Is not cheating an unrealistic goal?

[Preety_India]

Is it unrealistic to expect your partner/boyfriend to not cheat on you ever (lifetime)? 

Do the best relationships suffer cheating too? 

For the longest time, loyalty was my most important value and my top most priority. I never cheated on any of my ex partners (100%) and I used to pride in being 100% loyal in friendships and relationships. 

Lately I have been questioning if this attribute is solely based on judgment. 

Is cheating okay/acceptable (as in human nature)? 

Or is it unrealistic to ask/expect of your partner to never cheat on you?

 

[gettoefl]

love is, to set them free

if they come back, it was meant to be

 

what you have to realize is that even if spouses stay faithful they still have lustful feelings or unstoppable crushes or heavy infatualtions

should they keep quiet about them and thereby not be authentic in order to keep each of you in your ignorance is bliss mutual captivity

if they keep quiet it surely amounts to emotional cheating

 

monogamy is possible but it takes a lot of work and it entails deep sacrifices on both sides which may be good for the sake of raising a family

maybe it is better for one to renew one's relationship vows every decade or so and if either wants out then bid them well

as we well know nothing is forever and people can change unrecognisably even in a short time

raising children is basically a 20 year program

Edited June 14, 2022 by gettoefl

[Fernanda]

1 hour ago, gettoefl said:

as we well know nothing is forever and people can change unrecognisably even in a short time

raising children is basically a 20 year program

Exactly, and if you are in a self-development journey you might face yourself changing all the time (which includes your desires and life experiences). It takes a lot of maturity, admiration and communication skills from both sides to keep a relationship going, and even so it is not guaranteed monogamy will be untouchable. The moment you fall for somebody else you are already cheating and you will probably feel even more miserable if you deny that. This I am saying doesn't seem to match any good marriage standards we have in society today. 

I might be very wrong, though.

[BlueOak]

No. I never cheat and will never cheat. It all depends on you what you need from a relationship and if Monogamy is important then that's what it is.

People do change over the course of their lifetime, and sometimes sadly the new people they become don't have the same passion or love that you both found to start with. They find this difficult to communicate, for obvious reasons, and it can mean they become attracted to a different type of person. This usually happens more often when you are younger and changing more rapidly but not exclusively.

It sounds like this is very important to you, so don't give up on looking for it.

[Fernanda]

49 minutes ago, BlueOak said:

They find this difficult to communicate, for obvious reasons, and it can mean they become attracted to a different type of person.

I think sometimes they try to communicate, but there is no resonance anymore, which is hard to admit and sad. I am saying all this but for me monogamy is a very important thing in a relationship. I just don't see it working well in most of the cases. It looks like something which is imposed and not a choice you keep making over the years.

[gettoefl]

1 hour ago, Fernanda said:

Exactly, and if you are in a self-development journey you might face yourself changing all the time (which includes your desires and life experiences). It takes a lot of maturity, admiration and communication skills from both sides to keep a relationship going, and even so it is not guaranteed monogamy will be untouchable. The moment you fall for somebody else you are already cheating and you will probably feel even more miserable if you deny that. This I am saying doesn't seem to match any good marriage standards we have in society today. 

I might be very wrong, though.

i think you're right, for people of higher consciousness open relationships and ethical polyamory are options which have high merit though are not without downsides too

reddit has a good sub on r/polyamory which documents how real people deal with the ups and the downs

polyamory is the admission that, i have enough love that could satisfy more than one partner AND my needs can most satisfactorily be met by having more than one partner

Edited June 14, 2022 by gettoefl

[Fernanda]

3 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

polyamory is the admission that, i have enough love that could satisfy more than one partner AND my needs can most satisfactorily be met by having more than one partner

Polyamory seems to be an option, but I don't feel good with the concept itself. I can't handle more than one relationship at once, because it takes work to create and keep intimate with one another. I just think over the course of the years you could totally lose interest in someone and it can happen quite suddenly without warning. I think it stabilizes with maturity, though. We should take more time before getting married, definitely. Some people just don't work on their own development and emotional issues and can get really behind.

[Fernanda]

@gettoefl unsolvable dilemma, isn't it?

[gettoefl]

4 minutes ago, Fernanda said:

@gettoefl unsolvable dilemma, isn't it?

it is so tricky and the problem is all relationships are going to end so you had better have contingency plans even if you are a serial monogamist ... i say best to keep ties as light and as few as possible

[Fernanda]

3 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

it is so tricky and the problem is all relationships are going to end so you had better have contingency plans even if you are a serial monogamist

"Serial monogamist" might be a good term.

5 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

i say best to keep ties as light and as few as possible

The ties are getting so light that I can't even see any and I don't intend to spoil that

[gettoefl]

recommend the orthogonal podcast by chelsea lee fasano for information about high conscious relationships, it's super fun and relatable

https://www.chelseyfasano.com/news-and-tips

[Fernanda]

1 minute ago, gettoefl said:

recommend the orthogonal podcast by chelsea lee fasano for information about high conscious relationships, it's super fun and relatable

I'll check that. Thank you!!!

[Raptorsin7]

I like the idea of monogamy. You form a deep and strong connection with one person and then pursue whatever you want in life. But it's possible once I experience this kind of relationship I may outgrow it, but we will see.

Polyamory doesn't make sense to me in the context of relationships. If you are willing to fuck everyone, then why have a relationship at all. Just remain single, and be with whoever you want at the time you want companionship. 

But I think it's possible to love everyone, without needing to fuck everyone. So you can have an intimate sexual relationship with 1 person, and still love other people like family and friends. 

I have a sense that part of what motivates polyamory is weak men. I wonder how many polyamorous relationships exist because either the girl is using one man as a financial/security provider but also wants to have sex with men who satisfy other needs, or you have men who want sexual novelty and so feel the need to multiple partners to satisfy that itch.

