Sensory Input

[WokeBloke]

What are your views on sensory input? Where is it being generated? Where is it coming from? What is it at the most fundamental level? 

If there is input coming into your body (via the sense organs) from outside of your body then why do you consider your life to be a dream (if you do)? 

And if there is sensory input how can you consider what you are aware of to be "all that exists"? Aren't you excluding the rest of the universe that you are unaware of? Why do you think (if you do) that what you are aware of is all that exists? Couldn't there be things that you are unaware of that exist such as the computer I'm typing this on?

What other questions are pertinent to this discussion?

Edited April 23, 2022 by WokeBloke

[thisintegrated]

It's imaginary, like everything else.  C'mon, you should know this by now.  You're always making these same posts.

[WokeBloke]

9 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

It's imaginary, like everything else.  C'mon, you should know this by now.  You're always making these same posts.

I added more to the OP. Also I don't think I have posted anything about sensory input before nor are there any posts about it in the forum.

What is your proof that it's imaginary?

This seems like it could be a gross oversimplification of reality like people used to be convinced the sun revolved around the Earth.

Edited April 23, 2022 by WokeBloke

[thisintegrated]

3 minutes ago, WokeBloke said:

What is your proof that it's imaginary?

Where's your proof it isn't?

 

There is every reason to think it's imaginary, and not a single reason to think it's "real".

If you understand how reality came to be, then it's obvious.  If you don't understand how reality is imaginary, then figure that out first before asking specific questions.  Leo answers all these basic questions in his videos.

[The0Self]

9 minutes ago, WokeBloke said:

What is your proof that it's imaginary?

The truth cannot be offered to another. It will be clear when it is clear, and at no other point. The simplest possible answer is the only true one.

[WokeBloke]

23 minutes ago, thisintegrated said:

Where's your proof it isn't?

 

There is every reason to think it's imaginary, and not a single reason to think it's "real".

If you understand how reality came to be, then it's obvious.  If you don't understand how reality is imaginary, then figure that out first before asking specific questions.  Leo answers all these basic questions in his videos.

The burden of proof is on you since you claim definitively that it is imaginary.

In the defense of sensory input there are reasons to think it exists. One being the sensory organs you are aware of. Another being the various things you come into contact with that are outside the body.

How do you explain the computer that I'm typing this post on? You are unaware of it but if you claim it doesn't exist then I know you are definitely wrong from my POV. It is outside your body and I am typing the post that you respond to on it. So in a sense I am literally providing you your input.

Edited April 23, 2022 by WokeBloke

[WokeBloke]

17 minutes ago, The0Self said:

The truth cannot be offered to another. It will be clear when it is clear, and at no other point. The simplest possible answer is the only true one.

How do you explain the fact that I'm providing you input with my post that you are accessing using your eyes? Where am I?

[Carl-Richard]

44 minutes ago, WokeBloke said:

What are your views on sensory input? Where is it being generated? Where is it coming from? What is it at the most fundamental level? 

Sensory input is an useful idea for describing the dynamics of how your sensory apparatuses work. For example, when you place your hands in front of your eyes, your eyes stop registering most of the light outside of your hands. When you sever your optical nerve, a similar thing happens.

As to its relation to perceptions, sensory input is not what "causes" them. It's more true to say it's the other way around, but even then, perceptions themselves are not causal in any absolute sense, not any more than how the pixels that make out these words cause the next. Perceptions are also not fundamental – they happen within consciousness.

[thisintegrated]

7 minutes ago, WokeBloke said:

The burden of proof is on you since you claim definitively that it is imaginary.

In the defense of sensory input there are reasons to think it exists. One being the sensory organs you are aware of. Another being the various things you come into contact with that are outside the body.

How do you explain the computer that I'm typing this post on? You are unaware of it but if you claim it doesn't exist then I know you are definitely wrong from my POV. It is outside your body and I am typing the post that you respond to on it. So in a sense I am literally providing you your input.

Consider how a video game works.  Why does someone bleed when shot?  Because their skin is pierced?  No.  Because that's what the game logic says should happen.  Because that's the most efficient way the game can work.  Simulating the skin getting pierced would be pointless.  Only your experience matters, as that's all you will ever notice, and all you will ever bring into awareness/existence.  For whom would the details exist?  No one.

 

Spend a few years studying this stuff, I don't care what you believe.

Edited April 23, 2022 by thisintegrated

[WokeBloke]

@thisintegrated I don't think its appropriate to equate your reality with something created within reality such as video games. The way video games function says nothing important about the rest of reality in my opinion. I'm willing to have my mind changed on this with a good argument.

Could you please address my question about the computer?

[Matthew85]

@WokeBloke Interesting question. Contemplate on how it is that you are able to have the same and even enhanced sensory perceptions in your nightly dreams. There are clues there to what you are asking. 

[thisintegrated]

Just now, WokeBloke said:

@thisintegrated I don't think its appropriate to equate your reality with something created within reality such as video games. The way video games function says nothing important about the rest of reality in my opinion. I'm willing to have my mind changed on this with a good argument.

Could you please address my question about the computer?

Ok, why are games made to be efficient?  Because the alternative is inefficiency.  Efficiency is always gonna be better.

Games aren't unique.  Everything in reality is efficient.  Our reality is no different.

 

Let's say we're here for some purpose, and that purpose involves us interacting with things, making decisions, and experiencing consequences from our decisions.  Well what goes into creating all that?  What components do you need to enable all this?  You need your 5 senses.  That's it.  You don't need a physical reality, you don't need organs, or anything else.  If you have just those 5 senses, you're able to achieve whatever purpose you're here for.

