Elon Musk has NO IDEA what he is up against

[Guest Tobia]

Elon Musk is naively trying to bring the genie back in the bottle and bring back free speech on Twitter. Of course, he's absolutely correct, censorship is out of control since covid and now with Ukraine.

BUT I don't think he understands that he is up against. it is not merely the board of directors at twitter, he is going against interests that are so big that they could crush him in an instant. There is no way government (and therefore pharma and military lobby) would allow Twitter to go back to its glorious days of freedom

To maintain the current power structures and powerful interests, free speech is no longer sustainable. it is simply too threatening.

[BlueOak]

We are entering a cultural stagnation and new dark age let me explain.

As someone who gets every other post deleted on youtube still, lost a year of posts for a few remarks I made, and is completely banned from places like the CNN channel. He's not just up against a mountain its half the world, literally half an authoritarian world, perhaps more than that. As they gain more influence over the global mind this is the reality we have.

I've seen most of the content on social dynamics or political content I would care to watch completely banned from the public view. Almost every character or interesting personality is either replaced in searches by bland milk toast content or deleted entirely. Its like that all over the net. The authoritarian boot is not just on the neck of free speech its completely crushed it.

The only places you could now get independent content is now on the deep web (not the dark web) the vast majority of web content you will never see in a search engine but is still legal, just not shown to you. Which of course means you end up on some very out of the way locations, and forms part of the reason people feel this distrust toward institutions, having a bleaker outlook on life than ever. Also by forcing all the non mainstream content off platforms and search engines, it means we end up following characters or ideologies we'd never before consider just to have a new voice or perspective to listen to.

So yeah. I think the future is very bleak indeed when it comes to personal expression, creativity generally, culture or advancement. We are in for a cultural stagnation which precedes any new dark age.

*I should probably argue we are in a cultural stagnation right now. You only have to look at how much everything is reused in art or media to see it.

Edited April 5, 2022 by BlueOak

[BlueOak]

10 minutes ago, Roy said:

Good. I hope Twitter gets even more strict and censors even more free speech. I hope it becomes so bad that people realize how awful it is and abandon the platform.

Twitter is a technology that actively damages humanity, let it destroy itself.

I want to argue against that but its difficult as I hate it too.

Its not the words. Its not these words i'm typing to you now that's a problem, or the expression of them, its how they are easily weaponized for use against people, institutions, individuals, laws etc

But, there's always a but. If this goes away where does the discontent surface? It will and by suppression it manifests in less healthy ways.

[Yarco]

You might be surprised at the degree to which money talks.

Yeah Joe Rogan got quieted a little bit, but far from silenced. Ultimately the leftists at Spotify, Neil Young etc got BTFO'd.

The only way to get cancelled is to allow yourself to get cancelled. If you don't apologize, and you have no job for people to get you fired from, you're untouchable. If people inside Twitter try to have a coup, he'll probably just move Twitter HQ to Texas or something lol.

I hope Elon is able to resurrect Alex Jones, Trump, etc out of the Twitter Graveyard. That might be a bit of a stretch, but I can hope.

The government is too busy just trying to survive right now, they don't have even the resources and ability to get involved with something like Twitter. The average age of a Senator is 64.3 years old. They're so far out to lunch when it comes to modern technology that they have no idea what's going on.

Something big is going on behind the scenes of technology and the internet right now that most people aren't aware of. I personally know a handful of Web 3.0 millionaires and I'm in their private groups so I can see what's going on. There are a lot of tech millionaires on Elon's side in this. Not only that. Big name celebs (I was going to name drop some here to shock you but decided against it, if you dig you can find them) are partying in Miami with Web 3.0 people with a shared vision of decentralization and censorship-resistance, and donating huge sums of money or buying in at the ground level. Otherwise uncontroversial celebs that you've never heard involved with politics or free speech, that have never been banned or had issues. People with enough money to own sports teams and hedge funds are involved with this. You're going to see every aspect of entertainment and culture crack down the middle on this, with huge names on both sides.

A new internet is coming, and blue-haired cat ladies in Silicon Valley aren't invited.

26 minutes ago, BlueOak said:

If this goes away where does the discontent surface?

Do you want links? LOL. Mostly Telegram, Signal, and people's individual websites behind paywalls. The thing is, those isolated groups of discontent aren't dying when they get cancelled off Twitter, Youtube, podcast hosting sites, web hosts, etc. They are thriving and multiplying in the shadows, and one day they're going to pop back up on those platforms with full force.

