How Do You Deal With False Accusations When Doing Pickup?

[Brent Rothwell]

I was on a quiet but crowded train today heading home when out of nowhere a beautiful girl suddenly gets on board and sits in a vacant seat nearby.
I instantly get up knowing that it's now or never and make my way over to her and begin my approach. I politely tell her that I think she's very pretty and that I'd like to know if she'd be interested in dating me, she responds by
saying "ok".

So I sit next to her and try to start a conversation but she's only responding with short one-word answers and there is a small crowd of people on the train looking at us at the same time which is creating a lot of tension. Shortly after I realize that this conversation is going nowhere because the girl is hardly responding so I leave the interaction and walk over to the exit to get off the train but while I'm waiting at the exit for the doors to open I notice a group of girls coming over to the girl that I was just talking to and asking her if she was ok. They were also giving me these horrible looks as well like I just did something horrible. I then realized that they think that I'm a bad guy so I try to approach the group and tell them that I was just trying to be friendly and one of the girls interrupts me and shouts out "I DON'T GIVE A FUCK!" with an aggressive tone of voice.

Now I'm really worried that they are going to report me to the police and accuse me of sexual harassment or assault. And if it doesn't happen then I'm worried that I'm going to eventually get a criminal record if I continue doing pickup. 

This is only what happens in an extreme minority of approaches though, it's important for me to point that out.

So far I've done about 350 approaches since I started doing this about a year and a half ago. The vast majority of my cold approaches go well, where I go in direct and politely state my intentions and the girl usually smiles and continues talking in some cases, or in most cases says "thank you but I've
got a boyfriend", and so I say ok and move on. 

However, a very small minority of approaches go catastrophically wrong like this one and I get a hostile reaction either from the girl or from the surrounding audience and I'm finding it so hard to deal with.
This is because it seems completely unavoidable, it's like a mathematical certainty that if you keep approaching more and more women you will eventually approach the wrong person at the wrong time with dire consequences.

During my first 100 approaches for example I tried approaching a girl that was standing at the entrance of the city's central station. I thought this would be a good spot to approach because it has high foot traffic. But as I make my way over to her a group of police officers that were patrolling the area coincidentally walked around the corner that was right behind where the girl was standing. I decide to go ahead with the approach anyway and they responded by stopping what they were doing and watched me very closely, then right after I politely introduced myself to the girl they quickly marched over and stood in between me and
the girl and started acting very hostile and aggressive toward me. 

Accusing me of making the girl uncomfortable. Luckily I didn't get arrested or charged but these hostile interactions, are extremely stressful and the other people involved don't care about seeing things from your point of view and instead think that you are just a criminal.
 

Edited August 21, 2022 by Brent Rothwell

[mr_engineer]

You should've run the moment you saw them giving you bad looks. The self-justification will usually run you deeper into the ground. And it'll be harder to recover from that, socially. 

Most women are neurotic about harassers. Especially if they themselves are codependent and socially anxious. You shouldn't approach someone who's socially anxious. I know, there are those people who say that 'They'll thank you if you talk to them'. But, mostly, they're alone cuz they want to be alone. And that's what you got told by the girl who shouted at you, basically. 

This is why I don't do pick-up, quite honestly. Cuz of the worst-case scenarios. I'd rather go to environments where connecting with each other is more socially acceptable. 

Edited August 21, 2022 by mr_engineer

[universe]

Laugh about it.

No reason to focus on the negative. It's human to do it but you'll get much more out of life when you can focus on the positive.

[Federico del pueblo]

3 hours ago, KH2 said:

A lot of people are emotional wrecks with personal problems, and they overeact to minor situations.

Man you wouldn't believe how long it took me to realize that.

What a blessing to know that most of these people are just full of insecuries, problems and will just project tons of their own stuff on you.

[something_else]

Have you ever had people try to talk to you on crowded public transport before? Did you enjoy it? No, you probably thought they were a bit weird and wanted them to leave you alone. It's embarrassing and annoying most of the time, even if you don't have social anxiety.

I keep all my 'approaching' to places where it's socially acceptable to go up and talk to new people and I've almost never had a hostile reaction in my life. Except my 2nd time ever in a club where I was just actually being weird and creepy. 

If you can 'not give a fuck' your way through this then more power to you but be careful you don't end up blaming people for reacting badly, because you are doing something that is inherently quite against the norm, potentially threatening and likely to stir up some often well-deserved negative reactions from people.

