Is Buddhas teaching to pessimistic?

[CuriousityIsKey]

I mean if one listens to Buddha than it is basically saying that life is suffering and that the good things in it are just attachments that should be overcome, because to not exist is better than to reiterate on and on.

Is that cool?

Edited March 8, 2022 by CuriousityIsKey

[Chrisd]

This life is suffering business, I've heard it's not really what Gautama Buddha said. It's more like an observation "there is suffering". And then the good news, there's a way to overcome it. Then you're happy. 

[Yarco]

Suffering is a rather incomplete translation of Dukkha. I'd recommend reading the whole Wikipedia entry on this word for a more nuanced view:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duḥkha

Not just good things are attachments. So are the bad.

Attachment to good things mostly causes suffering when you inevitably lose them. When your favorite pen breaks, when you finish the last slice of pizza. Your life LOL

Being attached to bad things also causes suffering. The more you obsess and worry about bad stuff, the more suffering you inflict on yourself.

If your basement is flooding, you can worry about all the damage, what a pain it'll be to deal with insurance, what you could have done to prevent this, etc etc etc. Or you can just focus on what's in your power in the present moment. You can just take a deep breath and start scooping out buckets of water without having a panic attack about it, accepting the inevitable situation fully and just doing what you can.

If you aren't attached, you can't suffer. (Easier said than done.)

Edited March 8, 2022 by Yarco

[Inliytened1]

19 minutes ago, Yarco said:

Suffering is a rather incomplete translation of Dukkha. I'd recommend reading the whole Wikipedia entry on this word for a more nuanced view:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duḥkha

Not just good things are attachments. So are the bad.

Attachment to good things mostly causes suffering when you inevitably lose them. When your favorite pen breaks, when you finish the last slice of pizza. Your life LOL

Being attached to bad things also causes suffering. The more you obsess and worry about bad stuff, the more suffering you inflict on yourself.

If you aren't attached, you can't suffer. (Easier said than done.)

Well said.  But that is why  mortality comes with some degree of suffering.  A self is selfish to some degree.

The key is self understanding and self awareess.  To be come conscious when suffering kicks in and see it for what it is- thus alleviating it.  So go meta so to speak.....

[Chrisd]

1 hour ago, Inliytened1 said:

Well said.  But that is why  mortality comes with some degree of suffering.  A self is selfish to some degree.

As I understand it there's a way to end it for good, no more suffering. While living

[Inliytened1]

5 minutes ago, Chrisd said:

As I understand it there's a way to end it for good, no more suffering. While living

Yeah..just don't suffer

 

[Chrisd]

1 hour ago, Inliytened1 said:

Yeah..just don't suffer

 

I'm going to push you a little because I like to  

Many folks don't believe there can be an end to suffering, but I like to think they're wrong.

Gary Weber is a living example, he describes his state as one of being free of suffering. One article; https://psychologytomorrowmagazine.com/jeff-warren-neuroscience-suffering-end/

Possibly Nisargadatta had a similar experience: from "I am that" describing his state: Everything that exists, exists as my self. There is nothing which is different from me. There is no duality and, therefore, no pain. There are no problems. It is the sphere of love, in which everything is perfect. What happens, happens spontaneously, without intentions -- like digestion, or the growth of the hair. Realise this, and be free from the limitations of the mind.

I like Ajahn Chah's approach: "it's only when we make liberation from suffering our ultimate goal that we're on the right path: nothing less. Suffering has a cause and conditions for its existence." https://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Unshakeable_Peace1_2.php 

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, Chrisd said:

 

Possibly Nisargadatta had a similar experience: from "I am that" describing his state: Everything that exists, exists as my self. There is nothing which is different from me. There is no duality and, therefore, no pain. There are no problems. It is the sphere of love, in which everything is perfect. What happens, happens spontaneously, without intentions -- like digestion, or the growth of the hair. Realise this, and be free from the limitations of the 

Well let's look at this one.  This is exactly correct and this is the end of suffering.  Howe er - when we sink back into the dream, and ultimately there is nothing else to do - guess what returns.  If you wish to live In a non-dual state at all times - (it's not a true non dual state because in one you will be dead) fine.  You may not have suffering.. but you also won't be living.   You see, suffering is part of living.  It is actually selfish to deny it.   This is why liberation is not about the end of suffering it is about understanding.

[Chrisd]

Well let's agree to disagree

[Inliytened1]

Just now, Chrisd said:

Well let's agree to disagree

I'm not saying you can't be happy.  Don't misunderstand.  

[Chrisd]

1 hour ago, Inliytened1 said:

I'm not saying you can't be happy.  Don't misunderstand.  

I'm saying you can be happy permanently

Not that I have attained this, I'm just saying

Edited March 8, 2022 by Chrisd

[Inliytened1]

Just now, Chrisd said:

I'm saying you can be happy permanently

And I agree with that.  But in life you want to have and experience attachments.  When you lose a loved one there will be suffering from the loss of part of your identity.  Part of you.  That's OK.  It doesn't mean you are not happy.  You just suffer a loss of part of you.

[Chrisd]

I'm all about exploring all dimensions of life, but I just don't see the need for suffering in any of them..

[BipolarGrowth]

Dukkha is often translated to dissatisfaction as well. As others here have said, Buddhism asserts that there is dissatisfaction inherent to life before completing the path that leads out of dissatisfaction. You already know that dissatisfaction exists before you even hear about Buddhism. Buddhism is good news as it details a way to get out of dissatisfaction. 

[Thought Art]

It’s not. Read more about the teachings imo

[Breakingthewall]

it is optimistic because it teaches the path of total happiness, which is total detachment. the more attachment, the more suffering, that's why it says that life is suffering, if you are attached to the mind. without attachment there is only flow, pure happiness. an animal is not attached to the mind and is pure fluidity. for humans this is extremely difficult, our mental universe is more intense than the physical universe, we live in the mind, so we have to make this detachment intentionally, understanding

[gettoefl]

1 hour ago, Chrisd said:

I'm all about exploring all dimensions of life, but I just don't see the need for suffering in any of them..

love just bid a fond sincere goodbye each night, if you are given another day repeat