Damage caused by spiritual content consumed by adolescents

[Bobby_2021]

People also ABUSE SPIRAL DYNAMICS.

Most people here are not multi millionaires with 3 yatchs fucking thousands of women to concerned with the excesses of orange. Neither do you have a ruthlessly discipline to get shit done.

Then why is everyone involved in unnecessary demonisation of Blue/Orange I don't get.  

This is only going to keep you from Embodying all the positive values in the so called "lower stages". 

Staunch discipline and talent alone can make wonders happen. Especially for people in their twenties. 

Talking about SD in a childish manner is making them worry about climate change and inequality, which you can do nothing about. 

It makes sense to double down on what you can do. If you focus on stuff you can't do anything about it's going to make you feel helpless and even low key depressed. 

If you have completely Transcended blue and orange, then go ahead.

Else it's a mistake that's going to cost you so much.

One solution: 

Follow more blue/orange people and study their techniques and Leo's older vids. You cannot exclusively consume advanced level stuff and expect everything to fall in place. 

The LP course is good as it teaches you all the basics.

But for me, I have already had my purpose handled so it isn't really too much of a deal for me. I would absolutely recommend LP course for someone still struggling to find their purpose. 

[Vision]

On 6/11/2022 at 4:06 AM, Razard86 said:

My pleasure, but speak for yourself your signature is FIRE!! I had a friend complain recently about people being lazy and I had realized one day that people are only lazy when they are confused. So your Signature is fire!!

Thanks! I agree it's quite a key insight. When we don't even know what we most want to do with our life, we tend to resort to distractions. 

[ShardMare]

@Aleister Crowleyy

In my opinion you look at this in a very bad way. 

Take a look at people under 30 who consume spirituality and philosophy, so many depressed folks there. 

They cause their own depression with their thinking. There are hundreds of traps in this work. 

 

You should be openminded about the stuff i mentioned above. Theres a difference between partying here and there while consuming philosophy, self help etc. Vs going every week and drinking. 

 

This is an idea that came to my mind it might be false but i think you repressed these needs in your life. 

[ShardMare]

@Aleister Crowleyy yes i agree contemplation and philosophy and consciousness should be taught from your birth.

But u have to admit not everybody is at your level. When looking at spiral dynamics there are people who stay at one level for their lifetime, they cant change.

Yes there are problems with psychologist but they get educated based on average peoples needs u kno

 

Tbh ive been following this path for a little while but not much because i feel that it doesnt suit for me, im not ready.

I just feel and think that i should do these stuff. Master this stuff first. 

 

I was closedminded when i read your comment and i thought u wrote a joke. I still think that young people should focus on basic needs

 

[Razard86]

There is no need to awaken or get enlightened. There is no need to do anything. Everyone at the end of the day has there own journey. Based on their individual journey what is important to them will come up. While I have a bias in favor of awakening I have come to realize that a person has to be prepared to go in that direction. Prepared= a strong desire to pursue that as a goal. Otherwise let them burn through desires with other goals. Eventually every individual that is supposed to awaken will.

[Philipp]

Hey, sorry for the late answer. Had to stomach a hefty breakup. Was kind of giving me the impulse for this post. 

It felt good reading all the replies. It was kind of what I was looking for. thanks for that!

@Leo Gura Thanks for accepting my feedback

@Razard86 Hey thanks for the reply! Maybe not trusting anyone will have its merit eventually. Trusting myself... well I need to show myself now, that I can trust myself, because I haven't taken great care, even though I tried.  I really am not on the right track. I stagnated, regressed, for too long. That's not so healthy. Also trusting other can be useful. Just trust them temporarily you know. I don't know if it is best to plow forward alone (maybe if your leo).  

@flowboy I don't know if "The belief that you need these things [reffering to money, etc.] to be happy, has been broken." this is true. I certainly accepted it as true, but a bit more experience to back these things up, could be a good thing. I am just disoriented. Fearful to commit to anything. Because nothing resembles Leo and Leo is back in my mind the only that I could somewhat trust. However I will change some things. I will just do some things I ve never done before, like bartending, just some things to get myself in touch with working and career. Purpose is still my goal, but I won't try to think too much about it. I tend to get uncertain about everything, when thinking. 

@Oeaohoo Interesting how you describe how the medium and process of spiritual teaching has changed. Definitly something to keep in my mind, when comparing modern and ancient teaching. 

@mmKay Well that discrepency between inner and outer game can suck quite hard. But good to know you ended up somewhere positive. I do believe it to be the for me, aswell, it's just I have to make the rubber touch the road. 

