What do you think is Leo's best videos in your opinion?

[Oeaohoo]

15 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

Hell yeah us Americans have a bias against blue....do you know the current state of our country? Its like asking a slave if he is biased against slavery!! LOL. America's state= Overweight, In Debt, Wage Slavery, Breakdown of the Family, Rise in Mental Illness, Rise in feelings of distrust in government, fellow man/woman and feelings of isolation/loneliness, creates more division by creating more labels to express inequality, low literacy rate, ignorance, out of control government spending on military operations/weapons, mass shootings, want me to go on? 

I didn’t say the bias was unwarranted but it is still a bias! It’s not even a criticism of Actualised because like you are saying it is probably an appropriate response to a given context. I want to break free from all contexts and get to what is eternally true.

Not all of those things are a symptom of Blue anyway. Overweight is facilitated through Orange exploitation of natural resources, use of GMOs and pesticides and so on, in debt could be all sorts of things (could be lack of Blue discipline and order!), wage slavery is also very Orange (and could even be Green failure to take initiative), breakdown in the family is obviously not Blue… Are we still talking about the same thing? Rise in mental illness could be Orange superficiality or even result of Green deconstruction of the frameworks which kept people on track in life, rise in feelings of distrust in government is motivated by all sorts of things and the government is by no means exclusively Blue (the present US government is superficially Green and Blue but mostly Orange). Even weapons and shootings are a mixture of Orange and Blue.

[Thought Art]

@Oeaohoo Honestly… I wonder if more Americans need more stage blue embodiment not less. As the higher stages are likely out of reach…

[Razard86]

51 minutes ago, Oeaohoo said:

I didn’t say the bias was unwarranted but it is still a bias! It’s not even a criticism of Actualised because like you are saying it is probably an appropriate response to a given context. I want to break free from all contexts and get to what is eternally true.

Not all of those things are a symptom of Blue anyway. Overweight is facilitated through Orange exploitation of natural resources, use of GMOs and pesticides and so on, in debt could be all sorts of things (could be lack of Blue discipline and order!), wage slavery is also very Orange (and could even be Green failure to take initiative), breakdown in the family is obviously not Blue… Are we still talking about the same thing? Rise in mental illness could be Orange superficiality or even result of Green deconstruction of the frameworks which kept people on track in life, rise in feelings of distrust in government is motivated by all sorts of things and the government is by no means exclusively Blue (the present US government is superficially Green and Blue but mostly Orange). Even weapons and shootings are a mixture of Orange and Blue.

Every single thing I listed is a result of blue. Orange and Green come after Blue. You can only reach the orange and green stage until after going through the blue stage. So again...of course he would be against blue. Blue causes orange and green. Orange and Green are reactions to the overly authoritative nature of Blue.

[Hello from Russia]

Still using his squirting technique to this day

[Razard86]

2 hours ago, Hello from Russia said:

Still using his squirting technique to this day

lol nice!!

[Oeaohoo]

6 hours ago, Razard86 said:

Every single thing I listed is a result of blue. Orange and Green come after Blue. You can only reach the orange and green stage until after going through the blue stage. So again...of course he would be against blue. Blue causes orange and green. Orange and Green are reactions to the overly authoritative nature of Blue.

I have demonstrated that it isn’t but OK. Breakdown of the family is a result of Blue? By that logic he would have to be against all later stages. Aren’t you supposed to “transcend and include”? All this Spiral Progress is rubbish anyway, Orange and Green are just later stages of decay. Heaven forbid there be authority in this world!

7 hours ago, Thought Art said:

Honestly… I wonder if more Americans need more stage blue embodiment not less. As the higher stages are likely out of reach…

I would go so far as to say that there is very little pure Stage Blue in America. What remains of it is extremely degraded and is forced to become silly and one-sided in order to defend itself from the onslaught of later stages, like the Biblical literalism that people poke fun at which is really an attempt to defend Christianity from stage Orange scientism. This could even be said of the most extreme manifestations of Blue, like early Puritanism which was an attempt to save Christianity both from the emergence of modern secular thought and the perceived corruption within Catholicism.

