How do you debunk a blackpiller?

[ShardMare]

How do you debunk that he is wrong?

[Razard86]

.......This isn't even a thread. Also you can't debunk anything absolutely, all you can do is poke holes. If anything could actually be debunked then reality would not be impermanent. Reality is never one thing, and thus any conclusions and beliefs can be drawn from it.

Even if I am 80% right about something, I'm still 20% wrong. If a person in there life experience has had the 20% happen to them, nothing I say will change their mind. Because while in general on a global scale that something does not occur 80% of the time, for that person in their direct experience its a daily occurrence.

So even a person who is deluded on prevalence, is not wrong in totality, they are just wrong on its frequency and scale. So again...you are just trapped in the illusion of logic. There are an infinite number of ways of looking at something, and how you look at something has nothing to do with the something, but has everything to do with your preferences and beliefs. You only experience yourself, you have never experienced anything else.

[flowboy]

That would be a terrible waste of your energy.

Let people believe whatever they want.

 

Debating people does not lead to them having better beliefs and thanking you for it.

The only reason you'd even want to - is because you are not secure in your own foundation.

So start there.

The other person is irrelevant.

What do you want to believe?

How can you act in accordance with that belief, so that it grows stronger?

Edited July 12, 2022 by flowboy

[Razard86]

1 minute ago, flowboy said:

That would be a terrible waste of your energy.

Let people believe whatever they want.

That's a projection. The man could start a podcast debunking (even though its an illusion) black pillers and if he is entertaining and creative enough could make a living off of it. 

[Razard86]

4 minutes ago, flowboy said:

That would be a terrible waste of your energy.

Let people believe whatever they want.

 

 

3 minutes ago, flowboy said:

That would be a terrible waste of your energy.

Let people believe whatever they want.

You just did what you told him not to do. Let him believe whatever he wants to believe. I mean it is a terrible waste of your energy.

I'm not being coy by the way...just pointing it out.

[flowboy]

Podcast for other people who like to waste their energy debating and debunking

He can enlist your help with that, not mine

I'm going to practice what I preach here and not engage in debate

[Razard86]

3 minutes ago, flowboy said:

Podcast for other people who like to waste their energy debating and debunking

He can enlist your help with that, not mine

I'm going to practice what I preach here and not engage in debate

I love that response very witty, it shows you are high in social intelligence.  I wouldn't want to engage in that behavior. 

Again what is a waste of time or not again is just a perspective, I'm glad we allow people freedom to waste their time because anything could be argued to be a waste (its why many schools have taken art out of their budget and focused on math and reading) I mean you could argue comedy, sports, etc are wastes of time.

There is little difference between debate/discussion outside of debate looks for contrast differences, whereas discussion tends to look for commonality/shared ground. But yes practicing what you preach is good, but if you observe yourself closely...you'll see you violate it whenever you are not conscious (for such is the human condition) so its good for us to remember this.

But hey...what do I know anyway?

[actuallyenlightened]

He'll very much not want to be debunked because that'll mean that he'll have to start taking responsibility

Edited July 12, 2022 by actuallyenlightened

[Bando]

@ShardMare You don't thats what you do, this blackpill rabbit hole is much deeper than "if your not a chad you wont get laid" its such a sad and depressing view on the world that rots your personality, the best thing to do is avoid people like that and time do the rest.

The worst thing for a black piller or incel is when he's in late 30's and realize he's wasted his youth on such a shitty world view instead of getting quality experiences. 

[ShardMare]

@Bando but what is the problem with it? I dont understand.

I dont understand the pill game.

I think dating boils down to personality and game.

But i also think its really hard to get girl when ur not that attractive

[something_else]

Blackpill is hard to dig people out of

They tend to congregate in echo chambers and etch each other’s beliefs into solid concrete

The only way they’ll ever change their mind is through new experiences, but their beliefs already convince them there is no hope by definition

So in their mind it’s not even worth trying. And if they do try, they’ll just reinforce their own negative beliefs further

Blackpill/inceldom is pretty much just the high school dynamic extrapolated into the real world 

Most of these dudes’ primary social experiences all come from high school, so they model their social experiences in the real world around these high school dynamics, with stories about Chad and Stacy and so on

It’s all just high school social dynamics really

They need experiences that show them that the real world is not like high school

[Phil777]

There is some truth to the black pill. I recommend the book "understanding and overcoming the black pill" by Martin Goldberg. It's not perfect and in my opinion gives black pill principles a bit too much credit, meaning he still has a black pilled biased blind spot but he addresses the truths about physical attraction we all intuitively know to be true and gives a you a fairly balanced perspective to have your peace with it and navigate the dating landscape knowing this facet of human attraction.

[Michael Jackson]

Next topic: How to debunk my mom

[Phil777]

Check out Leo's latest video about not knowing. Wanting reasons to debunk someone won't lead you to the (complex) truth but is simply an attempt to construct a narrative to "debunk" a worldview that threatens you. The black pill is extremly threatening if you want a beautiful, high consciousness girlfriend and you need her to be attracted to you to feel good about yourself. The truth is, if you look like a weak, skimpy gnome with pimpels a deformed face, a hooked nose, crooked teeth and a weak recessed jaw, she won't feel like fucking you no matter how charismatic you are. This isn't absolute but highly likely and makes sense from an evolutionary-psychological perspective. That's my claim.

