Why does solipsism make some people depressed, suicidal, etc...?

[Jahmaine]

On a "personal" level, if accepting the idea of solipsism being true would make you feel negative feelings and such like, why is this the case? I'm just curious as to why that's the general consensus around it. 

Whether it is true or not, mostly I see people saying that just don't want it to be true because of how depressing it is, which to me shows the final barrier between truth (potentially) and how you feel about it. 

It's revealed to me moreso,with exclamation marks, that most people don't truly care about truth, especially if what's true would make them feel unhappy or suchlike. People care about truth, but if it was solipsism they wouldn't, then they go back in to philosophying about "I would just prefer to believe that it's this thing because it's more practical and healthier"

For those that feel like that, genuinely, what's stopping you from seeing that if solipsism is true, that you could be happy and still have meaning in your life. 

From what I can gather, it seems like that the people that could still be happy are those that didn't really care about truth and want to use solipsism for egoic justifications (as Leo said) or people that really care about truth and feel that have finally found it.

Just to clarify I haven't stated my position in this, it's a general inquiry.

[Kksd74628]

@Jahmaine

The reason is that people assume that they need "others" to have fun and they fear "losing" this quality when realizing solipsism and that is the main reason they avoid understanding it. People want happiness and only the ones who really have contemplated that enough understand that happiness and truth comes pretty much hand in hand. My opinion is that you don't really need to understand all things to have extremely good life and that is the reason I stress so much to ask what is the point of life? which of course is to be happy which is to accept present moment as it is.

[OBEler]

@Jahmaine women dont hurt this truth so much as men

Because women are solipsistic by nature

[SamC]

Because we are afraid of being alone and the ego interpets it as you being alone, but this is not a survival issue.. The ego belives its better to be seperated and be "alone" that way, than to be united and be alone ( the only thing that exsists).

We depend on not being alone, but being alone, seperated is only from this construction. In reality there is no seperation.

[Jahmaine]

@SamC @Kksd74628  even if we accepted that we are all alone though and solipsism was accepted, it doesn't change the first person experience within the dream, the experience is no different from being in a virtual reality with super advanced Artificial Intelligence trying to convince you that the reality is real, except you'd be aware (somewhat) that's what happening, but using that analogy again, the A.I in this world does a really good job convincing this world is real and there isn't just a single entity. 

My point being, if the experience doesn't change then what would cause the negative feelings?

We're literally on the cusp on this happening in the "real world" - people are going to be soo sucked into the metaverse and suchlike and I guarantee for the most part people won't be depressed because the reality isn't real, they'll probs just be depressed to leave that world because of the relative nature.

Edited April 17, 2022 by Jahmaine

[Kksd74628]

@Jahmaine

If you thought that you have 2 million dollars in your bank account and someday someone reveals to you that actually you have only 2 dollars, even if that doesn't change the fact of how much money you really had, that still makes you depressed. By that I try to show that it isn't the "reality" which makes us happy or unhappy, but our thoughts, mind images and ways of seeing the situations that really matter. For some people it is beautiful thought that there are "others" and when that thought gets destroyed that's when the fairytale is dead, forever.

[hoodrow trillson]

I think solipsism would make me more of an asshole tbh

[Kksd74628]

@hoodrow trillson

You speak about solipsism as it would be like an upgrade you could buy from Leo's shop . The thing is that, if your only reason to act nice towards "others" is because you don't want them to suffer or something then I would as you think twice about continuing it. I mean there is no problem in helping presumably "others", but like with other things in life, you should do them just for your own enjoyment. So helping "others" should give you happiness and if not, then don't do it.

[hoodrow trillson]

7 minutes ago, Kksd74628 said:

@hoodrow trillson

You speak about solipsism as it would be like an upgrade you could buy from Leo's shop . The thing is that, if your only reason to act nice towards "others" is because you don't want them to suffer or something then I would as you think twice about continuing it. I mean there is no problem in helping presumably "others", but like with other things in life, you should do them just for your own enjoyment. So helping "others" should give you happiness and if not, then don't do it.

Well, I was always a douchebag when I was younger... then got into spirituality, have been meditating for about 8 (!!!) years now, it has calmed me tremendously and made me much less reactive.  Got me out of the monkey mind a lot more and I'm sure it's kept me out of trouble.  However, I experienced solipsism and non-duality a few years ago and I ACTUALLY experienced it where everything 'clicked' and made sense.  Everything Leo taught I finally got it all at once, it was wild.  The veil was lifted, there's nobody home here.  Including the veil of my current 'being nicer to people to not want them to suffer and feel better' if that makes any sense.  

I'll always remember that.  But I do enjoy that others don't suffer even if they want to poke fun at me because I used to be very cruel.

Edited April 17, 2022 by hoodrow trillson

[Terell Kirby]

Primarily due to painful Truth that others (friends, family, lovers, employers, enemies, etc) are all imaginary. Take a moment to think about how attached you are to humans and what it would mean to rid of those attachments. Most normies can’t handle this.

