Jordan Peterson joins Daily Wire!

[Leo Gura]

8 minutes ago, Hardkill said:

It's kinda creepy when you think about it.

I wonder how some people who grew up in a fundamentalist religious environment like in those Mormon sects or Amish areas were actually able to save themselves by leaving their religion and becoming so liberal.

Exactly the same way you will save yourself from materialism and science

[UnbornTao]

19 hours ago, How to be wise said:

Then why do college-educated people skew Green, while uneducated people skew Blue. Unless you’re saying that Green is not wiser and more conscious than Blue, which is crazy.

20 hours ago, How to be wise said:

Not basing my claims on any model.

That involves education, as you say.

Wiser and more conscious? I don't know about that. Maybe.

Perhaps the difference between these people is education and awareness, being willing to acknowledge stuff and to be relatively impartial.

I don't readily assume that political views and wisdom/consciousness are interrelated. 

What if Leo voted for Trump? Haha

You can be profoundly conscious of who and what you are and still be illiterate and make poor choices. Nissargadatta is an example. He was enlightened, illiterate, and smoked like crazy (a dumb lifestyle choice), if I recall correctly.

[DocWatts]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Exactly the same way you will save yourself from materialism and science

Lots of offramps from religion that one can find in our society, since it's not hard to find the likes of a Sam Harris or a Neil deGrasse Tyson to hand hold you through the process.

While the exit from unexamined scientific materialism is more akin to getting a pilot's license. 

[UnbornTao]

12 hours ago, How to be wise said:

An intelligent clown. He makes some good arguments against abortion and socialism.

Smart but not intelligent. Subtle distinction. What are the differences? Honestly, I'm not clear on that.

Intelligence seems to involve something more than smartness, like a deeper self-awareness, perhaps. 

You could say people like Putin are smart but not intelligent.

[Yog]

14 hours ago, Hardkill said:

Ah, so JP and Shapiro were born and raised in cultures that influenced them with a less developed set of ideas and memes, whereas people like you and me were born and raised in cultures that influenced us with a more developed set of values and ideology.

Its part of the game. Having conservative or liberal ideas might be just that and not say that much about their level of development.

If everyone around you is having the same ideas and values, you will absorb them and act them out, just to fit in the social matrix. It doesn't mean you understand them, or came to them by developing yourself.

So in this sense a conservative >can be< more developed than a progressive. It can be hard to accept, but I've seen it quite a few times with my own eyes.

 

[TheAlchemist]

16 hours ago, Hardkill said:

It's kinda creepy when you think about it.

I wonder how some people who grew up in a fundamentalist religious environment like in those Mormon sects or Amish areas were actually able to save themselves by leaving their religion and becoming so liberal.

I can say from experience being indoctrinated into deeply religious pentecostalism and finally leaving it behind as an adult. The process is slow and painful as hell. Some people think you can just switch over to a new worldview, but really our worldview runs very very deep, and shedding it can be like jumping off a cliff with no idea if anything will catch you. So I can feel compassion for them, it's not easy at all to change your worldview, especially when you are deeply invested in it like Shapiro or Peterson.

Edited July 3, 2022 by TheAlchemist

[How to be wise]

6 hours ago, UnbornTao said:

smoked like crazy (a dumb lifestyle choice), 

So is eating sugar-containing food, which eliminates 70% of enlightened people.

[UnbornTao]

24 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

So is eating sugar-containing food, which eliminates 70% of enlightened people.

That's my point. You can be enlightened (consciousness) but not necessarily make intelligent choices (intelligence).

[Bobby_2021]

On 7/3/2022 at 6:28 AM, Leo Gura said:

Whatever intelligence you have is corrupted by bias and survival. Which turns intelligence into stupidity.

Jordan, Shapiro, Trump has a high Intellect or IQ.

Intelligence is a much more broader term encompassing much more stuff like wisdom, psychological development, IQ etc.

IQ alone makes up for intellect or "smart" or faster learning capacity. 

[Scholar]

On 1.7.2022 at 3:52 PM, Leo Gura said:

Makes me regret being charitable to his teachings.

