Russian invasion a disaster, according to Russian soldiers

[pedro23]

10 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

people who support ukrain are ametuers

Really? Why? Please enlighten us. 

[itachi uchiha]

12 minutes ago, pedro23 said:

Really? Why? Please enlighten us. 

it depends on where do u live and what do u prefer and who do u align with

do u prefer ukrain ruled by nato puppet which is zelensky

or do u want a russian puppet ruling ukrain .

in either way both are a puppet regime.people fighting ukrian are trying to keep the nato puppet from replaced by russian puppet

[BlueOak]

Russia is a brutal barbaric country and should be treated as such. We are weak in the west, afraid of conflict, afraid of coming out of our comfortable lives to face the reality of what we and they do. We make war. They make war. That is what happens. Western countries hide behind a veneer of respectability while we do our killing. Russia do it brazenly and in the open. 

Russia is rubbling 80 something villages, towns and cities. Its set a country on fire. The weak denials here of the reality are as bad as west, denying the reality of what Russia is or they have done. Its trying to imitate the west, badly. They are both dangerous opponents, neither can be trusted to be peaceful. People denying the reality of what they see cannot accept reality. We must distance ourselves from this old construct of wars between powers and the current systems of government wherever it is possible.

Azov were a neo nazi brigade of 900 men and women, armed by the west, they had been expanded into the national guard and so had an influx of non nazi members, their leader stepped down to try and run for office instead. He got 2% of the vote. Russia has killed tens of thousands, levelled cities, town, villages. Gunned families down, shelled civilians for weeks and lied about to their own people. Trying to make out they are the victim. Almost brought us to nuclear war. I want nothing to do with their current way of thinking, and I will continually make the case that they are someone we should stay as far away from as possible. So I choose the division again most of you want and have constantly asked for. There is no coming together when this is going on, only to accept the barbarity as part of us.

But I will make the same case, as I always have, every time the west does it. We as a world are primitive in our ways. We war and we kill, we blame the other side. We imagine we are right, so we can do these things to the perceived other.

Edited March 29, 2022 by BlueOak

[Ryan_047]

7 hours ago, K Ghoul said:

“a bunch of neo nazis and drug addicts in Kyiv” backed by the West.

Details and sources please. 

[K Ghoul]

9 minutes ago, Ryan_047 said:

Details and sources please. 

your wish is my command 

[vizual]

Whether Ukraine is backed by the west or not doesn't really matter. Vietnam was also backed by Russia and China when they fought the Americans. It were still the Vietnamese that fought and were the victor through the lense of history. And the world laughed that the mighty US military was defeated by a bunch of "farmers with straw hats".

Edited March 29, 2022 by vizual

[itachi uchiha]

1 minute ago, vizual said:

Whether Ukraine is backed by the west or not doesn't really matter. Vietnam was also backed by Russia and China when they fought the Americans. It were still the Vietnamese that fought and were the victor through the lense of history. 

Vietnam posed no threat to usa.usa invaded vietnam on a whim.while ukrain pose huge threat to russia

 

 

 

 

 

@BlueOakkBlueOakBlueOakBlueBlueOakBlueOakBlu

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 27/03/2022 at 4:14 PM, vizual said:

 

On 24/03/2022 at 9:14 PM, Danioover9000 said:

@Hardkill

   

 

[Ryan_047]

1 minute ago, itachi uchiha said:

Vietnam posed no threat to usa.usa invaded vietnam on a whim.while ukrain pose huge threat to russia

That's too simplistic. You should see this invasion through the lenses of USA's objective in the Cold War, which was stopping the expansion of communism literally anywhere on the globe, no matter how organic or not those communist movements/governments where, no matter how large or small the country. Of course, this doesn't justify dropping napalm from the skies and committing atrocities , but you are over simplifying things for the sole purpose of demonizing USA and painting Russia as the ultimate victim. 

Yes, Vietnam posed no military threat to the US mainland, but that's not why they invaded. 

Ukraine poses a threat to Putin's fascist murderous regime, not to Russia as a country. There's a big difference. 

[pedro23]

8 hours ago, K Ghoul said:

“a bunch of neo nazis and drug addicts in Kyiv” backed by the West.

