Can you tell if a man has sexually assaulted a woman in the past?

[Clabber Girl]

I had two friends that were both assaulted by the same man while drunk a few years ago... They both attended his wedding and were friends with the bride. Never once did they tell her. He was very likable, charming and otherwise an nice, friendly, positive guy to be around. 

It freaks me out that I could in the past or future be with a man who has sexually assaulted someone before. How can I tell the signs of a man who could be a predator in the past? 

Also – how do I stop this fear? 

[Raze]

How did he assault them?

[michaelcycle00]

It's either really obvious or you just can't tell, no middle ground there because a lot of men come off as weird to women in general for various reasons and in the end, they might be harmless or could also have a mental illness. 

Do you suffer from anxiety or have some sort of trauma around relationships or similar? Since there are like a million other things you could go through that are equally as scary if not scarier, why is that one more presently in your mind?

[integral]

4 hours ago, Clabber Girl said:

Never once did they tell her.

It's a huge disservice to all women when women don't speak out or report crimes. They need to protect other women from that guy because he's going to do it again.  The first girl didn't report the crime and so the second girl became a victim.

4 hours ago, Clabber Girl said:

It freaks me out that I could in the past or future be with a man who has sexually assaulted someone before. How can I tell the signs of a man who could be a predator in the past? 

There is nothing to worry about, statistically it's very unlikely that you'll date a guy who is a predator. 

Edited July 18, 2022 by integral

[Leo Gura]

"Sexual assault" is a very loaded phrase. What exactly does this mean to you?

Generally you should screen men for integrity.

[Clabber Girl]

Woman #1 - drunk, he took her into the bathroom away from people in the middle of the night and forced himself on her from behind behind... I knew something was wrong b/c we shared that bathroom and I heard a commotion but no sounds of sexual pleasure just things being knocked over on the bathroom counter. I asked her about it in the morning kinda annoyed with the loud sounds but she was vague and seemed disturbed... Usually shes is a very talkative woman that is an open book and shares everything. She said its something shes talked with her therapist about and described him as a predator. 

Woman #2 - sober, with a long term boyfriend he knew about, touched her sexually while asleep and she woke up to it.

I have had a similar experience waking up to a guy friends hand up my shirt while on a camping trip. I was so freaked out this guy would be touching me in a dead sleep I froze in fear while he commented on how hot my body was. He then proceeded to put his hand down my jeans that's when I pushed him off and he got out of my tent. These things happen more than some people think so yeah I do consider it when getting out into the dating world again. 

[Devin]

I think they tend to give off the douchebag vibe. Most of them guys tend to be creeps. In what way was he charming, that's the only thing that stands out to me, usually they have some slight negative undertones but they are often good at hiding these for short periods of time.

Like you said in the other thread, Brazilian jiu jitsu self defense class, those types of guys are cowards, you fight back they'll run scared.

Guys know girls have to watch out for this stuff and a decent one will be fine with you being cautious, I don't think this fear will hold you back. If you spend enough time with nice guys maybe you won't worry as much about it but I think most women are cautious their entire life. Jiu Jitsu

Edited July 18, 2022 by Devin

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Clabber Girl said:

Woman #1 - drunk, he took her into the bathroom away from people in the middle of the night and forced himself on her from behind behind... I knew something was wrong b/c we shared that bathroom and I heard a commotion but no sounds of sexual pleasure just things being knocked over on the bathroom counter. I asked her about it in the morning kinda annoyed with the loud sounds but she was vague and seemed disturbed... Usually shes is a very talkative woman that is an open book and shares everything. She said its something shes talked with her therapist about and described him as a predator. 

Woman #2 - sober, with a long term boyfriend he knew about, touched her sexually while asleep and she woke up to it.

I have had a similar experience waking up to a guy friends hand up my shirt while on a camping trip. I was so freaked out this guy would be touching me in a dead sleep I froze in fear while he commented on how hot my body was. He then proceeded to put his hand down my jeans that's when I pushed him off and he got out of my tent. These things happen more than some people think so yeah I do consider it when getting out into the dating world again. 

Of course such things happen. Many guys are creepy and don't know how to properly escalate. And some guys are just rapey. The more alpha/assertive a guy is, the more rapey he will tend to be.

"Grab 'em by the pussy"

Stage Red and hyper Orange guys will tend to be that way. Then again, that's what women are attracted to and reward.

[no_name]

10 hours ago, integral said:

It's a huge disservice to all women when women don't speak out or report crimes. They need to protect other women from that guy because he's going to do it again.  The first girl didn't report the crime and so the second girl became a victim.

That’s because women are embarrassed to talk about these things and often even think it’s their fault. That being said, if they truly cared about their friend, they should have told her.

[Raze]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Of course such things happen. Many guys are creepy and don't know how to properly escalate. And some guys are just rapey. The more alpha/assertive a guy is, the more rapey he will tend to be.