[Kksd74628]

@hoodrow trillson

Is it like you don't want them to suffer so you would look like a better person in their eyes? Or is it because non-reacting makes you feel like a strong person in the eyes of yourself? I mean couldn't you help "others" just, because it feels nice to do so and not, because you don't want the negative thing that comes from not helping? If just acting good makes you feel happy then at this point you don't need to imagine "others" that do not exist. At this point realizing solipsism wouldn't change your behaviour, but maybe it would just make you more confident, because you understand that there is no one who could judge you : )

[Osaid]

Because they conflate the relative with the absolute. Most people still believe in a subtle ego mind which is lonely, and then they contrast it with a lack of "other", which is just an inaccurate perception of reality. 

[Kksd74628]

@Osaid

It doesn't even matter do you think this thing from absolute or relative point of view, because there is nothing outside of the "experience" that is happening for "you" HERE and NOW. So the thing is as radical as your parents and friends aren't doing anything or existing while you don't see them. So whole "universe" looks exactly like it looks for you right NOW when you read this text.

Edited April 17, 2022 by Kksd74628

[Osaid]

34 minutes ago, Kksd74628 said:

@Osaid

It doesn't even matter do you think this thing from absolute or relative point of view,

If someone isn't conscious that others are imaginary, then that basically becomes their reality, and vice versa. So even if the truth doesn't change, it can feel like it does depending on how you're viewing reality. The content doesn't change, but how we perceive it does, kind of like that optical illusion where you can see either a rabbit or a duck, despite it being the same image. An inaccurate perception taken as truth is not really ideal, and can lead to suffering, which is why I'm advising against it. Conflating the relative with the absolute is a big trap, because it basically converts your insight into a relative perspective without you even realizing it.

 

 

[Kksd74628]

@Osaid

I guess you didn't understand what I meant, because I don't see how you could even have 2 different perspectives on this conversation; The absolute and the relative. There is nothing outside of your experience and at least to me it doesn't matter how I try to think about the thing. Can you explain the difference between these perspectives so I see what you are trying to show me?

[Osaid]

1 minute ago, Kksd74628 said:

Can you explain the difference between these perspectives so I see what you are trying to show me?

Sure, here are some relative misconceptions which can come after realizing that others are mostly imaginary:

- Imagination is "less real" or "less valid" than the rest of reality (How can one part of reality be less real than the other?)

- A "you" that is lonely ("You" only exists in relation to "other", so there is still a duality being projected here. "Other" is as real as "you", and vice versa, they are both the same thing and cannot exist without each other. FYI, I'm talking about the ego when I say "you")

 

[Kksd74628]

@Osaid

That doesn't still change the fact that right NOW when you read this text "Kksd74628" doesn't have any experience whatsover. That is what solipsism is all about that there aren't many movies happening at the same time, but only one. I agree that imagination is as real as anything else, but the thing just is that our "experiences" are at the same timeline, but different "time" and that is the reason there will never be more than one movie playing at the time and it is "yours".

[Galyna]

4 hours ago, Jahmaine said:

For those that feel like that, genuinely, what's stopping you from seeing that if solipsism is true, that you could be happy and still have meaning in your life. 

This realization puts you in the Gods mode. You literally understand that you can bend reality by the way you think. 

[Osaid]

1 minute ago, Kksd74628 said:

That doesn't still change the fact that right NOW when you read this text "Kksd74628" doesn't have any experience whatsover

Yeah, any "other experience" is imagined within my experience, and that is what "other experience" is, imagination. Anything to do with "other" always necessitates imagination, because "other" is imaginary.

2 minutes ago, Kksd74628 said:

I agree that imagination is as real as anything else, but the thing just is that our "experiences" are at the same timeline, but different "time" and that is the reason there will never be more than one movie playing at the time and it is "yours".

Sure, you could say it that way.

I'm just warning about the misconceptions that stem from these realizations, which happens quite a lot because the ego likes to project its own relativity onto these insights, kind of like a last ditch effort to keep itself alive.

[Kksd74628]

@Osaid

Either your self-expression isn't that great, I am bad at reading it, or you don't really understand what I try to say, because what you say sounds irrelevant in what I try to say. Realization to solipsism and to no-self do not have anything to do with each others. When you understand solipsism you understand that there is nothing behind the curtain of present moment. When you understand the concept of no-self then you just understand that there is only the present moment in a sense that it doesn't consist of subject and object, but only from the thing you cannot talk about.

We both seem to understand both of these things, but I don't just see how not understanding no-self could affect on how you perceive another realization called "solipsism". Actually this conversation is not so important, but because NOW it is on then maybe continue it. In a sense it doesn't matter is the imaginary "ego" lonely or the present moment "lonely", because in both cases there is nothing which you can't see. Still I have to say that understanding that the movie is plaing by itself and there is no one in control is pretty freeing, but that doesn't have anything to do with the solipsism realization.