You are delusional thinking that the fight is against Ukraine.

 

Brace yourselves, comrades, Mordor propaganda incoming... 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J55cSx8Rz_g 

 

Edited March 29, 2022 by pedro23

[itachi uchiha]

27 minutes ago, Ryan_047 said:

That's too simplistic. You should see this invasion through the lenses of USA's objective in the Cold War, which was stopping the expansion of communism literally anywhere on the globe, no matter how organic or not those communist movements/governments where, no matter how large or small the country. Of course, this doesn't justify dropping napalm from the skies and committing atrocities , but you are over simplifying things for the sole purpose of demonizing USA and painting Russia as the ultimate victim. 

Yes, Vietnam posed no military threat to the US mainland, but that's not why they invaded

similarly if u view this invasion through the lense of russia, u see that ukrain pose a huge threat to russian security.zelensky is a nato puppet. nato is brainwashing people that russia is your enemy. western ukrainian were killing and bombing civilians on eastern ukrianian russian speaking people. ukrian and nato commited war crimes in donbass.

29 minutes ago, Ryan_047 said:

Ukraine poses a threat to Putin's fascist murderous regime, not to Russia as a country. There's a big difference. 

ukrian pose threat to russia as a  country. if nato put bombs near russian border, it can hit moscow  in minutes.

also usa is more murderous than russia. usa is a heaven to its citizens. but usa and nato  killed lot of civilians in libiya, many afrcian countries,and many countries in middle east. and there are many war crimes which remains uknown because they happened in a country who have no voice

[K Ghoul]

@itachi uchiha they probably don’t even know what Abu Gharib is. I don’t even bother with them anymore, they are too dense.

[pedro23]

2 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

similarly if u view this invasion through the lense of russia, u see that ukrain pose a huge threat to russian security.zelensky is a nato puppet. nato is brainwashing people that russia is your enemy. western ukrainian were killing and bombing civilians on eastern ukrianian russian speaking people. ukrian and nato commited war crimes in donbass.

ukrian pose threat to russia as a  country. if nato put bombs near russian border, it can hit moscow  in minutes.

also usa is more murderous than russia. usa is a heaven to its citizens. but usa and nato  killed lot of civilians in libiya, many afrcian countries,and many countries in middle east. and there are many war crimes which remains uknown because they happened in a country who have no voice

 

Oh, maaaan... It's obvious that you hate the West so much, that you are not able to transcend the paradigm of "West bad. West criminal".  NATO certainly is no saint. Absolutely. When it comes to Libya it's a criminal. But if you condemn NATO you should condemn what Russia is doing even more. 

5 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

ukrian pose threat to russia as a  country. if nato put bombs near russian border, it can hit moscow  in minutes.

 

It is an utterly nonsensical  smoke screen.  First of all, Ukraine would have never joined NATO. It would have never been accepted. As already confirmed. 

[K Ghoul]

2 minutes ago, pedro23 said:

 

It is an utterly nonsensical  smoke screen.  First of all, Ukraine would have never joined NATO. It would have never been accepted. As already confirmed. 

^
@itachi uchiha you see what I’m saying? Lol when the US was dangling that carrot in front of Zelensky he actually thought that it was going to happen and was full of hope. Now that it dawned upon them - finally- that it was never going to happen he’s no longer feeling frisky and they’re singing a different tune:

 

Whether Zelensky realized why it was needed for the events to unfold this way I don’t know. Probably still didn’t.
 

[Ryan_047]

@itachi uchiha If every time you said Russia, I were to replace it with "Putin's murderous fascist regime filled with oligarchs who raped the Russian economy and the lives of their citizens" I'd actually agree with you. 

NATO never set foot in Donbass. 

29 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

ukrian pose threat to russia as a  country. if nato put bombs near russian border, it can hit moscow  in minutes.

There are defensive missiles in Poland and Romania. Why hasn't Russia invaded those countries? Theoretically those systems could be converted into offensive ones, all right. But why hasn't Russia bitched so hard about those systems already? They can easily hit the Russian heartland. If they really considered those systems to be so dangerous, why haven't Putin's oligarchs and puppets shit their pants and try to do something about it as they do now with Ukraine? Good question, right?

