Leo Ultimate Question

[bambi]

@Leo Gura please be as honest as possible. 

In the relative domain there are cause and effect consequences, I take a knife, cut my finger, feel pain, see blood etc. I do good deeds for people, bad deeds to people etc can have an effect on the type of person I become. If I am constantly resentful and angry to people, I become an angry resentful person, have bad relationships with people etc etc etc etc

 

So within the context of my life (current dream), there are causal consequences,

 

Will the next dream be influenced by this dream? 

 

[Matthew85]

@bambi What I have observed is we are always experiencing a reflection of our state of consciousness. That is what will determine what you experience in your next dream. So called karma is created by you. 

[amanen]

Does a nightly dream you have influence the next one?

Does a game you play influence the content of the next one you play?

Death will wipe everything away, it won't leave some hidden karma or hidden score system for you. Time itself won't be a thing, so from what time would anything be referenced from? A new dream can simply be created from nothing, it will be brand new.

[Kamo]

On 7/6/2022 at 0:27 PM, bambi said:

@Leo Gura please be as honest as possible. 

In the relative domain there are cause and effect consequences, I take a knife, cut my finger, feel pain, see blood etc. I do good deeds for people, bad deeds to people etc can have an effect on the type of person I become. If I am constantly resentful and angry to people, I become an angry resentful person, have bad relationships with people etc etc etc etc

 

So within the context of my life (current dream), there are causal consequences,

 

Will the next dream be influenced by this dream? 

 

I think the notion of "next dream" is false. There is only the iteration of continued dreaming indefinitely with the observable distinctions being changes in 'State' of Consciousness. So its more about asking will actions in one state create consequences in different following 'State' Its hard to say for certain. Theres karma. So the likelyhood is possible. But Ive experienced radical state changes where as my prior state was completely left in the dust. Nothing carried over or applied to the New State. It was an entire new reality. However it was short experienced so there was no way to really tell if anything I did in my prior state made any difference but it didn't feel like it. 

[Breakingthewall]

14 hours ago, amanen said:

Does a nightly dream you have influence the next one?

Does a game you play influence the content of the next one you play?

Death will wipe everything away, it won't leave some hidden karma or hidden score system for you. Time itself won't be a thing, so from what time would anything be referenced from? A new dream can simply be created from nothing, it will be brand new.

It depends on how you consider it. Does the dream have any purpose? It seems extremely deliberate. is the dream evolutionary? Or is the concept of evolution foreign to the consciousness of God? from our mentality it seems impossible for something to be without purpose. you can say that the purpose is to be, but it is already a purpose. be more complex? all traditions and mystics have spoken of reincarnation. continuity, evolution. It seems logical. although your idea also seems to me

 

[Breakingthewall]

42 minutes ago, JoeVolcano said:

@Breakingthewall All context is of the dream. Even if there is a larger context that includes reincarnation, it's still only a dream context and can never transcend it.

Cheers

Yes, i was talking about the dream, if it is a larger context or not. If there is a purpose or not. 

[Breakingthewall]

8 minutes ago, JoeVolcano said:

Sure but then that necessarily means any and all purpose is a dream purpose only. Not as a purpose to dreaming as such.

Cheers

No, the purpose could be the cause of the dream, not something inside the dream. 

[Blackhawk]

I don't think that anyone really knows. And even if someone knows, we wouldn't know that the person knows. Or maybe it's just me who don't know, I don't know.

[Breakingthewall]

15 minutes ago, JoeVolcano said:

Purpose can't exist independently of context, and all context is dream context. A purpose is "this" as opposed to "that", which exists only in duality.

There is nothing outside of the dream to have a purpose, it is attributeless and undifferentiated, so it's a fundamental error to attribute any kind of differentiable purpose to it.

Cheers

there is only this and there is not outside or inside, but this has a depth that we cannot see. we only see the surface. the dream and the dreamer are the same, so the purpose is within the dream, but the dream is everything. so the question remains valid: why this? 

[Breakingthewall]

@JoeVolcano

2 hours ago, JoeVolcano said:

That's the problem with neo-advaita, and with Leo to be frank. Makes it sound like "this" is the bottom line of existence. It's much less than that, there isn't even "this".

Cheers

So? There is nothing? What is nothing? Me walking on the street right now? 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Breakingthewall

[JuliusCaesar]

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

@JoeVolcano

So? There is nothing? What is nothing? Me walking on the street right now? 

Nothing is everything and everything is nothing.

 

9 minutes ago, JoeVolcano said:

How could "this" possibly stand on its own.