Now what's the most efficient way of creating the experience of these 5 senses?  That's the only problem you have to solve.  You need those 5 senses.  No other assumptions.  You're starting from literal nothingness.  Nothing exists, but you need 5 senses, how do you do it?  How do you do it in dreams?  Well you just do it!  You don't create the organs or anything, you don't need to.  Even in dreams you'll find organs if you cut someone up, but does that mean the organs in your dreams are real?  Of course not. 

[WokeBloke]

@thisintegrated Don't you need something to sense with your senses (sensory input)? Isn't the primary distinction between the waking and dream state that one is based on sensory input and the other is conjured up in the brain?

[WokeBloke]

1 hour ago, Matthew85 said:

@WokeBloke Interesting question. Contemplate on how it is that you are able to have the same and even enhanced sensory perceptions in your nightly dreams. There are clues there to what you are asking. 

Supposedly the same regions in the brain that are stimulated by sensory input (such as the visual cortex) are also stimulated in dreams. So in both cases the same region is generating visual experiences. However, in waking state the primary stimuli is light and in the dreams the stimuli come from other regions of the brain.

[thisintegrated]

19 hours ago, WokeBloke said:

@thisintegrated Don't you need something to sense with your senses (sensory input)? Isn't the primary distinction between the waking and dream state that one is based on sensory input and the other is conjured up in the brain?

No difference.  Senses are the content of the senses too.  Just like how consciousness isn't just an "observer" of reality, but reality itself.

[WelcometoReality]

On 2022-04-23 at 3:34 AM, WokeBloke said:

What are your views on sensory input? Where is it being generated? Where is it coming from? What is it at the most fundamental level? 

Once you realize what it is at the most fundamental level everything becomes clear so no more questions is needed.

On 2022-04-23 at 3:34 AM, WokeBloke said:

Aren't you excluding the rest of the universe that you are unaware of?

If you really want to delve into these questions.. How do you know there is a universe that you are unaware of? You believe that there is a universe but you actually don't know that. What you do know is your direct experience.

[zurew]

On 2022. 04. 23. at 3:34 AM, WokeBloke said:

If there is input coming into your body (via the sense organs) from outside of your body then why do you consider your life to be a dream (if you do)? 

The only reason why your ego thinks/feels that it is finite and separated from every other thing is because of your 5 senses. But if we were to block all of your 5 senses at the same time, what do you think your experience would be? Your experience would be automatically infinite, because you would lose your finite self, cause you wouldn't be able to seperate yourself from anything else.

 But the interesting thing is, that even if you were to assume that there is an outer world separated from you, you cannot access it, and you have never accessed it. You are only interacting with your own biased image and you projecting your own ideas out to the outside world. You are experiencing your own projections of reality all the time, so you are a dreamer, and you are constantly creating your own dream.

Can you think of anything that didn't happen inside your mind? (Even if you could think something like that, it would be automatically happeninng inside your mind)

And here is the important part when we are talking about from your ego's perspective: That in your finite state you are constantly interacting with your own ideas of yourself. You are never interacting with you, but you are constantly creating just an image of a you, and the finite you experience your own created image of a you.  So talking from your finite self's perspective, you have never interacted with anything other than your own image of yourself and your own image of reality.

So what would be the best possible way to understand yourself and reality, without projecting and without bias? The solution is to become infinite and self reflect that way, because if you don't do that, you will only get a distorted image of a you. Why? Because infinity includes every possible perspectives, so you get the most accurate meta perspective of yourself and reality.

Also,you have never read my message, you only read your own image created about my message.

On 2022. 04. 23. at 4:13 AM, WokeBloke said:

How do you explain the fact that I'm providing you input with my post that you are accessing using your eyes? Where am I?

You are in my dream, i am interacting with my own biased projected image of a you (from the ego's perspective).

Edited April 24, 2022 by zurew

[A Fellow Lighter]

On 23/04/2022 at 3:34 AM, WokeBloke said:

What are your views on sensory input? Where is it being generated? Where is it coming from? What is it at the most fundamental level?

The most fundamental level is vibration. Sensory input is not as strictly input as much as it is projection. It is being generated in the mind. 

Personally, I don't take reality to be a dream, I take reality to be reality, and dream to be part of reality. I honestly believe that if I took reality to be mere dream then I wouldn't be as effective in my spiritual work. 

However, on the nondual level, reality has the equivalent tone of a dream. I say equivalent tone because it's not in the words themselves that the truth of existence lies, but rather in the effect they have on one's understanding of it.

So, I'm not saying that the Infinite One is asleep as to induce a dream state of consciousness. I'm saying that at the Godhead, as this forum refers to it, all states of consciousness are dream states of consciousness.

But to address the original question: sensory input is that of intelligence and imagination, rather than physical particles radiating electromagnetic waves to be interpreted by the brain.

[The0Self]

On 4/22/2022 at 10:13 PM, WokeBloke said:

How do you explain the fact that I'm providing you input with my post that you are accessing using your eyes? Where am I?

It needs no explanation. There's only what is. You are where you are. But location is a thought. "Using my eyes" is a thought. There is simply infinite. You can't get insight by talking on forums, only tips for your practices which themselves can provide insight. If you want to know what's absolutely true, be aware that truth is not a thought -- therefore, if you can think it, it isn't absolutely true. Everything that is untrue is a thought. This isn't getting you anywhere, you have to do the work. If you don't want to do the work, do something else, but asking others existential questions will do absolutely nothing.

If you believe that you're ultimately a finite human being living in a material reality, then that's where you're at, and obviously this won't mean anything to you.

Edited April 24, 2022 by The0Self