Also everyone who's defending Putin so dearly forget that Russia has tons and tons and tons of nuclear weapons. They can easily retaliate and fuck up the entire world. NATO could put all of their nuclear weapons 1 meter away from the Russian border, and if they fire a single one, everyone loses. It doesn't matter if NATO shoots a nuclear weapon from Saturn or Ukraine, the result will be exactly the same. Also in official numbers it is Russia who has the most nuclear weapons. Mutually assured destruction is what kept Russia "safe", and that equation doesn't change if Ukraine joins NATO or not. 

29 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

also usa is more murderous than russia. usa is a heaven to its citizens. but usa and nato  killed lot of civilians in libiya, many afrcian countries,and many countries in middle east. and there are many war crimes which remains uknown because they happened in a country who have no voice

YES, EXACTLY! I absolutely 100% without sarcasm agree on the fact that USA has more blood on its hands than Russia (post Soviet Union ). But how is this relevant may I ask? It's not, this is yet another attempt to paint USA as the devil and Russia as Virgin Mary who's defending the entire world against NATO. 

29 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

usa is a heaven to its citizens.

I wouldn't say that. Being a slave in capitalist-ever more polluting oligarchy is not heaven. Better than most of the world, but not by any means ideal. 

Edited March 29, 2022 by Ryan_047

[itachi uchiha]

12 minutes ago, Ryan_047 said:

NATO never set foot in Donbass.

u will never find proof for this because all the proof is deleted form internet as youtube belongs to usa.

13 minutes ago, Ryan_047 said:

There are defensive missiles in Poland and Romania. Why hasn't Russia invaded those countries? Theoretically those systems could be converted into offensive ones, all right. But why hasn't Russia bitched so hard about those systems already? They can easily hit the Russian heartland. If they really considered those systems to be so dangerous, why haven't Putin's oligarchs and puppets shit their pants and try to do something about it as they do now with Ukraine? Good question, right?

if russia invade poland and romania , it would create a world war  involving nuclear weapons and china or india or other world powers would win in the end as usa , russia and eu will get destroyed.

15 minutes ago, Ryan_047 said:

Also everyone who's defending Putin so dearly forget that Russia has tons and tons and tons of nuclear weapons. They can easily retaliate and fuck up the entire world. NATO could put all of their nuclear weapons 1 meter away from the Russian border, and if they fire a single one, everyone loses. It doesn't matter if NATO shoots a nuclear weapon from Saturn or Ukraine, the result will be exactly the same. Also in official numbers it is Russia who has the most nuclear weapons. Mutually assured destruction is what kept Russia "safe", and that equation doesn't change if Ukraine joins NATO or not. 

after collapse of ussr , russia only faught defensive war as to my knowledge. whereas usa and nato fought lots and lots of proxy wars for profit. and people are more complex than"oh putin is a psychopath" "putin will use nuclear weapons on a whim".reality is more complex and people are more  complex.

 

17 minutes ago, Ryan_047 said:

YES, EXACTLY! I absolutely 100% without sarcasm agree on the fact that USA has more blood on its hands than Russia (post Soviet Union ). But how is this relevant may I ask? It's not, this is yet another attempt to paint USA as the devil and Russia as Virgin Mary who's defending the entire world against NATO. 

in the above post u were putting as if usa and nato are jesus whereas russia is evil sociapath mass murderer.that is not correct. nato, usa and russia are not saints . they have commited war crimes.but  u were saying nato and usa = jesus

 

 

[pedro23]

56 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

ukrian pose threat to russia as a  country. if nato put bombs near russian border, it can hit moscow  in minutes.

 

Oh, maaaan... It's obvious that you hate the West so much, that you are not able to transcend the paradigm of "West bad. West criminal".  NATO certainly is no saint. Absolutely. When it comes to Libya it's a criminal. But if you condemn NATO you should condemn what Russia is doing even more. 

12 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

ukrian pose threat to russia as a  country. if nato put bombs near russian border, it can hit moscow  in minutes.

 

It is an utterly nonsensical  smoke screen.  First of all, Ukraine would have never joined NATO. It would have never been accepted. As already confirmed.  
 

