Peter Ralston NEW statement about psychedelics

[Razard86]

On 5/15/2022 at 7:45 PM, Gesundheit2 said:

Why would you credit the increase to them, though? You could've achieved the same results or even better if you spent the same amount of time on the same practices sober. How would you know that they're the producer of the results?

You are completely biased and have no clue about what psychedelics do. Some people have opened their third eye PERMANENTLY off one use of a psychedelic. Psychedelic work WAY faster and take you to higher states that ordinary practices won't do as quickly or efficiently. Psychedelics are just a catalyst, a tool, you are still dealing with your own mind.

1. Psychedelics make you hallucinate. All hallucinations are visions and trances created by the mind to force you to deal with a specific fear. This is why the moment you overcome the fear the hallucination STOPS. The medical field hasn't even discovered this but I learned this off ONE use of the drug.

2. When he talks baseline he means how you are in normal settings. But here is the kicker, some people get kundalini awakenings off psychedelic use. Once kundalini is awakened it becomes INCREDIBLY easy to raise your baseline level of consciousness through meditation. In fact the PURPOSE of meditation is to release that energy, so you CAN reach what is called samadhi or a natural state of bliss by being connected to the source of all creation. 

Pyschedelics can hasten both of these processes which would take DECADES to reach. I took 5 grams of psychedelics ONCE and have never used that drug since....it opened my third eye, showed me the other side, and started the dark night of the soul process. That was me taking it for the FIRST TIME!!! You know how long you would have to meditate to reach that process? I got into a car accident 2 days later and then had a kundalini awakening. So I reached 2 divine states that many spiritual practioners take decades to experience in 2 days!!! Because of psychedelics. Yeah....sure why would anyone listen to anyone telling them no.

The truth is Leo was right, Psychedelics are a GREAT tool to learn to raise consciousness I speak from my own DIRECT EXPERIENCE. I learned more in those 2 days and 2 weeks following them than I learned my entire life and it was the greatest moment of my entire life. Things were revealed to me and I was tested and learned so much.

[Leo Gura]

On 5/16/2022 at 0:39 PM, Spiral Wizard said:

Well, after 10 years of proper practice your base line is God.

No it isn't. You will be in some weak-ass state that you call enlightenment which is actually 1% of full awakening.

Quote

PS.: Why is there such debate about this? It’s not an either or… BOTH psychedelics & manual practice serve their purpose. Push them beyond the fucking limit and see where they take you!

I support both, obviously. I only debate those people who:

1) Claim that psychedelics do not generate legit awakening. Or claim that psychedelics are a waste of time. Or who claim that they have reached levels of consciousness beyond psychedelics.

2) Claim that there are no degrees/levels of awakening.

- - - - -

 

[Gesundheit2]

1 hour ago, Razard86 said:

You are completely biased and have no clue about what psychedelics do. Some people have opened their third eye PERMANENTLY off one use of a psychedelic. Psychedelic work WAY faster and take you to higher states that ordinary practices won't do as quickly or efficiently. Psychedelics are just a catalyst, a tool, you are still dealing with your own mind.

1. Psychedelics make you hallucinate. All hallucinations are visions and trances created by the mind to force you to deal with a specific fear. This is why the moment you overcome the fear the hallucination STOPS. The medical field hasn't even discovered this but I learned this off ONE use of the drug.

2. When he talks baseline he means how you are in normal settings. But here is the kicker, some people get kundalini awakenings off psychedelic use. Once kundalini is awakened it becomes INCREDIBLY easy to raise your baseline level of consciousness through meditation. In fact the PURPOSE of meditation is to release that energy, so you CAN reach what is called samadhi or a natural state of bliss by being connected to the source of all creation. 