I am not completely attached to it but my experience in my 24 years on this earth is that the relationships that work and are happy are those where the two partners are equally attractive in terms of facial aesthetics. That's the norm, that's like 99 percent from my direct experience (not kidding, I thought about all the relationships I know of and that 1 percent of doubt is just in case I forgot somone). There are always deviations from the norm depending on the values, sensibilities, preferences, priotities, psychology and state of consciousness of the person involved.

There is a lot of subjective leeway for what is attractive and there are non scientific factors of temperament and personality that affect attractiveness. Some women like men with strong roman noses or bald guys are whatever. I personally wouldn't fuck a girl who is completely out of congruence with my values even if she looked like victoria secret model. If she thinks genocide and child rape are ligitimate things to engage in I am not sticking it in there lmao.

What we are all attracted to however is health and a certain development of the craniofacial complex is required for optimal health. So I guess you need baseline looks, looks that don't choke you to death because your face is so squished, air can't get in. A recessed jaw also fucks with your posture which impairs your oxygenation, stability, parasympathetic activation and stress management. Proper air flow and craniofacial fucntioning correlates with aesthetics. It's called forward and lateral growth of the craniofacial complex. We are highly attuned to pic that up as a selection mechanism for mates. This has evolved over millions of years.

I will make an effort as a self assessed 7.5 to get a bunch of 10s using nothing but pure charisma, wit and intelligence. I see some chances but looking like Henry Cavill is the fast track without all the effort lmfao.

Feel free to respectfully disagree or give your spin on this. Let's a have a constructive discussion about the component of looks in attraction.

Edited July 12, 2022 by Phil777

[Razard86]

10 minutes ago, Phil777 said:

Check out Leo's latest video about not knowing. Wanting reasons to debunk someone won't lead you to the (complex) truth but is simply an attempt to construct a narrative to "debunk" a worldview that threatens you. The black pill is extremly threatening if you want a beautiful, high consciousness girlfriend and you need her to be attracted to you to feel good about yourself. The truth is, if you look like a weak, skimpy gnome with pimpels a deformed face, a hooked nose, crooked teeth and a weak recessed jaw, she won't feel like fucking you no matter how charismatic you are. This isn't absolute but highy likely and makes sense from an evolutionary-psychological perspective. That's my claim. I am not completely attached to it but my experience in my 24 years on this earth is that the relationships that work and are happy are those where the two partners are equally attractive in terms of facial aesthetics. That's the norm, that's like 99 percent from my direct experience (not kidding, I thought about all the relationships I know of and that 1 percent of doubt is just in case I forgot somone). There are always deviations from the norm depending on the values, sensibilities, preferences, priotities, psychology and state of consciousness of the person involved.

You need more living to do, I know too many examples of the opposite on both ends. I know women who are with men who are not their equivalent looks wise (from the conventional model of attraction) and men who are with women who are not their equivalent as well.

Sure this tends to happen in the 30+ age group but that is because by that age most people realize that looks are overrated. The totality of the experience of being with someone trumps looks, besides we are all going to be old one day. A person you tolerate when you are young and good looking you will despise in old age.

[Karmadhi]

The only way i think would work is to have him go out with a guy that has whatever thing the blackpiller is insecure about, and watch the guy do good with girls.

For example i was kinda blackpilled about my height (im 5 7) and i went out for a daygame sesson with an experienced daygamer who was 5 6. After seeing him absolutely kill it even with girls taller than him, my height insecurity was reduced in a way that no self-help method could ever do. It did wonders for me watching him.

[Yarco]

In my experience, I don't think I've ever successfully done it. At least not with strangers on the internet. Blackpillers, Mgtows, incels... all the same problem. They're stuck in a fantasy persecution world in their head. They will always find 1 more excuse why they're specially persecuted and unable to succeed.

I really wish I could help them and I've tried. I wish I could show them that you don't have to be exceptionally tall or extroverted or rich or intelligent or any other characteristic to succeed at most things.

If you're going to do it seriously, you'd need to approach it with the same mindset as somebody who has been indoctrinated into a cult. They have all kinds of delusions and mistaken beliefs that are built on other mistaken beliefs, just like a cult member or religious extremist.

I would start by trying to identify and relate to them. There's usually a bit of core truth in what they believe, exaggerated. "Yeah, some women really are X" "Yeah, your generation really did kind of get screwed economically". Then once they feel heard and understood, they might let their walls down a little to start being persuaded. "Okay, maybe not ALL women are XYZ" "Maybe I could work on myself a bit more"

[Raze]

https://www.timsquirrell.com/blog/2018/7/14/debunking-the-blackpill-part-two-looks-matter-more-than-anything

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sbs7s8XTEdc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhiEO43tLaM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9KPRqMjtz8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaG2vjc1BLc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7HIyQaJN9Q

[Realms of Wonder]

"Convince a man against his will, He's of the same opinion still" - Mary Wollstonecraft

[CultivateLove]

Reasoning a person out of a position they didn't reason themselves into is usually next to impossible.