His politics are just awful.

To be fair, you can clearly see that he suffers from permanent brain damage after what happened to him with that whole benzos fiasco. I mean he is just going off the rails now, whereas before he atleast had some semblance of rationality.

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Scholar said:

To be fair, you can clearly see that he suffers from permanent brain damage after what happened to him with that whole benzos fiasco. I mean he is just going off the rails now, whereas before he atleast had some semblance of rationality.

I don't see any problem with his brain. He's just spiral down the culture war rabbit hole and he's under the effect of "audience capture". He found a niche for himself pandering to the right-wing and crusading against SJWs. Now he's doubled down on it, unwittingly signing a pact with the devil.

He's fallen into the trap of the lesser Jihad.

[8gates]

@Leo Gura

Chris langan (one of the highest iqs  alive) critisizes petersons take on donald trumps iq. Apparently trump would atleast qualify for mensa

Any thoughts on chris langans trump support leo?

Im surprised someone who has come so close to the nondual understanding through scientific/rational means is still a trump supporter. I thought chris langan would be spiral dynamic stage yellow  ? 

[Leo Gura]

Langan's politics is stunningly bad.

I cannot take him seriously.

Don't be fooled by him. He's smart but he's not awake.

[BuddhistLover]

@Leo Gura Yeah For real bro, Being socially liberal, and financially conservative seems to be the right balance we're shooting for. And that trip around the country and around the world really sounds like it would be the adventure of a lifetime. Just need to setup the Van in the driveway, and then map out pretty much the whole trip. So that there's no snags along the way. And you most likely want a newer Van too, so you don't breakdown too far from Vegas. A newer compact RV might be best. Then you just gotta Map out every city you want to go to, and then you might even be able to vlog the experience. All the power to you, sounds like an adventure of a lifetime! And Langan seems like a bit of a rube. And he's an ISTP too, so he's probably not intuitive enough to see around Donald's facades. 

[Bobby_2021]

7 hours ago, 8gates said:

Chris langan (one of the highest iqs  alive) critisizes petersons take on donald trumps iq. Apparently trump would atleast qualify for mensa

It's true. But IQ simply means that you can process information faster and manipulate systems faster. 

Such people tend to be successful in life. But that need not imply intelligence or psychological maturity. 

[Danioover9000]

   This all is heavily based on your stage of development, cognitive and moral development, personality typing, states of consciousness, life experiences and other lines of development. There's never really a one size fits all, complete good guy or bad guy. At any point in your life, at any point in your upbringing, at any point when some failures have traumatised you, at any of thses lines of development would get effefted and be either slowed, or regression sets in. Transformational dilemma is a real obstacle to transitioning up the spiral and actually be anle to share and hold those values from above.

   On the topic of Intelligence, it is multifaceted, rather than linear, mathematical or linguistic at first. There are many other forms of intelligence like bodily, spatial, musical, natural(plant knowledge), existential, philosophical, interpersonal, and interpersonal intelligence. It is possible to have varying degrees of intelligence at any one of these types, so I'm rather hesitant to label JP or Ben Shapiro as simply evil or dumb, as they have reasonably high level of logical, mathematical and linguistic intelligence but lower degrees of intelligence in other areas of their brains. Speaking of brains, there's also such a thing as neuro divergence, meaning that even if each person's brain is overall very similar in shape, any neural pathways more active is what makes them more unique than other types of brains. The brian of Ben Shapiro is uniquely his own, versus the brain of Eminem's, versus the brain of a fearful conservative, and so on. On this basis, simply wishing them away as evil is wrong. They have bad politics, but don't let that take away from that their life shapes what they are. There is such a thing as life shaping who you are, especially when you are very young!

[Danioover9000]

   Also, I'm against very simplistic nit picking and attack. I really believe, that if you had gone through their upbringing, in their body and mind, faced with the exact challenges, it's very likely that you would be exactly lkke Jordan Peterson, and Ben Shapiro, living life the way they have been, getting nit picked on by a bunch of people in an internet forum, or some other group, who actually have zero clue as to what's it like living as you, and how hard life is was for you.