Seperate Self vs Non-Dual Self

[GreenWoods]

There are layers of identification. 

 

• 1. Body & Thoughts

The most outer layer is the body and thoughts. I guess that's what most people identify with.

 

• 2. Non-physical Entity 

By doing self inquiry you realize that you are not the body and thoughts, you are the one who has a body and thoughts. You are made of energy and intangible stuff like personality and a sense of self. All of that forms an energetic entitiy. A self, and this self is real and exists. It has free will and can control thoughts and the physical body, and during astral projection and after physical death it leaves the physical body and lives in a astral body. John Kreiter calls this self the ghost in the machine (projectionist and death defier books). This self is real relative to itself (relative to this state of consciousness). So this is the self I mean when I say that the seperate self exists.

 

• 3. Point of Consciousness 

By inquiring deeper you become conscious how that self is essentially just made of appearances (energy, sense of self, personality,... ), and you are what is conscious of these appearances. You are pure consciousness. So relative to this state of consciousness, relative to this new identity, the energetic entity is an illusion and free will is an illusion too. That's the first stage of enlightenment.

 

• 4. Subject Object Oneness

At the 3rd stage is a duality between consciousness and appearances (colors, sounds, body sensations, thoughts, personality structure, energy). These appearances happen within consciousness. Counciousness is conscious of these appearances. 

But now at stage 4 this subject object duality collapses, they become one. You are everything and everything is consciousness. The appearances are Consciousness. Complete oneness.  

Relative to this state of consciousness, this is the true self.

Edited May 8, 2022 by GreenWoods

[ndm678]

I like this. Did you find it anywhere peticular?

[GreenWoods]

@ndm678 stage 3 and 4 is based on my awakenings.

I never really inquired deep into stage 2 though, until I read about what John Kreiter calls the ghost in the machine in his books. It made a lot of sense so I inquired more into that and adopted that concept.

[SeaMonster]

I also experienced 1, 3 and 4 and not 2.  It seems more of an intellectual realization than a state of consciousness.

[ndm678]

I listened to a Ram Dass lecture recently that addressed a similar set. Here is a quick explain of it.

https://www.ramdass.org/who-do-you-think-you-are/

[GreenWoods]

11 hours ago, SeaMonster said:

I also experienced 1, 3 and 4 and not 2.  It seems more of an intellectual realization than a state of consciousness.

Yeah 3 and 4 are a different state of consciousness.

And 2 is more an intellectual realisation.

By inquiring deeper and deeper into stage two, you can understand and perceive 2 on more subtle layers, so it's also a kind of direct perception (but without the noticable change in consciousness). Though there is no hard line between intellectual understanding and sublte direct perception. 

[GreenWoods]

10 hours ago, ndm678 said:

I listened to a Ram Dass lecture recently that addressed a similar set. Here is a quick explain of it.

https://www.ramdass.org/who-do-you-think-you-are/

Yeah the layers of identification can be mapped in many different ways.

[gettoefl]

or per my map false self to true self to no self to all self

[Kksd74628]

@GreenWoods

I would advice you to watch this video. 

 

[GreenWoods]

@Kksd74628 Frank Yang is an interesting guy. He for sure attained some very advanced levels. 

[Inliytened1]

On 5/8/2022 at 11:03 AM, GreenWoods said:

There are layers of identification. 

 

• 1. Body & Thoughts

The most outer layer is the body and thoughts. I guess that's what most people identify with.

 

• 2. Non-physical Entity 

By doing self inquiry you realize that you are not the body and thoughts, you are the one who has a body and thoughts. You are made of energy and intangible stuff like personality and a sense of self.

I would only make one adjustment- You are not made of energy.  Energy is imagined by you as God.  You are made of Infinity.  Infinity is nothing.  You are God or Awareness - so Astral projection is part of the dream.

[GreenWoods]

2 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

I would only make one adjustment- You are not made of energy.  Energy is imagined by you as God.  You are made of Infinity.  Infinity is nothing.  You are God or Awareness - so Astral projection is part of the dream.

Indeed!