Putin ain't a madman.  He needs a  carefully constructed reason to act on his plan. It is absolutely obvious that "NATO at Russia's borders" is just a pretext. Why? 

1.  There are NATO members, that border Mordor, I am sorry, ruSSia, such as Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia that have NATO bases on their territories. Why not mention them? Why not threaten them?  

2. 

     a. There are much more important economic incentives for the invasion: after the discovery of vast sources of natural gas in Ukraine, Russian energy  monopoly in Europe would have been under threat. Ukraine would have been the second richest country in Europe after Mordor.  *Would* ... Why? Simple. 80% of those reserves are located on the coast of Crimea and in Eastern Ukraine. Is it a coincidence that these particular regions were illegally annexed in 2014? This invasion has the goal of  ultimately  countering the threat to Mordor's hegemony. You invade a country, you install a puppet government. This government allows you to exploit it's energy resources... Iraq 2.0 

     b. More than that Mordor pays billions upon billions to Ukraine every year in gas transit fees. Even with an intellect of a Mordor propagandon you can get the logic here.... 
 

3. The narrative inside Mordor.  

The narratives on the orkish state media is that  is the "Second Patriotic War". The Orkish Army is liberating Ukraine from it's American Oppressors. That Ukraine has never been an independent state, that the Ukrainians and the russians are essentially the same people and the West has divided them. Given these circumstances the Ukraine must be re united with Mother Russia, and the great injustice manifested in the "Ukrainian statehood" must cease to exist.  

To sum it up 

I. "Whatabboutism" leads absolutely nowhere. America committed atrocities. That is a fact. But this does not abolish any moral responsibility for the unimaginable  barbarism perpetuated by ruSSia in Ukraine. If you condemn one, you must deffinitely condemn another. 

II. You are absolutely entitled to your opinion. But, please do your research on the matter of eastern European politics. I assume my limitations when in comes to, for example, Pakistani - Indian border disputes. I am sure I would have to learn a lot from you on this topic because I am  geographically, historically and culturally estranged from the geopolitical situation in this region. I am saying this because, not knowing the situation I could easily fall for disinformation and propaganda.

[Ryan_047]

1 minute ago, itachi uchiha said:

u will never find proof for this because all the proof is deleted form internet as youtube belongs to usa.

And how do you know that if there is no proof available? It's just a supposition. This just shows how much substance your arguments hold. 

1 minute ago, itachi uchiha said:

if russia invade poland and romania , it would create a world war  involving nuclear weapons and china or india or other world powers would win in the end as usa , russia and eu will get destroyed.

That was not the argument. The argument was that Russia bitches about those possible nuclear weapons in Ukraine, whereas they said shit about the defensive missile system in those countries. Double standards. They bitch about nuclear weapons when it suits them, and thus they lack integrity. Read again what I've said.

4 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

after collapse of ussr , russia only faught defensive war as to my knowledge. whereas usa and nato fought lots and lots of proxy wars for profit. and people are more complex than"oh putin is a psychopath" "putin will use nuclear weapons on a whim".reality is more complex and people are more  complex.

This has nothing to do with what I've said. Re-read what I have said. I haven't said Putin is a dumb troll who'll use nuclear weapons when he gets a bit angry. 

5 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

in the above post u were putting as if usa and nato are jesus whereas russia is evil sociapath mass murderer.that is not correct. nato, usa and russia are not saints . they have commited war crimes.but  u were saying nato and usa = jesus

I didn't. I used historic facts to counter your subtle anti Western narrative. I haven't said Russia is a sociopathic state. I said that Putin's regime IS NOT Russia. That's all. Putin is not doing Russia a favor by invading Ukraine. 

[pedro23]

9 minutes ago, itachi uchiha said:

russia only faught defensive war as to my knowledge.

Trying very hard not to laugh. 

1. Instrumented  a proxy war in Moldova (1992). Russian troops fought on the side of separatists. Russian troops still occupy Transnistria to this day. Guess how the Moldovan  side where called by the russians? Fascists. It is the projection game at its finest. 

