Are Narcissists a Lost Cause?

[gettoefl]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

I do not think it is like that. if I am sitting face to face with you having a beer, I try a genuine communication, with more or less success, trying to understand you and for you to understand me. to flow together. As I am far from perfect, I will do it with relative success and narcissistic touches will escape me. But if instead what I do is a performance where I'm selling you my character, having the need or see me reflected in a mirror , and you are the mirror , apart from being an unbearable pain in the ass and giving you a boring time, I'll be a narcissist.

You never tried sex with a narcissist? She is masturbating and you are the dildo

ego is an actor and everything ego says is a performance trying to entrench its position ... yes we may escape its clutches to some degree but ultimately we are taking care of what's mine and we are not free to do otherwise

we are all playing the game and doing what is best for number one and its interests, all around are friend or foe, colleague or competitor ... we do good stuff for friend and will do bad stuff to foe

Edited June 15, 2022 by gettoefl

[gettoefl]

everyone is a budding narcissist depending on

1. one's suffering narcissistic abuse

2. one's talent at persuading

3. one's success doing it

very easy to get swept up in this kind of devilry especially when you hear spiritual teachers telling you that you are god

[Razard86]

22 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I'd say quality is in intention. the narcissist intentionally tends to lie. the non-narcissist tends to the truth. He wants it, even though he fears it and sometimes behaves more narcissistically than the narcissist. This is degree too? Could be, at the end everything is. 

But not, i think that a narcissistic person can stop being one if he changes his desire to lie for a desire for truth. I think it's a quality. a level 1500 ego can be less narcissistic than a level 1000 ego. what happens is that his fear is greater, but his tendency is positive, while the other is negative

A lie by definition is an intention to deceive. You cannot lie by accident, that is just ignorance. Ignorance and a lie are not the same. So no the non-narcissist intends to tell lies. If I ask you a question and you gave me the wrong answer but you thought it was right, that was not a lie just ignorance. All lies are intentional. Lies are motivated by fear. A lie is an attempt to control a situation due to fear. Fear of embarrassment, fear of losing something, fear of not getting something, fear of etc..... 

Its quite simple really.

[Breakingthewall]

@Razard86 It's not exactly like that . I can, for myself, have a commitment to the truth. my vital intention is: the truth is the goal, I want to be true. The truth will set me free. So you ask me: do you know Jesus? and I deny him three times (for example), because I poop in my pants. I lied, yes, but out of cowardice. In a normal example: i lie because i think that the truth would show me as unworthy, but I'd like a lot to be capable to say the truth. When I'm alone i tell the truth to myself as much as I can, and i try to do more and more, and my ego grows and get more mature

another very different thing is if I intentionally have a commitment to lying. my life intention is: hide who you are. you're disgusting, get as far away from yourself as possible, and invent another character. you are totally unworthy of love and you must create another character who is worthy of love, and become it. work hard to create that character, and when you have it done, you will finally be lovable. and never reveal who you really are, what you really feel, what's more, forget it and replace it with the other, then you will be free. So your ego gets totally stuck , and your false ego grows, but he is a demon, he is not you real ego. If the ego is a lie by definition, the fake ego is the lie of a lie

[Oeaohoo]

Narcissism could even be a spiritual path by taking the ego to its absurd conclusion. This is the esoteric meaning behind many of the evil Gods in mythology: Seth, Satan, Prometheus… Not only that but the evil figure often has an initiatory function: for example, it is only through Seth killing Osiris that Osiris was able to become the Lord of the Underworld. Being the victim of evil is often what drives people towards spirituality. William Blake certainly understood these things, not only in his famous saying that “the fool who persists in his folly will become wise” but also in the following description of John Milton’s theological poetry:

Quote

The reason Milton wrote in fetters when he wrote of Angels & God, and at liberty when of Devils & Hell, is because he was a true Poet and of the Devil's party without knowing it.

[BPDinrecovery]

Someone with NPD can't really change, because they will never see a problem with themselve,

Someone with narcissistic personality traits can change yes.

[Gladius]

Narcissists have similar issues than people pleasers, just the very opposite. Both are a lost cause. They can change around 10% of their messed up personality if they really work on it though.

[PenguinPablo]

5 hours ago, Gladius said:

Narcissists have similar issues than people pleasers, just the very opposite. Both are a lost cause. They can change around 10% of their messed up personality if they really work on it though.

you can change 100%, don't short change yourself

[PenguinPablo]

On 6/10/2022 at 2:13 PM, Razard86 said:

A tell tell sign of a Demon, is one who demonizes others. Sam Vaknim said that you if demonize a Narcissist then you are one. 

 

Interesting, Dr Ramani has made a whole ass career of doing that on YouTube. Pretty much every video revolves around shitting on narcissist with absolutely no leeway. Personally, I think such a one-sided approach has it's drawbacks. You shouldn't reduce a person to a psychological construct and vilify every one of them.

Vakim is dope. Found him a couple months ago.

 

Edited July 9, 2022 by PenguinPablo

[CuteCornDog]

I (along with many former co-workers) quit working for a job last year because my direct report was what my co-workers and I considered a narcissist.

I learned from him better than anyone else I've had to spend so much time with what was a narcissist was.