Pyschedelics can hasten both of these processes which would take DECADES to reach. I took 5 grams of psychedelics ONCE and have never used that drug since....it opened my third eye, showed me the other side, and started the dark night of the soul process. That was me taking it for the FIRST TIME!!! You know how long you would have to meditate to reach that process? I got into a car accident 2 days later and then had a kundalini awakening. So I reached 2 divine states that many spiritual practioners take decades to experience in 2 days!!! Because of psychedelics. Yeah....sure why would anyone listen to anyone telling them no.

The truth is Leo was right, Psychedelics are a GREAT tool to learn to raise consciousness I speak from my own DIRECT EXPERIENCE. I learned more in those 2 days and 2 weeks following them than I learned my entire life and it was the greatest moment of my entire life. Things were revealed to me and I was tested and learned so much.

I am biased, and I don't have any experience with psychedelics. But that does not automatically make me wrong. It's just not enough.

What you said is interesting, mainly you're claiming that psychedelics have helped you experience a kundalini awakening, but (1) maybe they made you hallucinate that, and (2) maybe it was a coincidence. Some people experience spontaneous kundalini activation without any drugs or practice, and some people experience spontaneous third eye opening too. That does not help your point.

[zurew]

44 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

2) maybe it was a coincidence. Some people experience spontaneous kundalini activation without any drugs or practice, and some people experience spontaneous third eye opening too. That does not help your point.

This same argument could be used for yoga and meditation too. But you are right in that to claim there is a direct causality between psychedelics and awakening is really hard to prove. The same goes with meditation and with other spiritual practices too.

But how much we can explain psychedelics away if enough people start to say, that  "the very first time i used  psychedelics i awakened". We could say that, "but how could we make sure, that that person really awakened and not just pretending it or misunderstanding something"? Of course that is possible, however the only way to collect data on this is by people sharing their subjective experience.

Also, lot of nuance is possible. If you do this certain practice like that it may help you awaken but if you do it in a slightly different way you won't. Again this could be said for any method or practice. But, if a lot of people start to claim that it was because of psychedelics , then there is a claim number ,where we can say that there is at least a correlation, if not a causation.

If thats the case, that a lot of people claim that they awakened using psychedelics, then we can't say that all of that was because of coincidence, because there is an underlying process going on that must be investigated and explained.

The only way to really make sense of this, is to collect statistical data and compare them. But its really hard to collect data on how could psychedelics can help you awaken, because they are illegal  almost everywhere.

But we shouldn't forget this: "absence of evidence is not evidence of absence".

I don't even know how much statistical data is about how certain spiritual practices could help you awaken. The people who would do the comparison and the people who would make their conclusion and experiment and research would have to understand what awakening is really about.

Also, we can use time to investigate this. For example, people who claim they awakened from psychedelics, you can ask them when did they take psychedelics, and how much after that did they awaken? Because if all or  most of them are saying that it was directly after using psychedelics then there is at least a correlation if not a causation between using certain psychedelics and awakening.

Edited May 18, 2022 by zurew

[Thought Art]

Use all the tools at your disposal my friendos

[UnbornTao]

How many people have really awakened from psychedelics? How many of them will credit their enlightenment to anything other than themselves?

According to Jed McKenna, psychedelics are part of the dream. Ralston seems to be implying the same thing, albeit in his notoriously grounded way.

I hear tell that Timothy Leary, for example, tried really hard to achieve enlightenment through their use but he ultimately couldn't. According to Peter, he may have had many insights, so Peter's making a distinction here between awakening and insight (perhaps insight as a function of the mind).

Anyway, enough speculation for me.

Edited May 18, 2022 by UnbornTao

[zurew]

5 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

According to Jed McKenna, psychedelics are part of the dream. Ralston seems to be implying the same thing, albeit in his notoriously grounded way.

Everything is part of the dream. Meditation, yoga, contemplation is part of the dream too.

