Amazing tier 2 explanation about the limits and traps of Vedanta

[Salvijus]

@Raptorsin7 did u ever consider those gossips are not true? There are tons of bs about every spiritual teacher on the internet. 

 

[Salvijus]

8 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

I'm always looking for consistency and integrity in the teacher. If something is not in alignment my alarm bells go off.

It looks to me that you're just looking for dirt without being interested in the teaching even ? that's not a good place to start imo.

[axiom]

@Consilience Because a spiritual path usually becomes an attachment in and of itself. It reinforces the idea of the individual, and of being able to do something to get somewhere.

[Raptorsin7]

@Salvijus Well this one I believe because its written by the daughter of the woman with whom he had an affair.

But its possible I'm wrong. And if I'm wrong about that my whole argument is finished

[Raptorsin7]

2 minutes ago, axiom said:

@Consilience Because a spiritual path usually becomes an attachment in and of itself. It reinforces the idea of the individual, and of being able to do something to get somewhere.

Did you get this from Jim Newman/Tony Parsons?

[Salvijus]

13 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Well both things can be true I guess. Wise teaching and poor moral conduct

I doubt he was a pervart. 

If i had to guess money was involved. And where money is involved people become crazy and do things to win some law case to win all that money and jk was really rich. Women do that a lot. At least in the movies  Johnny Depp is a good example.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

13 minutes ago, axiom said:

@Consilience Because a spiritual path usually becomes an attachment in and of itself. It reinforces the idea of the individual, and of being able to do something to get somewhere.

And what if that spiritual path actually leads to disillusionment of any seperate sense of self? Then all of that argument becomes impotent and unimportant imo.

And if u don't follow any spiritual path, your sense of individual self does not get diminished even one inch. So zero progress is being made that way towards eliminating the perception of individual sense of self.

How is that not lame?

Edited July 19, 2022 by Salvijus

[Raptorsin7]

10 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

I doubt he was a pervart. 

If i had to guess money was involved. And where money is involved people become crazy and do things to win some law case to win all that money and jk was really rich. Women do that a lot. At least in the movies  Johnny Depp is a good example.

Lol that makes no sense. How would the daughter of the affair partner get money?

My take is he was like a spirtual philosopher, but didn't resolve the energetic knots of the body that lead to real emotional and psychological growth 

[axiom]

1 minute ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Did you get this from Jim Newman/Tony Parsons?

They do seem to say something very similar. Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj used to say the same thing too. And notably, David Carse - I really enjoyed his book 'Perfect Brilliant Stillness'. But I came to the same conclusions years ago, before I heard of any of these teachers. 

It seems quite obvious that since we do not choose our thoughts, we are merely observers. We don't get to change any outcomes. A spiritual path may be the ultimate illusion in this respect, as it explicitly presents the idea that there is something that can be done. 

[Salvijus]

8 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Lol that makes no sense. 

Lol maybe. I don't even know the actual criticism of him ?. Im shooting in the dark here.

8 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

How would the daughter of the affair partner get money?

Who knows. Made a deal with your mother? Accuse him of bad sexual behavior. Win lots of money. Be happy.

8 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

My take is he was like a spirtual philosopher, but didn't resolve the energetic knots of the body that lead to real emotional and psychological growth 

That's as ridiculous as radiculitis

Your opinion about him and my opinion about him is so...... galaxy of galaxy apart lol. 

If u could see what i can see, thinking he has no integrity would be almost impossible.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Salvijus

[axiom]

2 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

And what if that spiritual path actually leads to disillusionment of any seperate sense of self?

It doesn't. Nothing leads to anything. It's just appearances. You are identifying yourself with the character in the film. To the character, nothing that happens in the film will cause them to "wake up" and realise it's all just a projection.

9 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

How is that not lame?

The idea that is it "lame" is just something you came up with. It has no bearing on reality at all.

[Consilience]

25 minutes ago, axiom said:

@Consilience Because a spiritual path usually becomes an attachment in and of itself. It reinforces the idea of the individual, and of being able to do something to get somewhere.

That‘s a huge misconception. There is most certainly a path, and there is most certainly no one walking it. When this is seen, deeply, it is understood why we should keep walking. 

[axiom]

2 minutes ago, Consilience said:

That‘s a huge misconception. There is most certainly a path, and there is most certainly no one walking it. When this is seen, deeply, it is understood why we should keep walking. 

If there is noone walking the path, then there is noone there who can keep walking.

Edited July 19, 2022 by axiom

[Salvijus]

2 minutes ago, axiom said:

It doesn't. Nothing leads to anything

No no no... change of perception is 100% a real thing. We all experience that we are a seperate self. And that seperate sense of self is an illusion. Illusion means a false perception. So a change of perception from false to true is needed. That is called enlightenment or self realization. An insight/a shift of perception where experience of seperate self is gone.

If u really read this and understand it fully. It fully debunks what u sayed above.

[Salvijus]

6 minutes ago, axiom said:

If there is noone walking the path, then there is noone there who can keep walking.

Yes there is none who walks. But there is an illusion that somebody is walking it. And that illsuion can only be broken when awareness penetrates all illusions and shift of perception happens. For that to happen awareness practices are needed.

Simply understanding that there is no self intelectually makes no difference to your perception. U will still feel like u are a seperate self anyways. And that's what i call ZERO progress. Aka, still deluded as before.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Salvijus

[Breakingthewall]

5 minutes ago, Consilience said:

There is most certainly a path

True, there is a path. But it's magical, and nobody could show you where is it. it appears as it's walked, and it doesn't get anywhere. 

watch out for the beaten path. lead to stiffness

 

[axiom]

@Salvijus

A change of perception appears to happen, yes. Of course. This has nothing to do with awakening though. All apparent changes of perception happen only in the movie / dream.

A change of perception is not needed. Actually, nothing is needed. 

Even if something was needed, nothing could be done about it.

 

 

[Raptorsin7]

@Salvijus Well at least we can agree that one should be very skeptical about neo advaita claims 

[Raptorsin7]

10 minutes ago, axiom said:

@Salvijus

A change of perception appears to happen, yes. Of course. This has nothing to do with awakening though. All apparent changes of perception happen only in the movie / dream.

A change of perception is not needed. Actually, nothing is needed. 

Even if something was needed, nothing could be done about it.

 

 

How certain are you that you haven't deluded yourself?

[Salvijus]

24 minutes ago, axiom said:

@Salvijus

A change of perception appears to happen, yes. Of course. This has nothing to do with awakening though.

Mmmm...

I hope you're still reading what im saying and not just being defensive about it because the energy is going out of hands. Please stay open if u can.

Don't u agree that a perception in which we experience ourselves as seperate is deluded and false? And experience where we experience unity and oneness is real and true perception?

Awakening and change of perception is identical i would say. Awakening simply means you no longer perceive delusions of seperation and u see only truth of one imperishable self. That's exacly what change of perception is about.

24 minutes ago, axiom said:

A change of perception is not needed. Actually, nothing is needed

Even if something was needed, nothing could be done about it.

Disillusionment is needed. And there are methods of how to brake the illusion of separation. It's very easily verifiable imo. Some of these paths have been proven to work for 1000s of years.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Salvijus