I would love to see a world where everyone had strong monogamous relationships where both partners love and are devoted to each other, but also love other people, but just don't feel the need to fuck everyone they meet.

[Razard86]

3 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

I like the idea of monogamy. You form a deep and strong connection with one person and then pursue whatever you want in life. But it's possible once I experience this kind of relationship I may outgrow it, but we will see.

Polyamory doesn't make sense to me in the context of relationships. If you are willing to fuck everyone, then why have a relationship at all. Just remain single, and be with whoever you want at the time you want companionship. 

But I think it's possible to love everyone, without needing to fuck everyone. So you can have an intimate sexual relationship with 1 person, and still love other people like family and friends. 

I have a sense that part of what motivates polyamory is weak men. I wonder how many polyamorous relationships exist because either the girl is using one man as a financial/security provider but also wants to have sex with men who satisfy other needs, or you have men who want sexual novelty and so feel the need to multiple partners to satisfy that itch.

I would love to see a world where everyone had strong monogamous relationships where both partners love and are devoted to each other, but also love other people, but just don't feel the need to fuck everyone they meet.

That's just a bias you have. The oldest relationships between men and women was actually polyamorous. It actually takes more effort and love to maintain a polyamorous relationship. In Africa alone entire civilizations were built off these relationships. Monogamy is primarily a Euro-centric relationship style. Since majority of the Modern World has been influenced heavily by European culture monogamy has been normalized and poly demonized. 

 

[Raptorsin7]

@Razard86 The oldest does not equal the wisest.

If you are maintaining multiple poly relationships then what else are you doing with your life?

[Razard86]

19 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

@Razard86 The oldest does not equal the wisest.

If you are maintaining multiple poly relationships then what else are you doing with your life?

Everything is relationship. All of existence is a relationship. Explain how it is more wise to have a monogamous relationship over a polyamorous one.

[Raptorsin7]

4 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

Everything is relationship. All of existence is a relationship. Explain how it is more wise to have a monogamous relationship over a polyamorous one.

If you want to have specific relationships then monogamy is wiser. If you just want to be in relationship with the universe then we are talking about a different paradigm. 

I'm talking about sexual and deeply intimate relationships as well, I am not saying you shouldn't love your friends and family. 

Also, I want a family. So if I were poly how would that impact my children? If you are in a multi person poly relationship how do you decide who impregnates who?

I would agree that saying you want no relationships and just want to be in love with everyone and everything is probably wiser in an absolute sense, but I am speaking from a human pov as someone who wants to live a good life as a human being. 

If someone said they lived a complete life and then felt they out grew monogamy that is also a different thing too. But you may be a person who THINKS they out grew it, but are still just confused.

Edited June 14, 2022 by Raptorsin7

[Oeaohoo]

36 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

That's just a bias you have. The oldest relationships between men and women was actually polyamorous. It actually takes more effort and love to maintain a polyamorous relationship. In Africa alone entire civilizations were built off these relationships. Monogamy is primarily a Euro-centric relationship style. Since majority of the Modern World has been influenced heavily by European culture monogamy has been normalized and poly demonized.

Some of this is true but it is important to distinguish between primitivism and pre-history. Many ancient and non-Western cultures also practised monogamy: Hindu India, Traditional China and even ancient Egypt largely practised monogamy (of course the realities of sexuality are always more complex and some people within these groups practiced polygamy).

Some might find it offensive but polygamy generally goes along with a primitive mentality: worship of the totem, pantheistic naturalism, a cult of the body and of matter, paths towards transcendence which are hysterical and Dionysian - often involving the rhythmic convulsions of dance, sex or ritualistic drug use - a feminine spirituality emphasising the Earth and the Mother, and so on. Polygamous promiscuity can be witnessed even in the West, particularly today given the neo-primitivism of modern Western man.

Forgive me for pointing out that your argument here is very narrowly Stage Green, appealing to the wisdom of the primitives as opposed to the domination and oppression of the modern West. This too is a bias. Also, Stage Green should remember that polyandry (a woman having multiple husbands) was much, much rarer than polygyny (a man having multiple wives). Of course, though, you might be right that the traditional monogamous family has exhausted it’s utility.

[Oeaohoo]

Incidentally, Islam is an interesting exception in this regard. We must remember here that everything in Islamic civilisation is oriented towards Submission (the literal meaning of Islam) to Allah. Those who would tell you that Islamic attitudes towards women are rooted in a crude and blind domination of the male “patriarchal” principle are very misguided, not that one can blame them given the present-day Western indoctrination into the cult of so-called “freedom”. Of course, it is also possible that present-day Islam has largely lost its original spiritual potency and devolved into an expression of one-sided male supremacy, but that doesn’t mean that it always was one!

Anyway, in Islamic civilisation the paths that men would take towards God were those of action (particularly of a war-like variety, Jihad) and contemplation (murāqabah in Sufism, for example) whilst women would generally take the path of Love (to the man) and Devotion (often to children). Because practically all women in Islamic civilisation were taking the path of Love and Devotion, the original intention of the harem (the polygynous institution of the man taking multiple wives) in Islam was as a test of the woman’s love. Even the promiscuity that the men in this order practised served this purpose: could the woman lovingly accept her man engaging in sexual relations with another woman or would she fall into the petty possessiveness of the nafs-ul-ammarah (the soul commanding to evil)?

Naturally, none of this is to say that we should all adopt the Islamic institution of the harem! It is just a short explication of the oft-misunderstood principles that one polygamous traditional society was based on. After all, such self-sacrifice and dedication to another is pretty much unimaginable to modern Westerners.

[Leo Gura]

If you have cheating, that means you have lying. And if your relationship isn't based on truth and trust, it's already dead.