How do you help Blue parents?

[thisintegrated]

Perhaps it's misguided to even try to help, as it's falling deeper into the illusion, but I still wonder.

I'm a problem solver, so I like to solve problems.  But with people at stage Blue, like my parents, it seems impossible.  It's like they're at least several lifetimes behind, and there's no hope to wake them.  Is it best to just let everyone destroy their lives and not try to help?

[puporing]

My take on that is to remain as conscious as you can when interacting with them and limit it to the extent that you're able to sustain such interactions.

Demonstrate qualities of living the good life. 

Send them a generally caring vibe, but throwing timbits of breadcrumbs here and there that are not too far away from their comprehension/sense of reality. Use humour where you see fit.. and yeah if there's utterly no opening I'd just put on an act for the most part and/or state my position and move on.

Edited July 15, 2022 by puporing

[happyhappy]

On 7/15/2022 at 6:30 AM, thisintegrated said:

Perhaps it's misguided to even try to help, as it's falling deeper into the illusion, but I still wonder.

I'm a problem solver, so I like to solve problems.  But with people at stage Blue, like my parents, it seems impossible.  It's like they're at least several lifetimes behind, and there's no hope to wake them.  Is it best to just let everyone destroy their lives and not try to help?

get them to the blue/orange stuff! The more capitalist version of religion and ideology is. Every blue  ideology has a blue/orange version. The stage blue resents stage orange, but has trouble dealing with the borderline of orange and blue. this should be easy. take the catholic church and its riches. Take religious societies who are inclined towards stage  orange . If u expose them to the correct version, the stage blue will have trouble separating their ideology from the more capitalist version. This will have them a taste of orange. a little exposure.

Making tons of money for a self is evil in a typical stage blue culture. but for the religious institutions who are engaged in the business of religion making billions, it will be fine. This exposure will open them up a little more as i said. 

but I cannot grant that they will make it to orange unless they make a lil effort .cause the jump from blue to orange is a radical shift as i have been a stage blue thinker myself years back!

[Carl-Richard]

@puporing +1

Support and encouragement. What – are you gonna try to teleport a Tier 1 into a higher stage? 

[integral]

They need new experiences, nothing else works. 

[Razard86]

2 hours ago, integral said:

They need new experiences, nothing else works. 

This the experiences of life is what propels individuals up the stage. When the dog gets tired of chasing its tail, it will stop and ponder what's really going on, so too will an individual. 

[Raze]

how are they destroying their lives?

[Michael569]

I have had the same concern with my mom who largely sufferers due to being locked in stage blue values and is utterly resistant to any attempt to help 

At this point, I don't think there is anything i can do other than be understanding, compassionate and loving to the best of my abilities 

Also, important not to put it as your own buren to help them elevate to upper levels or to blame yourself for the inability to help

[Brittany]

What are they doing that is worrying you?

My parents are Stage Blue but I've never seen them as "something that needs help".

[Carl-Richard]

1 minute ago, Brittany said:

What are they doing that is worrying you?

My parents are Stage Blue but I've never seen them as "something that needs help".

My dude @thisintegrated has high standards 

[puporing]

Even "Stage Green" can be very closed-minded so I wouldn't feel too bad...

Or maybe you feel "bad" coz you feel such a gap in understanding..? 

Edited July 18, 2022 by puporing

[Toimur H]

On 7/15/2022 at 7:00 AM, thisintegrated said:

Is it best to just let everyone destroy their lives and not try to help?

How specifically are they "destroying their lives"?

How exactly are you going to know that what they are doing is actually bad for them?

 

On 7/15/2022 at 7:00 AM, thisintegrated said:

Is it best to just let everyone destroy their lives and not try to help?

If you want to help them, you have to translate the solution you have for them in their language, so that they can relate to it with their current meaning making system.

[integral]

 

On 2022-07-16 at 2:44 PM, Carl-Richard said:

@puporing +1

Support and encouragement. What – are you gonna try to teleport a Tier 1 into a higher stage? 

What experiences do you have with unhealthy blue in your life? Because he's looking for a solution and what you're recommending doesn't work. 

[Carl-Richard]

8 hours ago, integral said:

What experiences do you have with unhealthy blue in your life? Because he's looking for a solution and what you're recommending doesn't work. 

After I was like 11 years old, I never asked my parents to buy me anything that wasn't completely essential: no computer games, no candy, no excess clothes. My mom was strict as fuck Today, she is one of the most spiritually attuned people I know (which doesn't mean much, but it's something). I didn't ask her to change anything about herself. She came to me and asked me about how I became the way I am.

[Ulax]

So, to my understanding, by being stage blue they will be subscribing to strong ideas about what is right and wrong. Those in the right are to be looked upon favourably, those in the wrong looked upon disfavourably.

With that being so, what ideas regarding right and wrong do your parents subscribe to? I.e. Are they practicing Christians? More secular in their right/ wrongness?

[Thought Art]

Leave em alone, they'll change in the next life.

[thisintegrated]

12 hours ago, Thought Art said:

Leave em alone, they'll change in the next life.

That's what I've been doing for a couple years.

 

On 17/07/2022 at 6:12 AM, Raze said:

how are they destroying their lives?

On 18/07/2022 at 1:05 AM, Brittany said:

What are they doing that is worrying you?

19 hours ago, Toimur H said:

How specifically are they "destroying their lives"?

Unhealthy perspectives potentially leading to divorce, for example.

 

19 hours ago, Toimur H said:

How exactly are you going to know that what they are doing is actually bad for them?

Well ultimately nothing's bad.  All paths lead to the same place, in terms of happiness.

 

On 18/07/2022 at 1:07 AM, Carl-Richard said:

My dude @thisintegrated has high standards 

For this forum, not for people irl.  I'm painfully aware of how 99% of people are Blue.

 

12 hours ago, Ulax said:

So, to my understanding, by being stage blue they will be subscribing to strong ideas about what is right and wrong. Those in the right are to be looked upon favourably, those in the wrong looked upon disfavourably.

With that being so, what ideas regarding right and wrong do your parents subscribe to? I.e. Are they practicing Christians? More secular in their right/ wrongness?

Mum doesn't really believe much anymore, and dad doesn't care much either about religion either but is traditional AF.  He wants a traditional family that eats together, where he's the man of the house, where the wife is submissive, and the son follows in his footsteps.  But he has none of that and so is unhappy.

Mum's Blue, borderline Orange, very individualistic.  Sister's early Yellow.  Dad's Blue, and the only other person he spends much time with is Red.

So basically dad feels isolated without any other pure Blues around, and, due to circumstances, he never got the opportunity to achieve "Blue success".  Complete stability, basically.

[Rob06]

I'm not sure if Spiral Dynamics is necessarily the best model to use in this family-relationship situation. It's easy to put a label like Blue or Orange on a person, but does that really help you understand all the complexity of these human beings you live with? I'm sure your parents are way more complex than just the value system that Spiral Dynamics stage blue describes. 

Doesn't answer your question, but might be food for thought in maybe broadening your perspective of dealing with the situation.