Because of this, American conservatism/republicanism (both of which are also mostly not Blue but Orange) provides the perfect straw-man and scapegoat for the progressive wing of America to feel justified in over-turning not only their own but all of the world’s “overly authoritative” traditions! Even Republicans think in this way: “They hate us for our freedom”…

After all, the American Constitution itself is a definitively Orange document.

[Razard86]

2 hours ago, Oeaohoo said:

I have demonstrated that it isn’t but OK. Breakdown of the family is a result of Blue? By that logic he would have to be against all later stages. Aren’t you supposed to “transcend and include”? All this Spiral Progress is rubbish anyway, Orange and Green are just later stages of decay. Heaven forbid there be authority in this world!

 

The only reason you say what you said is because you have a bias against Orange and Green and you don't get the point. If we kept blue, certain levels of discrimination stay in tact. Jim Crow is Blue. The Crime Bill of 90's is Blue. Affirmative Action is Blue as well. Orange and Green seek to be free of the authoritative role of government and seek more personal freedoms. Your vision is limited that is why you cannot see the progress in each step. 

If you think of Spiral Dynamics as the stages an individual goes throughout their life but magnified to the scale of a nation or the entire human race it makes sense. The stage of blue is just blindly listening to authority. If you stay in that stage you KILL CREATIVITY. Rebellion against authority, against customs and traditions, is what keeps the needle moving. 

Is this change chaotic? Yes and that is how change operates. Eventually the change gets out of control and it gets put back under some control. But the limits need to be tested first before it can become balanced. If you follow how Spiral Dynamics works you will understand that the same developmental stages they are going through we go through.

Each of the stages must be gone through because each stage is NOT SUSTAINABLE LONG TERM. If you have looked at the global economic system we have today. There has been talk over the last 2 years of a Reset. Or Debt Jubilee because global debt has reached astronomical levels. It can never be repaid. Not to mention the global inequality in the distribution of resources due to exploitation of the powers that be. 

So all this chaos needs to be burned through before we can reach some semblance of security. 

[Leo Gura]

13 hours ago, Thought Art said:

@Oeaohoo Honestly… I wonder if more Americans need more stage blue embodiment not less. As the higher stages are likely out of reach…

More healthy stage Blue, less unhealthy stage Blue.

[Oeaohoo]

2 hours ago, Razard86 said:

The only reason you say what you said is because you have a bias against Orange and Green and you don't get the point. If we kept blue, certain levels of discrimination stay in tact. Jim Crow is Blue. The Crime Bill of 90's is Blue. Affirmative Action is Blue as well. Orange and Green seek to be free of the authoritative role of government and seek more personal freedoms. Your vision is limited that is why you cannot see the progress in each step. 

Even according to Spiral Progress, you can’t just jettison a whole stage of human development. The Spiral Dynamics website claims that Stage Blue has been around for 10,000 years and you want to jettison all of this traditional wisdom because “what about ma slavery tho”! Affirmative Action is a peculiar one because it is superficially Green but I agree with you that it’s real effect is to enforce Blue conformity and dependency. Everybody’s vision is limited; some more than others…

2 hours ago, Razard86 said:

If you think of Spiral Dynamics as the stages an individual goes throughout their life but magnified to the scale of a nation or the entire human race it makes sense. The stage of blue is just blindly listening to authority.

This analogy with human development can be applied however you want it to. For example, I would say that Stage Blue Christianity was a religion fit for the old age and death of mankind. Stage Orange materialism is equivalent to the hardening (vigor mortis, the “stiffness of death”) which sets in when the body dies, Stage Green is equivalent to the final failure of the immune and blood systems and the decomposition of the bodily structures, and Tier 2 new-age spiritualism is the equivalent of the final evaporation of the body back into the atmosphere. In fact, it is Spiral Progress which does not map onto human life: every human being starts off fresh and full of life and gradually falls apart into senility and decrepitude. Even if you don’t agree with all of this, it is clear that the analogy to the development of the human being can be applied in various ways.