@Chrisd At the end I am not that far. Maybe i'll lift my hands to the sky one day, thanking for the blessing I had become. But i am not there yet.

@purporing: yeah you get me. It's hard to get going, when you are grow a lot at an early age, and the starter survival stuff is just so unattractive. Looking for Leo and finding capitalism. Well I was to kind with myself, not engaging with capitalism. I have to start somewhere right. 

@theMysticalMan: Thanks for the reply. One problem I have, you are not addressing, is that I mainly conceptualized. I need to get in touch with doing and this is not something you learn on the internet^^

@ThoughtArt: Misapplying is huge. And overly conceptual teaching you get from watching videos on the internet is prone to that. Not to say that Leo doesn't compensate with excellence. But Misapplying is a problem. I whish you luck friend!

@ShardMar: Actually talking, to some one helps right. Consuming spirituality on the internet is too much one way. You must be able to give back. I ll keep in mind, to use a psychologe if I feel too.

 

Edited June 14, 2022 by Philipp

[Danioover9000]

@Philipp

   I mostly agree with you on when adolescents and even younger are exposed to advanced spirituality, non-duality, mysticism, supernatural/paranormal, and psychedelics, that if too early can be dangerous as that can take the basicsbof life and make it more mundane in comparison. However, I disagree that we shouldn't be teaching spiral dynamics and integral theory in the education system. However you plan to teach those modals in the curriculum, it's essential that it's taught, no matter if those modals would be misused, misunderstood and misapplied by students as a way to stereotype or caricature other groups of people or persons, because the alternative would be ignorance and perpetuating tier 1 cognition, value systems, moral frameworks, psychology that in turn has negative effects kn one's state of mind and being, and further limits one's life experiences.

[Philipp]

@Danioover9000 I think if spiral dynamics and spirituality was more widely understood in society, it wouldn't also be too much of a problem for an adolescent to learn about it. The problem I felt, was that it alienated so much from everybody else, that I became dependant on Leo. Also feeling unable to show all this growth, when studying or in early stages of career, I lost my sense of self worth. Would I have been able to get some recognition for my growth, I would probably not have fell down this vicious circle of stagnation, depression, confusion.  So I agree with you that in theory it could be taught. 

Edited June 14, 2022 by Philipp

[Leo Gura]

6 hours ago, Philipp said:

@Danioover9000 I think if spiral dynamics and spirituality was more widely understood in society, it wouldn't also be too much of a problem for an adolescent to learn about it. The problem I felt, was that it alienated so much from everybody else, that I became dependant on Leo. Also feeling unable to show all this growth, when studying or in early stages of career, I lost my sense of self worth. Would I have been able to get some recognition for my growth, I would probably not have fell down this vicious circle of stagnation, depression, confusion.  So I agree with you that in theory it could be taught. 

Developing yourself to high levels is inherently isolating because you're going beyond the center of gravity of society. You will be misunderstood by the majority of people. There is little social support for the most advanced stuff. It's like going off-roading and then complaining that the road is bumpy and rough with no super-highways and gas stations.

It's similar to running your own business. You will feel isolated. It's lonely at the top. But also you can find communities of like-minded people, but you must do this proactively. It won't just happen if you don't make an effort towards it.

Also, I have said many times to seek out perspectives other than my own. I should not be your only source.

[Philipp]

@Leo Gura  It's just more difficult, when you're young to handle the alienation, because your self worth isn't fully there yet. You want/ need to show the world, who you are, but the world doesn't recognize you (or so it seems - the solution is to be patient and not give up)

[hyruga]

People are going to be damaged whether they consumed spiritual content or not. Just be aware.

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, Philipp said:

@Leo Gura  It's just more difficult, when you're young to handle the alienation, because your self worth isn't fully there yet. You want/ need to show the world, who you are, but the world doesn't recognize you (or so it seems - the solution is to be patient and not give up)

Yeah, sure.

But also, the big mistake most young people make is trying to fit it and do what all their friends are doing. When I was that age I didn't care about following the herd, I did my own thing and it gave me immense joy even though I was basically alienated and a loner. I deliberately didn't socialize because I did not want my values compromised. I knew that mainstream society and even adults and teachers around me did not support my highest values, and that was okay. You have to learn to rely on yourself and follow your own north star. You don't need every fool to validate you and join you in your truth-seeking journey.

It's not complicated: do your own thing and be happy in it. Don't expect anyone to support you. Lead yourself, lead others.

[Revolutionary Think]

On 6/10/2022 at 6:18 AM, Leo Gura said:

More compassion, less self-righteousness.