"Grab 'em by the pussy"

Stage Red and hyper Orange guys will tend to be that way. Then again, that's what women are attracted to and reward.

Not true, socially uncallibrated guys or guys who don’t respect boundaries is a huge turn off for women. Women like assertive men, but only if he’s assertive in the way she wants. 

[Devin]

41 minutes ago, Raze said:

Not true, socially uncallibrated guys or guys who don’t respect boundaries is a huge turn off for women. Women like assertive men, but only if he’s assertive in the way she wants. 

Sounds like the guy in the first post played it right until he was alone with them. I think the majority of women like that type of guy initially, the bride apparently still does, and he's a full on rapist.

Edited July 18, 2022 by Devin

[RendHeaven]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Of course such things happen. Many guys are creepy and don't know how to properly escalate. And some guys are just rapey. The more alpha/assertive a guy is, the more rapey he will tend to be.

"Grab 'em by the pussy"

Stage Red and hyper Orange guys will tend to be that way. Then again, that's what women are attracted to and reward.

Yikes.

You're actually spot-on, but this comment still has 0 tact.

Being right isn't always worth the emphasis, Leo.

In this case I would've emphasized understanding for the woman's plight before leveraging a "duh" sentiment (if at all).

[RendHeaven]

16 hours ago, Clabber Girl said:

It freaks me out that I could in the past or future be with a man who has sexually assaulted someone before. How can I tell the signs of a man who could be a predator in the past? 

You'll never really know. And you gotta make peace with that. You can't micromanage every aspect of your partner's life story.

But I suppose you can begin by asking him vaguely about his sexual history with women:

• If he refuses to elaborate, that's actually a green flag. Means he doesn't view sexual encounters as trophies, and respects the privacy of his past partners.
• If he starts nonchalantly talking about the sex he's had, that's more leaning towards a red flag. This could surprise you because one might expect the rapists to be silent and the good people to talk about sex like it's no big deal. I find it to be the opposite.

But again at the end of the day you really can't know. So forget about the past, here's what actually matters:

• if he consistently makes you feel safe (you know what this means), he passes.
• the moment you feel unsafe, bring this to his attention with clarity. if he shows understanding and change, he passes.
• if he makes you feel unsafe multiple times, as long as he shows consistent understanding and change after talking it out, he passes.
• if he makes you feel unsafe multiple times, but he shows no understanding or change no matter how many times you address it, or just a general unwillingness to talk heart-to-heart, that's a clear-cut failure. Part ways with him, he's not good for you. The more you grow your own sense of self-love, the less tolerance you'll have for selfish men. You gotta be willing & able to confront & drop attractive men in a flash if he shows a clear disrespect for your boundaries. This forces you to stand up for yourself which could be tough. It takes work. This also reduces your options tenfold, but you can make up for that by putting yourself out there ten times more. It won't be easy, but this is the real solution.

[Clabber Girl]

@RendHeaven Thanks for the response to my actual question! I appreciate it! I think you bring up a good point about men who show great pride in their past experiences sexually to other women. Makes a lot of sense. 

But the safety thing is a good thing to keep in mind, as I have dated a man who would comment really weird obscene things to me such as "your getting molested tonight..."  WTF. Crossed the line there, and I have told him and he apologized and was never that creepy/weird ever again but needless to say that relationship didnt last. I will give him credit he backed off, apologized and there is something to be said for that type of "social calibration". I think a lot of guys dont have the sense of whats crossing the line and whats considered ok for the girl. Men forget theres a physical power disparity so you cant just do and say what ever you want and we will be ok with it. 

So for me, the safety boundary really matters. 

 

 

[Leo Gura]

5 hours ago, Myioko said:

Why is that an 'of course?'/what kind of tone is that?

It's just very common.

[kamwalker]

3 hours ago, Raze said:

Not true, socially uncallibrated guys or guys who don’t respect boundaries is a huge turn off for women. Women like assertive men, but only if he’s assertive in the way she wants. 

A lot of women get duped by it initially. It turns them on at the beginning which sparks the attraction and then when the evil side of him comes out they ditch him and ask why they can't find a nice guy. What they want is a guy who sexually asserts himself, but at the same time is respectful. Not an actual nice guy because that does nothing for her sexually. I would equate it to a man who wants to sleep with a woman he barely knows just because she has a nice pair of tits. She could be a terrible person, but he can't help himself and just wants her until he eventually gets tired of her bullshit and leaves. 

[Raze]

5 hours ago, kamwalker said:

A lot of women get duped by it initially. It turns them on at the beginning which sparks the attraction and then when the evil side of him comes out they ditch him and ask why they can't find a nice guy. What they want is a guy who sexually asserts himself, but at the same time is respectful. Not an actual nice guy because that does nothing for her sexually. I would equate it to a man who wants to sleep with a woman he barely knows just because she has a nice pair of tits. She could be a terrible person, but he can't help himself and just wants her until he eventually gets tired of her bullshit and leaves. 