2 hours ago, Razard86 said:

If you stay in that stage you KILL CREATIVITY.

What are you talking about? “Stage Blue” civilisations demonstrate a degree of creativity which is unimaginable today. In traditional architecture every detail is handcrafted to perfection and imbued with personality, depth and meaning; compare that to the mass-produced brutalist architecture of today. Even within a narrow genre of art such as the chivalrous literature of the High Middle Ages one can see tremendous creative application. 

The difference between all this and the “creativity” of today is that this was a bounded creativity, integrated into a higher context and fecundated with the essential principles without which creativity can only be profane and conceited self-expression. The vain-mannered creativity which has been exalted in modern times has already exhausted itself as it was destined to do because it lacks true principles and an appropriate metaphysical context. A trip to your local postmodern art gallery should be able to confirm just what kind of “creativity” has been unleashed today!

2 hours ago, Razard86 said:

Rebellion against authority, against customs and traditions, is what keeps the needle moving. 

And there he is: Prometheus Unbound in defiance against Zeus and Lucifer in revolt against God because it is “better to rule in hell than to serve in Heaven”! The rebel is certainly the god of our times…

Of course rebellion against authority has its place but that place is rebellion against corrupt authority. Corruption, not authority, is the problem.

2 hours ago, Razard86 said:

Each of the stages must be gone through because each stage is NOT SUSTAINABLE LONG TERM. If you have looked at the global economic system we have today. There has been talk over the last 2 years of a Reset. Or Debt Jubilee because global debt has reached astronomical levels. It can never be repaid. Not to mention the global inequality in the distribution of resources due to exploitation of the powers that be. 

So all this chaos needs to be burned through before we can reach some semblance of security. 

All of this is true but you could just as well say that “all things must pass”. No reason to construe it through the lens of Spiral Progress.

I am only defending Stage Blue because I think it is very much neglected in certain circles. I agree with you that there is no going back and that the only way to move forward is to burn through the current chaos.

[Razard86]

10 minutes ago, Oeaohoo said:

Even according to Spiral Progress, you can’t just jettison a whole stage of human development. The Spiral Dynamics website claims that Stage Blue has been around for 10,000 years and you want to jettison all of this traditional wisdom because “what about ma slavery tho”! Affirmative Action is a peculiar one because it is superficially Green but I agree with you that it’s real effect is to enforce Blue conformity and dependency. Everybody’s vision is limited; some more than others…

This analogy with human development can be applied however you want it to. For example, I would say that Stage Blue Christianity was a religion fit for the old age and death of mankind. Stage Orange materialism is equivalent to the hardening (vigor mortis, the “stiffness of death”) which sets in when the body dies, Stage Green is equivalent to the final failure of the immune and blood systems and the decomposition of the bodily structures, and Tier 2 new-age spiritualism is the equivalent of the final evaporation of the body back into the atmosphere. In fact, it is Spiral Progress which does not map onto human life: every human being starts off fresh and full of life and gradually falls apart into senility and decrepitude. Even if you don’t agree with all of this, it is clear that the analogy to the development of the human being can be applied in various ways.

What are you talking about? “Stage Blue” civilisations demonstrate a degree of creativity which is unimaginable today. In traditional architecture every detail is handcrafted to perfection and imbued with personality, depth and meaning; compare that to the mass-produced brutalist architecture of today. Even within a narrow genre of art such as the chivalrous literature of the High Middle Ages one can see tremendous creative application. 

The difference between all this and the “creativity” of today is that this was a bounded creativity, integrated into a higher context and fecundated with the essential principles without which creativity can only be profane and conceited self-expression. The vain-mannered creativity which has been exalted in modern times has already exhausted itself as it was destined to do because it lacks true principles and an appropriate metaphysical context. A trip to your local postmodern art gallery should be able to confirm just what kind of “creativity” has been unleashed today!