You have no idea what the actual popular opinion in the US and the world at large is right now, and what you'd see if you actually got an uncensored and unfiltered view of what people want. Youtube and social media has completely eliminated the ability for competition to show up on their front pages, suggestions, trending. Yet somehow those opinions are so popular they're still growing anyway. Why do you think Twitter stock price went up 25% yesterday on the news?

All they can do is keep tightening the grip more and more. Now even relatively tame internet personalities and their audiences are getting banned. Eventually they won't be able to contain it any more and the dam is going to burst. Then you're going to see the original "wild west" style internet make a comeback in a big way.

Edited April 5, 2022 by Yarco

[BlueOak]

3 minutes ago, Yarco said:

All they can do is keep tightening the grip more and more. Now even relatively tame internet personalities and their audiences are getting banned. Eventually they won't be able to contain it any more and the dam is going to burst. Then you're going to see the original "wild west" style internet make a comeback in a big way.

We can hope  I fondly remember those days.

[Aldrich]

@Tobia

On 4/6/2022 at 3:32 AM, Tobia said:

Elon Musk is naively trying to bring the genie back in the bottle and bring back free speech on Twitter. Of course, he's absolutely correct, censorship is out of control since covid and now with Ukraine.

BUT I don't think he understands that he is up against. it is not merely the board of directors at twitter, he is going against interests that are so big that they could crush him in an instant. There is no way government (and therefore pharma and military lobby) would allow Twitter to go back to its glorious days of freedom

To maintain the current power structures and powerful interests, free speech is no longer sustainable. it is simply too threatening.

"Elon Musk is naively..." I think Elon Musk is not naive. "he is going against interests that are so big that they could crush him in an instant. There is no way government (and therefore pharma and military lobby) would allow Twitter to go back to its glorious days of freedom" His enemies can't crush him in an instant. If his enemies were that powerful, then they would have destroyed Space X and Tesla by now. But Poof!!! as you can see Elon Musk seemingly magically kept his companies alive. I don't think the USA government is evil. I don't think phrama is completely evil. I don't think the military lobby is evil. USA government, some stakeholders in pharma and the military may have an interest in bringing back a degree of free speech back to Twitter. 

I don't like narratives which make power structures in USA sound insanely evil. There are good people within the power structures but yes the power structures have been corrupted by evil individuals and groups.

Mark my words!!!......... Elon Musk will succeed at improving Twitter.

The above trains-of-thought are just my opinion since I don't have a lot of statistical data to back up my claims. Only time will tell. So take my ideas in with a grain of salt. 

Elon (THE Real Life Iron Man) Musk ROCKS!!!!!!!!!  

[Space]

@Tobia I don't have too many strong opinions about this but I do feel that Elon knows what he's doing. He's an intelligent man. If he takes ownership of Twitter I think it will only be a good thing for the platform. I suspect that the free speech restrictions will be lifted only by relatively a small amount, maybe 20-30%. And I don't think the general vibe around Twitter will change much.

Some hard lefties think he's just trying to create a totally free speech platform. This just isn't going to happen. It just won't be acceptable by the general masses. As you said, things are very different these days.

[Aldrich]

@Space

1 hour ago, Space said:

@Tobia I don't have too many strong opinions about this but I do feel that Elon knows what he's doing. He's an intelligent man. If he takes ownership of Twitter I think it will only be a good thing for the platform. I suspect that the free speech restrictions will be lifted only by relatively a small amount, maybe 20-30%. And I don't think the general vibe around Twitter will change much.

Some hard lefties think he's just trying to create a totally free speech platform. This just isn't going to happen. It just won't be acceptable by the general masses. As you said, things are very different these days.

I agree.

BTW, @Space, you sound like an intelligent, high consciousness fellow, would you please be my friend?

[Leo Gura]

The problem with Twitter is not lack of free speech, it's lack of moderation and just the overall shallowness of it. Elon Musk is not going to fix Twitter with free speech. That will only make Twitter more toxic and more shallow.

This is the myopia of libertarianism.

And the notion that you can have serious intellectual discussion on Twitter is a joke. Twitter's problems are inherent to its structure -- which isn't going to change.

