Three principles for the problem of describing God

[Carl-Richard]

These are the three principles of the "apophatic" approach to the problem of describing God:

Quote

Apophatic theology, also known as negative theology, is a form of theological thinking and religious practice which attempts to approach God, the Divine, by negation, to speak only in terms of what may not be said about the perfect goodness that is God. It forms a pair together with cataphatic theology, which approaches God or the Divine by affirmations or positive statements about what God is.

The apophatic tradition is often, though not always, allied with the approach of mysticism, which aims at the vision of God, the perception of the divine reality beyond the realm of ordinary perception.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apophatic_theology

 

1. Stay silent.

2. Distinguish between "the relative" and "the Absolute" (between the descriptions, thoughts or worldly manifestations of and about the transcendent and the transcendent in and of itself).

3. The apophatic language:

3.1 Metaphors of oneness: e.g. "God is an emanation, self-illuminated, like the sun."

3.2 Deontologization: God is not an object or a creature.

3.3 Dialectic between transcendence and immanence: e.g. God is both the relative and the Absolute, both form and formlessness, both thought and being, both manifest and unmanifest.

[Thought Art]

my prefered method:

 

[nistake]

My favorite description of God is nothing and everything at the same time.

[Gesundheit2]

Describing what?

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Describing what?

Are you going to say something clever now?  

[Gesundheit2]

23 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Are you going to say something clever now?  

Huh?

[Carl-Richard]

2 hours ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Huh?

I guess not 

[gettoefl]

the divine triune revelations are inside outside beyond or logos spirit transcendent ... start inside, the kingdom of god is within, be silent

path is ... 2 to 1 to 0 to all ... false self to true self to no self to all self ... no self is the collapse of the inside outside duality

[WelcometoReality]

2 hours ago, gettoefl said:

the divine triune revelations are inside outside beyond or logos spirit transcendent ... start inside, the kingdom of god is within, be silent

path is ... 2 to 1 to 0 to all ... false self to true self to no self to all self ... no self is the collapse of the inside outside duality

Didn't you say you hadn't experienced that?

Or maybe that was someone else. ?

[Danioover9000]

@Carl-Richard

18 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

These are the three principles of the "apophatic" approach to the problem of describing God:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apophatic_theology

 

1. Stay silent.

2. Distinguish between "the relative" and "the Absolute" (between the descriptions, thoughts or worldly manifestations of and about the transcendent and the transcendent in and of itself).

3. The apophatic language:

3.1 Metaphors of oneness: e.g. "God is an emanation, self-illuminated, like the sun."

3.2 Deontologization: God is not an object or a creature.

3.3 Dialectic between transcendence and immanence: e.g. God is both the relative and the Absolute, both form and formlessness, both thought and being, both manifest and unmanifest.

   It's all about the training.

[gettoefl]

12 hours ago, WelcometoReality said:

Didn't you say you hadn't experienced that?

Or maybe that was someone else. ?

it is trust before truth

[WelcometoReality]

39 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

it is trust before truth

Truth don't really make sense to me anymore. ?

Trust definitely. ?

Edited March 31, 2022 by WelcometoReality

[Leo Gura]

Except you can make very precise and accurate statements about God.

All the following is true and accurate:

• You are God
• God is Love
• God is Intelligence
• God is Eternal
• God is Infinity
• God is an Infinite Mind
• God is dreaming reality
• God is Total
• God is omniscient
• God is omnipotent
• God is Will
• God is selfless
• God is One
• God is Good
• God is Absolute Truth
• God is Consciousness
• Etc.

So this notion that you cannot speak about God is silly. Meaningful things can be said about God. You don't have to speak in Zen riddles.

[Preety_India]

God is everything. 

[Carl-Richard]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Except you can make very precise and accurate statements about God.

All the following is true and accurate:

• You are God
• God is Love
• God is Intelligence
• God is Eternal
• God is Infinity
• God is an Infinite Mind
• God is dreaming reality
• God is Total
• God is omniscient
• God is omnipotent
• God is Will
• God is selfless
• God is One
• God is Good
• God is Absolute Truth
• God is Consciousness
• Etc.

So this notion that you cannot speak about God is silly. Meaningful things can be said about God. You don't have to speak in Zen riddles.

Thanks for summing up the cataphatic approach!

My take is that the apophatic approach is mandatory as an introduction for newbies, which essentially makes the distinction between mysticism and theology, i.e. God is an experience and not an intellectual problem. Once that lesson is understood, then you can start exploring the most accurate definitions however you like.

[gettoefl]

7 hours ago, WelcometoReality said:

Truth don't really make sense to me anymore. ?

Trust definitely. ?

yes same, just remember that the journey of a thousand miles is completed one step at a time

hang in there for existence well knows the sincerity in your heart

[gettoefl]

after the not this not that approach, it is realized that god can't be known god can't be experienced god can't be felt ... it is realized all that was mental trickery ... after all who would know god? even god doesn't know god, it would need to enter the world of language to explain itself ... god is way beyond mental games ... no-words no-experience no-self is the god portal

[WelcometoReality]

6 hours ago, gettoefl said:

after the not this not that approach, it is realized that god can't be known god can't be experienced god can't be felt ... it is realized all that was mental trickery ... after all who would know god? even god doesn't know god, it would need to enter the world of language to explain itself ... god is way beyond mental games ... no-words no-experience no-self is the god portal

Yes definitely. Prior to everything. As soon as a word is about to be uttered about it it's already to late. So I sit here in silence and just bask in it's presence. 

[Leo Gura]

11 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

Thanks for summing up the cataphatic approach!

My take is that the apophatic approach is mandatory as an introduction for newbies, which essentially makes the distinction between mysticism and theology, i.e. God is an experience and not an intellectual problem. Once that lesson is understood, then you can start exploring the most accurate definitions however you like.

The map is not the territory.

God is an experience but also understanding what God is is a bit of an intellectual problem.

[Razard86]

16 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Except you can make very precise and accurate statements about God.

All the following is true and accurate:

• You are God
• God is Love
• God is Intelligence
• God is Eternal
• God is Infinity
• God is an Infinite Mind
• God is dreaming reality
• God is Total
• God is omniscient
• God is omnipotent
• God is Will
• God is selfless
• God is One
• God is Good
• God is Absolute Truth
• God is Consciousness
• Etc.

So this notion that you cannot speak about God is silly. Meaningful things can be said about God. You don't have to speak in Zen riddles.

I think what they were implying is that each of these words do not accurately describe the totality of what these descriptions actually mean. Its something you have stated in many of your videos. Since words, thoughts and emotion are all finite they cannot accurately describe how your awakenings are. Basically God can never be spoken because all finite descriptions fall short. But you are definitely correct in everything you posted.

Edited March 31, 2022 by Razard86