[flowboy]

4 hours ago, Brent Rothwell said:

I was on a quiet but crowded train today heading home when out of nowhere a beautiful girl suddenly gets on board and sits in a vacant seat nearby.
I instantly get up knowing that it's now or never and make my way over to her and begin my approach. I politely tell her that I think she's very pretty and that I'd like to know if she'd be interested in dating me, she responds by
saying "ok".

So I sit next to her and try to start a conversation but she's only responding with short one-word answers and there is a small crowd of people on the train looking at us at the same time which is creating a lot of tension. Shortly after I realize that this conversation is going nowhere because the girl is hardly responding so I leave the interaction and walk over to the exit to get off the train but while I'm waiting at the exit for the doors to open I notice a group of girls coming over to the girl that I was just talking to and asking her if she was ok. They were also giving me these horrible looks as well like I just did something horrible. I then realized that they think that I'm a bad guy so I try to approach the group and tell them that I was just trying to be friendly and one of the girls interrupts me and shouts out "I DON'T GIVE A FUCK!" with an aggressive tone of voice.

Now I'm really worried that they are going to report me to the police and accuse me of sexual harassment or assault. And if it doesn't happen then I'm worried that I'm going to eventually get a criminal record if I continue doing pickup. 

This is only what happens in an extreme minority of approaches though, it's important for me to point that out.

So far I've done about 350 approaches since I started doing this about a year and a half ago. The vast majority of my cold approaches go well, where I go in direct and politely state my intentions and the girl usually smiles and continues talking in some cases, or in most cases says "thank you but I've
got a boyfriend", and so I say ok and move on. 

However, a very small minority of approaches go catastrophically wrong like this one and I get a hostile reaction either from the girl or from the surrounding audience and I'm finding it so hard to deal with.
This is because it seems completely unavoidable, it's like a mathematical certainty that if you keep approaching more and more women you will eventually approach the wrong person at the wrong time with dire consequences.

During my first 100 approaches for example I tried approaching a girl that was standing at the entrance of the city's central station. I thought this would be a good spot to approach because it has high foot traffic. But as I make my way over to her a group of police officers that were patrolling the area coincidentally walked around the corner that was right behind where the girl was standing. I decide to go ahead with the approach anyway and they responded by stopping what they were doing and watched me very closely, then right after I politely introduced myself to the girl they quickly marched over and stood in between me and
the girl and started acting very hostile and aggressive toward me. 

Accusing me of making the girl uncomfortable. Luckily I didn't get arrested or charged but these hostile interactions, are extremely stressful and the other people involved don't care about seeing things from your point of view and instead think that you are just a criminal.
 

This only went bad because you couldn’t let it go. The moment you start defending yourself to her friends who don’t want you around, it becomes harassing. It makes sense that you got the reaction you did, because you in essence prioritised your ego and being right over their comfort and boundaries.

So just walk away when you don’t feel interest and you’ll be fine

[Raze]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8ryvgNkncc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMChZC2fopI

Maybe don’t do the direct approach when in an area where the woman can’t leave like a train. Instead just have a normal conversation and wait for IOI’s.

also first have conversations with other people to create a social vibe so she doesn’t feel signaled out.

Edited August 21, 2022 by Raze

[Thought Art]

If your on the bus try talking before you sit write next to her

even ask permission 

just to be safe don’t approach when she can’t escape you I guess

Edited August 21, 2022 by Thought Art

[Tyler Robinson]

Do it in socially acceptable places. 

Don't go into public places because it can be considered as harassment. 

It can annoy people.. 

 

[Emotionalmosquito]

I made a thread about exactly this kind of thing a while ago. It ended up getting locked because apparently I was “spreading fear around dating and pickup” or something. It turns out yes, you can in fact be arrested for this sort of thing but they can’t really charge you with anything if all you’re doing is talking. Unless she actually decides to accuse you of assault. In that case, it’s all up to you to prove your innocence. And that can be very challenging and costly if the interaction wasn’t recorded.

As far as the “you made it worse by trying to explain yourself” idea:

A. I thought women were repulsed by men who cower like spineless wimps at the first sight of trouble 

B. I have a hard time believing it would have saved you any dignity at all by simply aborting the mission earlier. Not with these types of chicks. The type to act and get treated like she just got full on victimized over a basic polite interaction. Not to mention that’s terribly offensive to women who have legitimately been victimized.

[Ulax]

Dude you're good.