And there he is: Prometheus Unbound in defiance against Zeus and Lucifer in revolt against God because it is “better to rule in hell than to serve in Heaven”! The rebel is certainly the god of our times…

Of course rebellion against authority has its place but that place is rebellion against corrupt authority. Corruption, not authority, is the problem.

All of this is true but you could just as well say that “all things must pass”. No reason to construe it through the lens of Spiral Progress.

I am only defending Stage Blue because I think it is very much neglected in certain circles. I agree with you that there is no going back and that the only way to move forward is to burn through the current chaos.

You do not realize that all of your posts cry out for control. At the end of the day, everybody is sovereign. Your desire for authority is because of your fear. You judge others as dangerous and that is why you want them to be controlled. The more authority you wield the less freedoms others have. And I cannot believe you had the audacity to talk about creativity in building structures. This lets me know you are not a student of history. All creativity gets stymied by authority. Do you even know how creativity works? Authority seeks to make massive conformity. It seeks to make things predictable. Why? Because it is easier to control. Creativity seeks to experiment and go outside the box. Many of the greatest thinkers in human history are persecuted because they think different than the masses. 

There are TOO MANY EXAMPLES throughout history of creativity being attempted to be stamped out. This happens in art, science, sports, etc. Whenever someone attempts to bring something new, they are immediately ridiculed and it becomes a controversy. All creativity that is created and brought forth happens IN SPITE of authority not because of it. Now I am not against authority as some order needs to be placed but every historian of human history knows that authority is linked to conservatism and if you are too conservative you DIE. Nations, empires, corporations, and all of life is under this rule. If you do not adapt you die. The irony is death is change itself. So you must die to continually live.

[Thought Art]

35 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

More healthy stage Blue, less unhealthy stage Blue.

That's what I meant yeah

but, also integrating some healthy green. A nice, green blue... with a splash of understanding and application of the strengths of orange.

Edited June 13, 2022 by Thought Art

[Razard86]

7 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

That's what I meant yeah

but, also integrating some healthy green. A nice, green blue... with a splash of understanding and application of the strengths of orange.

If you notice how Spiral Dynamics works, there is a stage, the next stage rejects the stage, then the third stage incorporates both and transcends them both, this keeps happening over and over. It makes sense when you think about it. By rejecting something you discover its weaknesses, but because it actually had merit....you discover the good parts it has. So then you construct something that takes the best of both worlds which makes you transcend them both. This is how we individually learn and collectively learn.

[Oeaohoo]

41 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

You do not realize that all of your posts cry out for control. At the end of the day, everybody is sovereign.

I do realise it because I am not against authority and control. If one believes oneself to be speaking truthfully it is only natural that ones words should convey a certain authority. Everybody is sovereign but some are more sovereign than others. Many people can only attain to the true expression of their sovereignty by serving a higher authority.

42 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

And I cannot believe you had the audacity to talk about creativity in building structures. This lets me know you are not a student of history.

I have spent the last few years doing practically nothing but study history. I have no friends or social life because of it. So shove this up your ass!

44 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

All creativity gets stymied by authority. Do you even know how creativity works? Authority seeks to make massive conformity. It seeks to make things predictable. Why? Because it is easier to control. Creativity seeks to experiment and go outside the box.

True creativity has little to do with thinking outside the box. This is all creativity in the modern, profane and desecrated sense: creativity as a frantic pursuit of innovation, change and progress all as a race to the end (or more likely, the bottom)… Today there isn’t even a box to think outside of! Postmodernism has destroyed the box. Think how many depictions of the Virgin Mary alone there have been within Christian iconography. True creativity is an application of the essential principles of existence within a given domain; these principles are inexhaustible and indefinitely expansive so that there is no limit to creativity even within the box.