[mojsterr]

JP says he's in it only for the money:

 

 

[OBEler]

MGS2 was showing the future..information control on highest levels..algorithm edit human history

Edited April 17, 2022 by OBEler

[Danioover9000]

@Tobia

On 4/5/2022 at 8:32 PM, Tobia said:

Elon Musk is naively trying to bring the genie back in the bottle and bring back free speech on Twitter. Of course, he's absolutely correct, censorship is out of control since covid and now with Ukraine.

BUT I don't think he understands that he is up against. it is not merely the board of directors at twitter, he is going against interests that are so big that they could crush him in an instant. There is no way government (and therefore pharma and military lobby) would allow Twitter to go back to its glorious days of freedom

To maintain the current power structures and powerful interests, free speech is no longer sustainable. it is simply too threatening.

   The main problem that Twitter has is not enough moderations of a higher quality, not free speech. Making free speech as the focal point is a big mistake as that will only intensify hate speech and trolling in Twitter a bit more.

[Frylock]

Elon is eccentric and has a cult of personality around him, but I do like that he's ambitious about settling Mars. Need to to start exploring space and expanding outside of earth, it is the future, baby!

[hoodrow trillson]

I love that Elon Musk is for 'free speech' but he blocks and diaps out about any criticism towards him lol

6 hours ago, OBEler said:

MGS2 was showing the future..information control on highest levels..algorithm edit human history

bro I posted a thread about MGS2 and the codec between the Colonel and Raiden.  You should bump it since it's not allowed to bump your own threads lol.

[Frylock]

MGS2's ideas were based on history, particularly the Cold War and military industrial complex. Its political commentary was just as relevant in the year it was released in 2001. Of course, it's more obvious to people who would play it now than back then.

Edited April 17, 2022 by Frylock

[zurew]

I think his main target with this is cancelling cancel culture. People are so sensitive nowadays, that you can't share certain opinions and ideas.

Allowing diversity of opinions can be valuable, echo chambers aren't practical - only feeds the ego.

[thisintegrated]

On 05/04/2022 at 8:32 PM, Tobia said:

Elon Musk is naively trying to bring the genie back in the bottle and bring back free speech on Twitter. Of course, he's absolutely correct, censorship is out of control since covid and now with Ukraine.

BUT I don't think he understands that he is up against. it is not merely the board of directors at twitter, he is going against interests that are so big that they could crush him in an instant. There is no way government (and therefore pharma and military lobby) would allow Twitter to go back to its glorious days of freedom

To maintain the current power structures and powerful interests, free speech is no longer sustainable. it is simply too threatening.

What are you talking about?  Free speech won't affect power structures.  Twitter's already mostly free speech.  It's just racism and calls to violence that's not allowed.  Pharma doesn't give a shit.  US military doesn't give a shit.  They're called out all the time on youtube.  Youtube even shows anti-pharma & anti-military videos on my feed all the time.  No one's even trying to limit information like this.

[Leo Gura]

No serious person in America is like, "My ideas are too smart so I am being suppressed."

It's the biggest assholes and idiots who whine about their speech being supressed. Nothing valuable is lost there.

If you express good ideas respectfully no platform is gonna supress you. But people want the freedom to express bad ideas in obnoxious ways. Eventually they get banned and of course they blame everyone but themselves.

What serious intellectual has been banned from Twitter for their ideas?

Yeah, Twitter bans assholes like Trump, as they should.

That Musk doesn't understand this speaks poorly of his understanding of how to build and sustain healthy communities. His Mars colony will be a libertarian shitshow a la Bioshock.

[Rokazulu]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

 

If you express good ideas respectfully no platform is gonna suppress you.

I would be highly aware of this assumption.

It has recently happened to journalists Chris Hedges, Glenn Greenwald and (I believe) a few others on Youtube. Rest assured, they are not idiots, nor did they break any terms of service.

There is also this study that can show how censorship only further radicalizes people.
https://cdn-assets.minds.com/The_Censorship_Effect.pdf




 

Edited April 18, 2022 by Rokazulu

[SeaMonster]

I think he knows what he is up against.  He is creating a lose-lose scenario for Twitter, and a win-win scenario for himself.

Either he buys Twitter and takes it private or he exposes Twitter for what it is to the normies, and takes it down in the process.

Basically, Twitter position is that an elite group of people is going to unilaterally decide what good ideas are (i.e. as in Moses bringing tablets down the mountain.)  Sorry, that's not the spirit in which the US was founded.  Accounts are getting banned for politically incorrect jokes.  That's not going to fly for long.