Same problem Leo has, you need to understand what it means for something to be absolute and self-existent, i.e. true nonduality.

If you're going off of states or so-called "direct experience" but you have serious flaws in your thinking, then you're in serious trouble. Not because truth found in thought, but because wrong-knowing leads you astray.

Or maybe it's your saving grace.

Cheers

I can't be certain that this is so much a flaw Leo's worldview has so much as his inability to perfectly articulate his views using human language. He's said before that he's realized that the entire existence, consisting of nothing ultimately is nothing as such. And basically, we're infinitely intelligent so we discovered how to create ourself out of nothing. This is obviously correct given the necessary state of consciousness is reached.

 

And just incase there's a chronic intellectual masturbator like Wokebloke or whomever reading this. We exist prior to your spacetime continuum illusion's creation and foundation. And as such being outside of spacetime aren't bound to the limits imposed by such a continuum on finite beings.

[Blackhawk]

40 minutes ago, JoeVolcano said:

You and a lot of others. But that doesn't mean it can't be known and that it doesn't make perfect rational sense.

Cheers

I don't know if what you say is true.

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, JuliusCaesar said:

Nothing is everything and everything is nothing.

therefore, to say that reality is nothing is meaningless. existence exists, and the adjectives we put on it have no meaning since it is absolute, there is no inside or outside. the same goes for the no self. the self is the subject experiencing an object. in the absolute there is no subject and object, with which it can be said that there is no me, but at the same time, everything is me, since I am the absolute, because only the absolute is, and i am. It's a different way of me, but me after all 

So again the question: why it seems relative? A subject, me, perceiving objects. Why so deliberate?  I'm asking only as a mental game, but i think it's interesting, even the thing is beyond logic 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Breakingthewall

[cetus]

On 7/6/2022 at 0:27 PM, bambi said:

@Leo Gura please be as honest as possible. 

In the relative domain there are cause and effect consequences, I take a knife, cut my finger, feel pain, see blood etc. I do good deeds for people, bad deeds to people etc can have an effect on the type of person I become. If I am constantly resentful and angry to people, I become an angry resentful person, have bad relationships with people etc etc etc etc

 

So within the context of my life (current dream), there are causal consequences,

 

Will the next dream be influenced by this dream? 

 

On 7/6/2022 at 0:27 PM, bambi said:

Will the next dream be influenced by this dream? 

Leo has already answered you on this matter. Are you here to learn or not?

"There are many degrees of God-realization. You gotta go deeper.

You can't answer how long you've been dreaming because time is a dream. How long you've been dreaming is a dream.

How many lives have you dreamed? Just this moment right now. Lives aren't really a thing. You are imagining past and future lives.

I have no problem answering your questions. But you don't appreciate that your questions are asking about imaginary things."

[AtheisticNonduality]

On 7/8/2022 at 4:10 PM, amanen said:

Does a nightly dream you have influence the next one?

Yes, everything is connected through systems, mentally, physically, soulfully, etc.

Edited July 9, 2022 by AtheisticNonduality

[cetus]

8 minutes ago, AtheisticNonduality said:

Yes, everything is connected through systems, mentally, physically, soulfully, etc.

That's a daisy chain of illusion occurring within the dream.

[AtheisticNonduality]

48 minutes ago, cetus said:

That's a daisy chain of illusion occurring within the dream.

It is occurring though!

[Breakingthewall]

10 hours ago, JoeVolcano said:

@Breakingthewall 

10 hours ago, JoeVolcano said:

@Breakingthewall No self also means no god.

This is no game. If you're not serious or you think you already know then stop asking. I'm not interested.

It's a game because no one can give you the answer. it is something you have to see and if you try to translate it into words, you have lost it. but it's still interesting to talk about this

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, JoeVolcano said:

I can tell you for a fact that what you see or may have seen ain't all of it.

Talking about this with someone who has their fingers in their ears going lalalalala is not interesting at all. It's disgusting.

 

I'm 100% sure that I'm just scratching the surface, but i don't stop going deeper. Nothing is more interesting. Everything else are kids games. 

Anyway, i can tell you that I've gone pretty deep with psychedelics, not the deepest, but enough to became limitless. but so what? right now that's just a memory, remembers, that is fading. right now my experience is limited and dual, but ve seen enough to know that words are more and obstacle that anything else. I'm don't doing that lalalala, I'm listening everything that anyone say, but only as a curiosity, and you explanations use to be in negative. Like : you are wrong, Leo is wrong, etc. I'd like more to read about you experience or your perceptions 

Edited July 10, 2022 by Breakingthewall

[RMQualtrough]

Not necessarily.