[Breakingthewall]

On 17/5/2022 at 3:44 PM, Consilience said:

Ironically, it partially stems from my use of psychedelics, having very profound past life experiences. These experiences deeply opened my mind up to the possibility of this whole cyclical nature of death and birth. As I've further meditated on and contemplated the possibility of rebirth, I've realized the only reasons Id hold death as some kind of permanent end is from cultural programing. The fact of the matter is, consciousness already manifested as as this individuated form once, why wouldn't it happen again? It's already happened. To claim it wouldn't happen again actually goes against what's already happened, ie a spontaneous emergence of perception and life as this individual we identify with. Couple this logical analysis with the direct experience of past, parallel, and future life experiences I've had with psychedelics and in meditation, and it just becomes so obvious this single lifetime isn't in anyway indicative of the torrent of consciousness.

How do I know it's true? I cannot know with the logical, egoic mind whether rebirth is true. When stepping into states of deep samadhi and openness, it stops being a question though. Moment by moment, life and death are blinking into and out of existence, as existence. One can start to penetrate this dynamic birth death process as being driven by one's karma. To link the process of karma and the existence/nature of mind to the physical body would be to deeply misunderstand the existence/nature of mind, to deeply misunderstand one's direct experience. There are levels of mind that are very much affiliated and karmically intertwined with this current physical body, but from my own experience, there are also deeper, more primordial all encompassing depths of mind that still function through sankharas that are independent (yet still inextricably connected with) the physical body. This whole mechanism of mind that is deeper than the surface of mind typically associated with the physical body is what drives birth and death. If this whole mind actually relinquished itself, what would unfold is a complete union with God. This is what happens on 5-MeO. Mind at ALL levels completely drops away. 

Yet because psychedelics numb the mind, in a sense, the sankharas driving this whole process of egoic identification and self clinging (a clinging so so so much deeper than the nonsense Neo Advaita espouses) are not uprooted. Hence they regrow, return, reconsolidate. Meditation, on the other hand, through means that I currently do not understand due to a lack of training, can uproot these sankharas. 

How do I know all of this? Through so much careful examination of my direct experience. At this point, multiple thousands of hours of meditation & contemplation. I'm still not 100% clear on all of this, and am open to being wrong, but this is what I've seen through my past with psychedelics, and a maturing, deepening, and clarification of view from manual practice. 
 

Yeah this seems to match my experience as well. In Buddhist terms, this is talking about the distinction between the path of an Arahant and Bodhisattva. I've always been more drawn to the path of the Bodhisattva, the kind of consciousness that willingly returns to try and help others rather than extinguishing the whole thing and permanently merging back into the Godhead beyond existence and non-existence. To be honest though, the type of consciousness an Arahant or Bodhisattva possess is so far beyond where I am on the path I cannot really comment on what would motivate an Arahant or Bodhisattva. I would just say, be careful dismissing the Arahant's ambition; it's coming from an incomprehensibly deep place of wisdom and clarity. Both paths are immeasurably noble, in their own way. 

On 16/5/2022 at 9:59 PM, Consilience said:

 

Great post. great perception and great erudition, I hope to follow your evolution in your publications. very honest

Edited May 18, 2022 by Breakingthewall

[Gesundheit2]

8 minutes ago, zurew said:

Everything is part of the dream. Meditation, yoga, contemplation is part of the dream too.

Awakening negates this dream perspective. Otherwise, it's not awakening, but rather another sleeping pill.

It is not an established fact that life is a dream. It is just a claim.

1 hour ago, zurew said:

This same argument could be used for yoga and meditation too. But you are right in that to claim there is a direct causality between psychedelics and awakening is really hard to prove. The same goes with meditation and with other spiritual practices too.

But how much we can explain psychedelics away if enough people start to say, that  "the very first time i used  psychedelics i awakened". We could say that, "but how could we make sure, that that person really awakened and not just pretending it or misunderstanding something"? Of course that is possible, however the only way to collect data on this is by people sharing their subjective experience.

Also, lot of nuance is possible. If you do this certain practice like that it may help you awaken but if you do it in a slightly different way you won't. Again this could be said for any method or practice. But, if a lot of people start to claim that it was because of psychedelics , then there is a claim number ,where we can say that there is at least a correlation, if not a causation.

