complete your task that you started.

@Kksd74628 Sounds good. I think these are all important.

However, I do see trauma recovery as missing from the conversation. A lot of men have trauma, and don't address it - many successful ones too. Men cannot become fulfilled without integrating stage green effectively, which is where the majority of trauma recovery must come from.

If someone outlines a path to fulfilment for men that does not include stage green integration, then that path simply will not work.

[Nilsi]

8 minutes ago, Ulax said:

@Kksd74628 Sounds good. I think these are all important.

However, I do see trauma recovery as missing from the conversation. A lot of men have trauma, and don't address it - many successful ones too. Men cannot become fulfilled without integrating stage green effectively, which is where the majority of trauma recovery must come from.

If someone outlines a path to fulfilment for men that does not include stage green integration, then that path simply will not work.

Why does the majority of trauma work have to come from "stage green?" There is more to trauma integration than butterflies and rainbows. If that's what works for you, and what you need, cool, but don't be so myopic. I'd say most men just need to get laid from time to time and do some hard shit, and all will be good again. I hate to say this, believe me, but it's just what it is. Of course there is more serious trauma, but that's not what the majority of people are dealing with.

Edited August 25, 2022 by Nilsi

[Kksd74628]

@Ulax

Usually the best way to overcome trauma is to prove your trauma wrong showing yourself that you're very capable. There are lot of other methods and some approaches work for some and different to others. So people should contemplate what makes them feel that they're weak and then do things needed to change that picture of themself. Whatever it takes you should do it. And like @Nilsi said you don't necessarily need to do that work solely using stage green perspective. What I am talking about is what works for majority of the cases.