2. Instrumented a proxy war in Abkhazia (1992-1993). Russia supported and trained Abkhazian troops. 

3. Invaded Checnya (1994 - 1996). Maaaaaaaaaaassssiiiive war crimes. Russian style - bombed the shit out civil areas (Rings a bell?) destroyed whole towns, including the capital Groznyi, raped women, shot civilians en masse

4. Invaded Georgia (2008) - Created a separatist republic of South Ossetia. 

5. Invaded Crimea - 2014; Sent troops to the Donbas - 2014 to fight along the separatists. 

6. Invaded Ukraine - 2022. You know the rest. 

[BlueOak]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_Russia
16 Wars since the 90's. 3 of them ending in old soviet times.

If we were to extend it to proxy wars we'd have a list as long or longer than the US. Scroll to modern here to see the updates.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_proxy_wars

If we were to extend the list of countries they've armed, it'd be a very long list. They armed, trained and supported governments in Iraq and Libya for example both before and after their wars with the US. Many US wars involved Russian influence directly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libya–Russia_relations
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq–Russia_relations

In fact I want to edit this to say reading the proxy war list there are a ridiculous amount of smaller countries, not just the big ones, I never knew supplied arms overseas.

Edited March 29, 2022 by BlueOak

[itachi uchiha]

36 minutes ago, pedro23 said:

It is an utterly nonsensical  smoke screen.  First of all, Ukraine would have never joined NATO. It would have never been accepted. As already confirmed.  

this is not true.zelensky is a nato puppet.

37 minutes ago, pedro23 said:

It is an utterly nonsensical  smoke screen.  First of all, Ukraine would have never joined NATO. It would have never been accepted. As already confirmed.  
 

Putin ain't a madman.  He needs a  carefully constructed reason to act on his plan. It is absolutely obvious that "NATO at Russia's borders" is just a pretext. Why? 

1.  There are NATO members, that border Mordor, I am sorry, ruSSia, such as Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia that have NATO bases on their territories. Why not mention them? Why not threaten them?  

2. 

     a. There are much more important economic incentives for the invasion: after the discovery of vast sources of natural gas in Ukraine, Russian energy  monopoly in Europe would have been under threat. Ukraine would have been the second richest country in Europe after Mordor.  *Would* ... Why? Simple. 80% of those reserves are located on the coast of Crimea and in Eastern Ukraine. Is it a coincidence that these particular regions were illegally annexed in 2014? This invasion has the goal of  ultimately  countering the threat to Mordor's hegemony. You invade a country, you install a puppet government. This government allows you to exploit it's energy resources... Iraq 2.0 

     b. More than that Mordor pays billions upon billions to Ukraine every year in gas transit fees. Even with an intellect of a Mordor propagandon you can get the logic here.... 
 

3. The narrative inside Mordor.  

The narratives on the orkish state media is that  is the "Second Patriotic War". The Orkish Army is liberating Ukraine from it's American Oppressors. That Ukraine has never been an independent state, that the Ukrainians and the russians are essentially the same people and the West has divided them. Given these circumstances the Ukraine must be re united with Mother Russia, and the great injustice manifested in the "Ukrainian statehood" must cease to exist.  

yup .

there is a truth in this. i agree  that russian intentions are not 100% pure. there maybe profit involved

38 minutes ago, pedro23 said:

I. "Whatabboutism" leads absolutely nowhere. America committed atrocities. That is a fact. But this does not abolish any moral responsibility for the unimaginable  barbarism perpetuated by ruSSia in Ukraine. If you condemn one, you must deffinitely condemn another.

usa and nato has no right to condemn russia. all these media is controled by usa. and they are using these media agianst russia. they absolutely have no right to do this. neither us government or nato

40 minutes ago, pedro23 said:

II. You are absolutely entitled to your opinion. But, please do your research on the matter of eastern European politics. I assume my limitations when in comes to, for example, Pakistani - Indian border disputes. I am sure I would have to learn a lot from you on this topic because I am  geographically, historically and culturally estranged from the geopolitical situation in this region. I am saying this because, not knowing the situation I could easily fall for disinformation and propaganda.

yes. i do not have knowledge on eastern politics.i agree. all i am saying is that media have no right to condemn russia as all media is controlled from usa at top