46 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

Many of the greatest thinkers in human history are persecuted because they think different than the masses. 

There are TOO MANY EXAMPLES throughout history of creativity being attempted to be stamped out. This happens in art, science, sports, etc. Whenever someone attempts to bring something new, they are immediately ridiculed and it becomes a controversy. All creativity that is created and brought forth happens IN SPITE of authority not because of it.

This is another of the modern myths: the great thinker and innovator at odds with the stifling conventions of conformist society. This myth finds its early heroes in Socrates, Christ and the martyrs of late antiquity, then conveniently skips a thousand years to Giordano Bruno and the other Renaissance heretics. From then onwards a slew of “geniuses” have emerged in every field (particularly the secular sciences) only to be ignored or persecuted in life and celebrated only in death. Notice however that all of these people belonged to the destructive phase of their civilisation: Socrates and Christ to the destruction of antiquity and post-Renaissance thinkers to the destruction of Christian Europe. They were only ignored because people around them didn’t want to know that their society was falling apart. Speaking of which…

47 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

Your desire for authority is because of your fear. You judge others as dangerous and that is why you want them to be controlled. The more authority you wield the less freedoms others have.

I notice you never actually respond to my arguments but just move on to something else. Typical evasive Orange-Green! Maybe you are just afraid of authority.

48 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

Now I am not against authority as some order needs to be placed but every historian of human history knows that authority is linked to conservatism and if you are too conservative you DIE. Nations, empires, corporations, and all of life is under this rule. If you do not adapt you die. The irony is death is change itself. So you must die to continually live.

Become too liberal and you also die! The “too” part is what is important here…

[Razard86]

1 hour ago, Oeaohoo said:

This analogy with human development can be applied however you want it to. For example, I would say that Stage Blue Christianity was a religion fit for the old age and death of mankind. Stage Orange materialism is equivalent to the hardening (vigor mortis, the “stiffness of death”) which sets in when the body dies, Stage Green is equivalent to the final failure of the immune and blood systems and the decomposition of the bodily structures, and Tier 2 new-age spiritualism is the equivalent of the final evaporation of the body back into the atmosphere. In fact, it is Spiral Progress which does not map onto human life: every human being starts off fresh and full of life and gradually falls apart into senility and decrepitude. Even if you don’t agree with all of this, it is clear that the analogy to the development of the human being can be applied in various ways.

 

This argument is akin to well I can liken how the body digests food to the circle of life. Yes you can make an analogy of anything but logic and analogies are graded on how well they fit. So let's grade your analogy.

You said: "I would say that Stage Blue Christianity was a religion fit for the old age and death of mankind. Stage Orange materialism is equivalent to the hardening (vigor mortis, the “stiffness of death”) which sets in when the body dies"

So here you are saying Blue which is about authority =death.

Orange which is about materialism= Hardening of the body

And Spiritualism= Leaving the body. 

Please explain how authority= death?

Please explain how materialism= rigor mortis

Please explain how spirituality = the spirit leaving the body.... not to even mention that you are not even in the body the body is actually in you...but I digress please explain all this.

You see when you make a claim you have to actually explain it. You can't counter my analogy with a weaker analogy. Because I can VERY EASILY show how Spiral Dynamics mirrors individual human development. All of human history mirrors individual human development. But do you know how I can make that analogy? Because the people who created Spiral Dynamics have already done it on their website because they saw what I saw. Every psychologist worth their salt knows that human history is just a reflection of the individual human on a massive scale. If you are unaware of this you haven't studied it enough. 

Edited June 13, 2022 by Razard86

[Michael569]

1. Intro into systems thinking

2. SD series are the Mona Lisa of 21st century

3. Integrity video

4. How to stop caring what people think about you

[Proserpina]

Vital download for collective.  

[UnbornTao]

Haven't watched them all but two of my favorites are:

1. The open-mindedness series
2. How to do research (and develop big picture understanding).

Big picture episodes.