If thats the case, that a lot of people claim that they awakened using psychedelics, then we can't say that all of that was because of coincidence, because there is an underlying process going on that must be investigated and explained.

The only way to really make sense of this, is to collect statistical data and compare them. But its really hard to collect data on how could psychedelics can help you awaken, because they are illegal  almost everywhere.

But we shouldn't forget this: "absence of evidence is not evidence of absence".

I don't even know how much statistical data is about how certain spiritual practices could help you awaken. The people who would do the comparison and the people who would make their conclusion and experiment and research would have to understand what awakening is really about.

Also, we can use time to investigate this. For example, people who claim they awakened from psychedelics, you can ask them when did they take psychedelics, and how much after that did they awaken? Because if all or  most of them are saying that it was directly after using psychedelics then there is at least a correlation if not a causation between using certain psychedelics and awakening.

Interesting, but what about this:

2 hours ago, Gesundheit2 said:

(1) maybe they made you hallucinate that (awakening)

?

Personally, I don't trust the word of drug users, they're often delusional, have poor judgement, and are mostly projecting their shadows onto reality. More importantly, their realizations and breakthroughs seem to always be tainted by their backgrounds/beliefs, so they're not very reliable. If you read the bible and took psychedelics, you're likely to see Jesus, etc.

[Razard86]

2 hours ago, Gesundheit2 said:

I am biased, and I don't have any experience with psychedelics. But that does not automatically make me wrong. It's just not enough.

What you said is interesting, mainly you're claiming that psychedelics have helped you experience a kundalini awakening, but (1) maybe they made you hallucinate that, and (2) maybe it was a coincidence. Some people experience spontaneous kundalini activation without any drugs or practice, and some people experience spontaneous third eye opening too. That does not help your point.

1. You reveal your lack of knowledge, all of reality is a hallucination, a trip. If you have not realized that reality is itself a hallucination then you yourself have revealed that you are not awake. You can't hallucinate a kundalini awakening if EVERYTHING is a hallucination.

Seriously...you are a student on the path with little or no knowledge trying to teach, you are the blind trying to lead others. You are asleep trying to teach people how to awaken.

Read my signature....if you do not realize that everything is a manifestation of your WILL you are NOT AWAKE. Leo said this on one of his videos and I confirmed it through my third eye. You create EVERYTHING...every single thing. You even created me responding to your comment to let you know you are on the wrong track. You are asleep, wake up!!!

Edited May 18, 2022 by Razard86

[zurew]

1 minute ago, Gesundheit2 said:

2 hours ago, Gesundheit2 said:

(1) maybe they made you hallucinate that (awakening)

?

Personally, I don't trust the word of drug users, they're often delusional, have poor judgement, and are mostly projecting their shadows onto reality. More importantly, their realizations and breakthroughs seem to always be tainted by their backgrounds/beliefs, so they're not very reliable. If you read the bible and took psychedelics, you're likely to see Jesus, etc.

What is a difference between hallucinating an awakening vs having an awakening? The same line can be used for all the other spiritual techniques including meditation , contemplation and yoga.

Like "what if that was just placebo, what if you were just hallucinating?"

The problem with such questions is that it doesn't really help to investigate the underlying problem because none of them could be falsified.  These things can be investigated with what i mentioned in my previous post.

This is not about our personal preferences, this is about knowing what method can work and what method work less or not work at all.

6 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Awakening negates this dream perspective. Otherwise, it's not awakening, but rather another sleeping pill.

It is not an established fact that life is a dream. It is just a claim.

Not just a claim, this is the actual case. What is/was outside of your consciousness? The answer is everything is inside your consciousness, you are in your own dream.

[UnbornTao]

39 minutes ago, zurew said:

Everything is part of the dream. Meditation, yoga, contemplation is part of the dream too.

That's my point.

Except awakening (direct consciousness).