Having people yell at you, or tell you to fuck off is abusive behaviour from them, and that shit is on them.

You aren't doing anything abusive by approaching or talking to someone or attempting to stand up for yourself. I'd read, 'When I say no I feel guilty' so that you understand your assertive rights.

Those police officers were acting weird too, unless something about your vibe struck them as a bit off. With the officer's, in future, you can try to do 'seek first to understand then be understood', i.e. repeat back exactly what they said to you in different words. Then I'd leave because you could be dealing with an erratic police officer.

 

[Ulax]

13 hours ago, something_else said:

Have you ever had people try to talk to you on crowded public transport before? Did you enjoy it? No, you probably thought they were a bit weird and wanted them to leave you alone. It's embarrassing and annoying most of the time, even if you don't have social anxiety.

I keep all my 'approaching' to places where it's socially acceptable to go up and talk to new people and I've almost never had a hostile reaction in my life. Except my 2nd time ever in a club where I was just actually being weird and creepy. 

If you can 'not give a fuck' your way through this then more power to you but be careful you don't end up blaming people for reacting badly, because you are doing something that is inherently quite against the norm, potentially threatening and likely to stir up some often well-deserved negative reactions from people.

You can always blame people for reacting badly, imo.

People can tell you to leave. Or that they don't like you. That's cool.

But if they start yelling at you that they don't give a fuck, that is abusive behaviour, and that's on them.

 

[integral]

350 how much success have you had?

Also what did you say?  lol

[integral]

17 hours ago, Brent Rothwell said:

I politely tell her that I think she's very pretty and that I'd like to know if she'd be interested in dating me, she responds by
saying "ok".

This is terrible, nowhere does it say to do this in any pick up book or video or culture. They advise strongly not to do this.

if someone approached me like that I would think they're mentally ill. it's that bad of an opener. I would want them to stop talking to me immediately, that is the feeling that it induces in woman. 

Edited August 22, 2022 by integral

[Roy]

Unless you look like Brad Pitt you aren't going to get away with stuff like that. Just stay in your lane, or at the very least be careful.

No matter how ethical, honest, or logical you are - you are not going to win a fight against the culture other people are infected with. It's an overpowering amorphous collective ego. It's like trying to slash a sword through water, it will just envelope you.

Sometimes there is no way to "deal" with things. You simply avoid them.

[something_else]

5 hours ago, Ulax said:

You can always blame people for reacting badly, imo.

People can tell you to leave. Or that they don't like you. That's cool.

But if they start yelling at you that they don't give a fuck, that is abusive behaviour, and that's on them.

 

No, because they are acting in their best interest to protect themselves. From their perspective you are likely a threat if you’re trying to engage them in places people don’t normally mix socially. like @Roy said, you are fighting collective ego and culture which is a silly fight to take

It comes across as being super socially uncalibrated and that’s on you, not them. Obviously if you just try and talk to someone normally in a busy train and they pepper spray you that’s an overreaction, but if they tell you to fuck off or get lost I’d say that’s honestly a perfectly acceptable reaction.

[Ulax]

@something_else I think we have a difference of opinions

[Brent Rothwell]

Yes, I think that the issue is that I forgot to take into account that different places have different unwritten rules and expectations that the majority of people choose to abide by.
If anybody deviates from this then they are seen as weird and potentially dangerous. So the environment on public transport, for example, is expected to be quiet and no one should be talking
to people they don't know. And then the unwritten rules change at different times and places like in a shopping center or at a party or a classroom or the workplace for example.

But is following all the unwritten rules like everyone else just a conventional way of functioning in the world?

Now I'm wondering if going against the grain of society has benefits as well?
 

Edited August 22, 2022 by Brent Rothwell

[something_else]

18 minutes ago, Brent Rothwell said:

And then the unwritten rules change at different times and places like in a shopping center or at a party or a classroom or the workplace for example.

Yea, for example a busy train on a Friday night when everyone is going on a night out is a different story. Everyone is in a more sociable mood so you can get away with far more.

19 minutes ago, Brent Rothwell said:

But is following all the unwritten rules like everyone else just a conventional way of functioning in the world?

Now I'm wondering if going against the grain of society has benefits as well?

Yes but there are consequences to going too much against the grain as well. Ideally you want a balance of going against the grain and going with the grain. Cool people get this balance of individuality and collectivity spot on which is what you kinda want to do.

[integral]

i'm getting the impression that the majority of the people commenting here have never done pick up.