At first I didn't recognize the value of the latter, perhaps because I saw it as too abstract to be useful. Over time, however, it dawned on me how significant that theme is.

[Oeaohoo]

3 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

You said: "I would say that Stage Blue Christianity was a religion fit for the old age and death of mankind. Stage Orange materialism is equivalent to the hardening (vigor mortis, the “stiffness of death”) which sets in when the body dies"

So here you are saying Blue which is about authority =death.

Orange which is about materialism= Hardening of the body

And Spiritualism= Leaving the body. 

Please explain how authority= death?

Please explain how materialism= rigor mortis

Please explain how spirituality = the spirit leaving the body.... not to even mention that you are not even in the body the body is actually in you...but I digress please explain all this.

Stage Blue (which is about much more than just authority), and particularly Christianity, are fit for the death of humanity because like you say they emphasise stale authority and conformity. After all, children hate conforming to stifling rules and regulations! It is senile old farts who like to do everything by the book; Christianity just allowed them to do it by the Book! It is absurd to me that Stage Blue belongs to the pre-individualised childhood of humanity: even according to “ma science”, humanity had already been around for hundreds of thousands of years before Stage Blue emerged!

Materialism is like rigor mortis because once the spiritually animating principle has departed (God in the Christian context) all that is left is the physical body. The so-called advances in philosophy since the Renaissance have basically just been progressive phases in the realisation that God (in the Christian sense and as the spiritual principle which used to animate such societies) is dead. These are the various Stage Orange ideologies of materialism which have been accompanied by the general expanse of the mercantile machine of production-and-consumption. It is just like a body in which the soul and spirit has departed.

Relativism, deconstruction and anti-logocentrism are like the body decomposing because they are a denial of survival and the necessity of difference and distinction. Isn’t defunding the police just like the immune system finally giving in? Isn’t open borders just like the cell walls collapsing? Isn’t the proliferation of anarchy and chaos within Stage Green just like the diseases which invade the dying body? The contrast within Stage Green between a superficial “love” and “unity” and the actual situation of putrescent inequality and exploitation is also very much like the body rotting beneath the surface of the skin.

Finally, the new-age spiritualism of Tier 2 is like the final evaporation of the body because it is a compensating retreat away from the accretions of materialism towards the spiritual. Seeing the one-sided and limited nature of the new “earth-bound” and materialised world order, more and more people are drawn to shift off this earthly coil and escape to a new world of psychedelic phantasms, neo-Advaitan non-dualisms, Shamanic escapades, pagan cult revivals, occult deliriums and so on ad nauseam, whilst the majority devolve into a form of existence which is entirely collective and truly sub-human. This is exactly like the paths that are available to the human being in death: either to escape the wheel of existence for good (which is what a few people will manage to do through these new-age experiments) or to dissolve back into the collective substance for a further reincarnation (which is what the overwhelming majority are doing).

This model fits the reality much better than some Spiral Progress nonsense!

39 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

But do you know how I can make that analogy? Because the people who created Spiral Dynamics have already done it on their website because they saw what I saw. Every psychologist worth their salt knows that human history is just a reflection of the individual human on a massive scale. If you are unaware of this you haven't studied it enough. 

A very ironic appeal to authority!

I agree that human history is a reflection of the individual human on a massive scale. Like the ancient Corpus Hermeticum says: “As above, so below”.

22 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

Yes you can make an analogy of anything but logic and analogies are graded on how well they fit.

Yes I should have worded this better. What you are describing would be a postmodern sort of argument, “every analogy is equally valid”, which is not what was intended.