[The0Self]

4 hours ago, Razard86 said:

Psychedelics make you hallucinate. All hallucinations are visions and trances created by the mind to force you to deal with a specific fear. This is why the moment you overcome the fear the hallucination STOPS.

After a shift when I was 23 years old, psychedelics went from hallucinations of angels and aliens and whatnot (and some genuine reality-breaking insight as well), to just increasing conscious power by such an enormous amount that the egoic process disappears, and opening up illusion-breaking beyond-time God-realization -- which is basically an un-hallucination. No more hallucinations -- I suspect because nothing discernible is any more hallucinatory than any other. Damndest thing really. 

And come to think of it, it definitely is at least associated with a falling away of existential fears, and existential needs.

Edited May 18, 2022 by The0Self

[Gesundheit2]

23 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

1. You reveal your lack of knowledge, all of reality is a hallucination, a trip. If you have not realized that reality is itself a hallucination then you yourself have revealed that you are not awake. You can't hallucinate a kundalini awakening if EVERYTHING is a hallucination.

Seriously...you are a student on the path with little or no knowledge trying to teach, you are the blind trying to lead others. You are asleep trying to teach people how to awaken.

Read my signature....if you do not realize that everything is a manifestation of your WILL you are NOT AWAKE. Leo said this on one of his videos and I confirmed it through my third eye. You create EVERYTHING...every single thing. You even created me responding to your comment to let you know you are on the wrong track. You are asleep, wake up!!!

Where's 2.?

[Gesundheit2]

22 minutes ago, zurew said:

What is a difference between hallucinating an awakening vs having an awakening?

It's the same difference between an actual cat and your thought of a cat. The actual cat is embodied and perceived directly, unlike a thought of a cat.

22 minutes ago, zurew said:

The same line can be used for all the other spiritual techniques including meditation , contemplation and yoga.

I don't subscribe to any particular practice/method to produce awakening, so by all means criticize them all you want. For me, life as a whole is an awakening experience. I'm always awakening more and deeper.

22 minutes ago, zurew said:

Not just a claim, this is the actual case. What is/was outside of your consciousness? The answer is everything is inside your consciousness, you are in your own dream.

Lol.

[zurew]

36 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

It's the same difference between an actual cat and your thought of a cat. The actual cat is embodied and perceived directly, unlike a thought of a cat.

So in the case of awakening, practically speaking, would you be able to distinguish between a hallucinated and not hallucinated awakening?

 

[amanen]

3 minutes ago, zurew said:

So in the case of awakening, practically speaking, would you be able to distinguish between a hallucinated and not hallucinated awakening?

 

There is no "real" awakening that is not hallucinated. Everything is hallucinatory.

We just say it is hallucinated when the means are chemical.

Holding awakening through psychedelics as lesser than an awakening through other means seems to me be extremely dualistic, since due to nonduality there should be no reason why chemical (material) means would be less valid than some meditation techniques, since matter is mind anyways.

[zurew]

4 minutes ago, amanen said:

There is no "real" awakening that is not hallucinated. Everything is hallucinatory.

We just say it is hallucinated when the means are chemical.

Holding awakening through psychedelics as lesser than an awakening through other means seems to me be extremely dualistic, since due to nonduality there should be no reason why chemical (material) means would be less valid than some meditation techniques, since matter is mind anyways.

I know, but he uses dream and awakening and hallucination differently. So i tried to engage with his way of thinking and tell a question according to that.

[Leo Gura]

Peter Ralston is part of your dream. So is self-inquiry and contemplation. Watch your biases.

It's absurd that some of you guys with the anti-psychedelic position don't realize that your "natural" awakening is mediated by serotonin. No serotonin, no awakening. So really you are talking about serotonin awakening vs lets say DMT awakening. And you are foolishly claiming that serotinin awakening is real but DMT awakening is not.

There is no such thing as awakening without chemicals. Get that. And get that there is nothing special about your current set of chemicals.

[Razard86]

8 hours ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Where's 2.?

Lol I have a bad habit of putting 1. and never putting 2.