If only more of human kind would be like that we'd be in a much better place. Glad you said this. 

[puporing]

@Philipp  Also coz you've been conditioned a bunch to put a great value on "not being alone" so you keep seeing it as undesirable (well I know we're also social creatures yadayada so I'm not saying you shouldn't desire being seen/to connect, but I think it is compounded by our "collective training"). 

It is the nature of it though, the more growth you desire/go through the more you're gonna stray from the pack, duh. Just accept the cost if that's what you want. Or do you regret what you've discovered??  I mean heck at least there's this place (thanks to the internet and stuff), don't take all that for granted!

 

Edited June 15, 2022 by puporing

[Philipp]

You are all right, but I just want to add, that it was not only about having your friends to validate you. (even though friends are a value of mine and I don't think that's wrong either;  I just can't let them restrict me) 

If you're somewhere near stage yellow by the time your 20, you feel great at first, but no college program is going to be stage yellow, certainly not a bachelor or master. And no entry level job is going to be stage yellow and in general creating a stage yellow career is quite rare in today society. There aren't so many role models, institutions, employers, that can help you with that. It felt frustrating. I think I have to learn to be patient, not expect my job and purpose to be the same for the moment,  and accept to engage with lower stages. 

Thanks for all the replies, very kind. 

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Philipp said:

If you're somewhere near stage yellow by the time your 20, you feel great at first, but no college program is going to be stage yellow, certainly not a bachelor or master. And no entry level job is going to be stage yellow and in general creating a stage yellow career is quite rare in today society. There aren't so many role models, institutions, employers, that can help you with that.

A good university is not that far from Yellow. And there's still much you have to learn from Orange, Green, and even Blue. I don't buy that you are fully at Yellow at 20. You're missing a lot there and you have much to learn from the lower stages so you shouldn't feel held back.

Career takes time to build up. It's okay to start somewhere fairly low.

Developing your life is a giant project. In your 20s you're still basically a child. Take your time and pace yourself.

[Vision]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

In your 20s you're still basically a child.

What constitutes being a child? 

[Bobby_2021]

28 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

A good university is not that far from Yellow.

I really hope that the transition to yellow happens fast. Right now universities are the breeding grounds for toxic wokeness.

If they continue to shove green ideology like this, colleges and schools won't be mainstream for long.

28 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

And there's still much you have to learn from Orange, Green, and even Blue.

True, I would include red too.

I dream a lot about conquering these days. ?‍?

Edited June 15, 2022 by Bobby_2021

[Oeaohoo]

33 minutes ago, Bobby_2021 said:

I really hope that the transition to yellow happens fast. Right now universities are the breeding grounds for toxic wokeness.

If they continue to shove green ideology like this, colleges and schools won't be mainstream for long.

Exactly. In my experience modern universities are nowhere near Yellow. Some of the sciences are till stuck in Orange (they have even fallen back into an even more intense version of objectivism and positivism to defend themselves from Green deconstruction) and the humanities are just an indoctrination into postmodern nihilism and Frankfurt School anything-but-Hitlerism.

Not to mention that the life people lead at university is barely even Blue. Naturally, people like to pretend that partying every night, having promiscuous sex and taking dangerous drugs is Green love and openness to experience but I don’t think so. I was at university for 3 years and I didn’t meet a single systems thinker, mostly just Orange nerds and Green hippoids. Also, the university structure itself is a sort of Blue-Orange hybrid (traditional hierarchies integrated with capitalist superstructure).

All of that being said, I have come across some academic writers and thinkers around today who are at least intimating Stage Yellow. Even someone like Mircea Eliade in the last century was moving in that direction from within the academy. It’s just very rare and personally I don’t believe that most people are up to the task of rising to that level; maybe they can prove me wrong!

33 minutes ago, Bobby_2021 said:

True, I would include red too.

I dream a lot about conquering these days. ?‍?

I would even say Purple! People generally have a very disenchanted worldview today.

Yes, this world needs a good ol’ fashioned conquering!

Edited June 15, 2022 by Oeaohoo

[Girzo]

32 minutes ago, Bobby_2021 said:

I really hope that the transition to yellow happens fast. Right now universities are the breeding grounds for toxic wokeness.

If they continue to shove green ideology like this, colleges and schools won't be mainstream for long.

You are from India and you have "toxic wokeness" at the University? Surprised. Must be some elite one.

In Poland we have handfuls of boomers and mostly millenials as faculty workers. Woke culture is nowhere to be found, I would welcome it with open arms.