[Thanks]

Leo's video what is authority is so underrated it's absurd. I bet you if you watch it will recontextualize you whole perspective about Leo, your parents, governements, God and your very own self. I had a solipism awekening for days just because of this video

[Razard86]

59 minutes ago, Oeaohoo said:

Stage Blue (which is about much more than just authority), and particularly Christianity, are fit for the death of humanity because like you say they emphasise stale authority and conformity. After all, children hate conforming to stifling rules and regulations! It is senile old farts who like to do everything by the book; Christianity just allowed them to do it by the Book! It is absurd to me that Stage Blue belongs to the pre-individualised childhood of humanity: even according to “ma science”, humanity had already been around for hundreds of thousands of years before Stage Blue emerged!

Materialism is like rigor mortis because once the spiritually animating principle has departed (God in the Christian context) all that is left is the physical body. The so-called advances in philosophy since the Renaissance have basically just been progressive phases in the realisation that God (in the Christian sense and as the spiritual principle which used to animate such societies) is dead. These are the various Stage Orange ideologies of materialism which have been accompanied by the general expanse of the mercantile machine of production-and-consumption. It is just like a body in which the soul and spirit has departed.

Relativism, deconstruction and anti-logocentrism are like the body decomposing because they are a denial of survival and the necessity of difference and distinction. Isn’t defunding the police just like the immune system finally giving in? Isn’t open borders just like the cell walls collapsing? Isn’t the proliferation of anarchy and chaos within Stage Green just like the diseases which invade the dying body? The contrast within Stage Green between a superficial “love” and “unity” and the actual situation of putrescent inequality and exploitation is also very much like the body rotting beneath the surface of the skin.

Finally, the new-age spiritualism of Tier 2 is like the final evaporation of the body because it is a compensating retreat away from the accretions of materialism towards the spiritual. Seeing the one-sided and limited nature of the new “earth-bound” and materialised world order, more and more people are drawn to shift off this earthly coil and escape to a new world of psychedelic phantasms, neo-Advaitan non-dualisms, Shamanic escapades, pagan cult revivals, occult deliriums and so on ad nauseam, whilst the majority devolve into a form of existence which is entirely collective and truly sub-human. This is exactly like the paths that are available to the human being in death: either to escape the wheel of existence for good (which is what a few people will manage to do through these new-age experiments) or to dissolve back into the collective substance for a further reincarnation (which is what the overwhelming majority are doing).

This model fits the reality much better than some Spiral Progress nonsense!

A very ironic appeal to authority!

I agree that human history is a reflection of the individual human on a massive scale. Like the ancient Corpus Hermeticum says: “As above, so below”.

Yes I should have worded this better. What you are describing would be a postmodern sort of argument, “every analogy is equally valid”, which is not what was intended.

Disclaimer: Also don't take any of this the wrong way. I can tell that you are very intelligent. I'm merely trying to push you to use that intelligence to better communicate your point. I'm a debater and deconstructionist by nature. I can tear apart most arguments because I have an ability to see multiple perspectives in an argument. So think of this as me pushing you to do so as well.

An appeal to authority? If you wrote a story and told me the theme of the story was blah blah blah. Then someone I had a discussion with disagreed with me that the theme of the story was blah blah.....it wouldn't just be an appeal to authority it would literally be what the story was built upon. Now unless the argument could be substantially made that the author of said story FAILED to sufficiently write a story that upheld that theme then it wouldn't even be an issue. Calling it an appeal to authority as if that is all there is, is a copout. Come up with an actual argument don't just use labeling tactics. 

Yes it is an appeal to an authority when you discuss the work someone made you will bring up their viewpoints considering its there work. Me quoting you in a response to reply to you IS AN APPEAL TO AUTHORITY. I must discuss YOU  if I am going to have a discussion about something you have created. You are creating a viewpoint so I must appeal to what you have created to discuss it!!

Seriously....what is going on here? Make a point, stop running in circles. 

Also don't take any of this the wrong way. I can tell that you are very intelligent. I'm merely trying to push you to use that intelligence to better communicate your point. I'm a debater and deconstructionist by nature. I can tear apart most arguments because I have an ability to see multiple perspectives in an argument. So think of this as me pushing you to do so as well.

Edited June 13, 2022 by Razard86