Women are primarily attracted to non-neediness, this tends to be assholes as they are mentally sick and the social conditioning that reduces most men doesn’t penetrate. This is why some narcissists are very charismatic and attractive. 

[Devin]

18 hours ago, RendHeaven said:

 

• if he makes you feel unsafe multiple times, but he shows no understanding or change no matter how many times you address it, or just a general unwillingness to talk heart-to-heart, that's a clear-cut failure. Part ways with him, he's not good for you. The more you grow your own sense of self-love, the less tolerance you'll have for selfish men. You gotta be willing & able to confront & drop attractive men in a flash if he shows a clear disrespect for your boundaries. This forces you to stand up for yourself which could be tough. It takes work. This also reduces your options tenfold, but you can make up for that by putting yourself out there ten times more. It won't be easy, but this is the real solution.

I think the vast majority of guys are respectful if you tell them you're uncomfortable with something. I can only think of a couple guys I've known personally that I thought were likely creeps, but the small minority do seem to get around and assault a large portion of women, and there are some social circles were it is the norm; the Supreme court for example.

Edited July 19, 2022 by Devin

[RendHeaven]

3 hours ago, Devin said:

I think the vast majority of guys are respectful if you tell them you're uncomfortable with something. I can only think of a couple guys I've known personally that I thought were likely creeps, but the small minority do seem to get around and assault a large portion of women, and there are some social circles were it is the norm; the Supreme court for example.

In the case of relationships, a woman feeling safe is actually a rather complex thing (from a man's perspective). It's not merely a matter of not raping her (that's the bare minimum lol).

Moreso, it's about always being attuned to her needs, and being a man of integrity who consistently, without fail, shows up to meet those needs. THIS IS HARD. REALLY HARD. 

A lot of times, her needs will conflict with your own needs. And in that case, what do you do? Who's needs get sacrificed? If you go with yourself, she feels unloved (and thereby unsafe). But if you go with her at the cost of yourself, she gets this weird feeling that she's a burden (again, doesn't feel safe).

It's literally a lose-lose situation UNLESS you're self-developed to the point where you don't even really have relationship needs. This allows you to show up for your girl like a king through every storm. Yeah, that's rare.

A more realistic layman's version of a healthy relationship is; both parties have (conflicting) needs, but they're wise enough to talk it out and sacrifice for each other, mutually. Hah, I'm presenting this option as the "more common" alternative to being damn-near enlightened and having no needs, but maybe this is even more rare!

In your own life, when the lesser side of you seeks comfort through personal gain, how often does your higher self step up and take the wheel successfully? To be mature and discuss your intimate issues with your partner in an effective way, you have to be in your "higher self" in the middle of your own ego-tantrum. Now, how many men do you know who can do this?

Tl;dr from the perspective of a woman, if you're screening men for whether or not they are emotional champions that'll have your back to the grave... yeah, that's gonna be rare. Especially if you want them to be hot haha.

Edited July 19, 2022 by RendHeaven

[Devin]

46 minutes ago, RendHeaven said:

In the case of relationships, a woman feeling safe is actually a rather complex thing (from a man's perspective). It's not merely a matter of not raping her (that's the bare minimum lol).

Moreso, it's about always being attuned to her needs, and being a man of integrity who consistently, without fail, shows up to meet those needs. THIS IS HARD. REALLY HARD. 

A lot of times, her needs will conflict with your own needs. And in that case, what do you do? Who's needs get sacrificed? If you go with yourself, she feels unloved (and thereby unsafe). But if you go with her at the cost of yourself, she gets this weird feeling that she's a burden (again, doesn't feel safe).

It's literally a lose-lose situation UNLESS you're self-developed to the point where you don't even really have relationship needs. This allows you to show up for your girl like a king through every storm. Yeah, that's rare.

A more realistic layman's version of a healthy relationship is; both parties have (conflicting) needs, but they're wise enough to talk it out and sacrifice for each other, mutually. Hah, I'm presenting this option as the "more common" alternative to being damn-near enlightened and having no needs, but maybe this is even more rare!

In your own life, when the lesser side of you seeks comfort through personal gain, how often does your higher self step up and take the wheel successfully? To be mature and discuss your intimate issues with your partner in an effective way, you have to be in your "higher self" in the middle of your own ego-tantrum. Now, how many men do you know who can do this?

Tl;dr from the perspective of a woman, if you're screening men for whether or not they are emotional champions that'll have your back to the grave... yeah, that's gonna be rare. Especially if you want them to be hot haha.

I don't think women are as fragile as reading that sounds to me. But that was not what I meant by my reply to you, I guess I misunderstood you.