How Do You Self-actualise If There Is No Self?

[shantaram]

I'm interested to see what everyone thinks about this... Is it even possible to self actualise while stuck in the mind-identified state?

Would we naturally self-actualise when we are aware of our true selves and see through the illusion?

A year ago when i started following leo's stuff  i got really excited about self-improvement and i got quite strict with myself, but soon i realised i didn't know what improvement really meant to me and why i wanted to improve. I think improvement flows naturally and effortlessly from a place of acceptance of what is.

[abrakamowse]

I think that's (at the moment) the only way to be actualized, it's like Morpheus taking out Neo from the matrix, he had to use the way he understood to get him out of it. 

And I think the way you say one can get actualized or aware is correct. Everyone is doing it from the mind-identified state, but if one continues doing it naturally at certain point you will be enlightened or aware or actualized.

Not sure if I am correct, but that's my opinion at this moment.

Edited February 11, 2016 by abrakamowse

[Ramu]

There is a self, but his concept of no self means no ego.  Of course you have a True Self that is commonly referred to as The Witness (or Soul).  I think there is room for improvement in the physical world sense.  For example improving a skill or learning more at a job to advance your career, etc.  I think self actualizing spiritually could be thought of as Awakening and perhaps enlightenment.  Just my opinion.

[Ayla]

Leo answers to that in his FAQ videos about enlightenment. 

Some people become awake - which gets them naturally to self-actualization. The majority tho, are first trying to self-actualize, and attain enlightenment through sheer determination and will power. 

The two sides of the same coin really  

 

[jjer94]

@shantaram Hi shantaram,

I have an analogy about the actualized self that I used before, but I'll use it here again. 

As you've been told, the self is an illusion, but it's a totally different thing when you see it for yourself. 

Imagine sailing a boat, believing you have control as to where you go because your hand is on the tiller. Then, something causes you to turn around and look down at the tiller. You see for yourself that this whole time, there was no rudder! You were never steering the boat even when you believed you were! It may take some time, but eventually, you release your hand off the tiller; you release your illusion of control. And instead of the boat crashing, it sails even better now that your hand is off that dang tiller. The wind gently guides the boat, and the boat goes wherever it feels like going. That is actualized sailing.

The boat is your body and mind. Your hand on the tiller is ego. Release the tiller, and your body and mind do whatever they feel moved to do. That may sound disastrous, but without the ego's demands, life just flows naturally. You do whatever you feel like doing, and you finish whatever you need to get done. Anything that doesn't get done was probably not worth getting done in the first place. You "work" (it's play) more efficiently without the ego making judgments about choices, because there are no choices; there is only flow. That is the self-actualized life. And yes, it's a contradiction because there is no self to actualize. But this is what Leo is likely referring to.

I hope that clears things up for you!

[shantaram]

10 hours ago, jjer94 said:

@shantaram Hi shantaram,

I have an analogy about the actualized self that I used before, but I'll use it here again. 

As you've been told, the self is an illusion, but it's a totally different thing when you see it for yourself. 

Imagine sailing a boat, believing you have control as to where you go because your hand is on the tiller. Then, something causes you to turn around and look down at the tiller. You see for yourself that this whole time, there was no rudder! You were never steering the boat even when you believed you were! It may take some time, but eventually, you release your hand off the tiller; you release your illusion of control. And instead of the boat crashing, it sails even better now that your hand is off that dang tiller. The wind gently guides the boat, and the boat goes wherever it feels like going. That is actualized sailing.

The boat is your body and mind. Your hand on the tiller is ego. Release the tiller, and your body and mind do whatever they feel moved to do. That may sound disastrous, but without the ego's demands, life just flows naturally. You do whatever you feel like doing, and you finish whatever you need to get done. Anything that doesn't get done was probably not worth getting done in the first place. You "work" (it's play) more efficiently without the ego making judgments about choices, because there are no choices; there is only flow. That is the self-actualized life. And yes, it's a contradiction because there is no self to actualize. But this is what Leo is likely referring to.

I hope that clears things up for you!

absolutely jjer94!.. i can relate to it too. recently i've been trusting my nature a lot more and I feel so much more flow in what i do.. things that would have once bothered me or i would have made into big personal problems i find myself laughing about.. its like there just not important anymore. I've begun to trust my body and deepest intuitions and as a result its also becoming effortless and enjoyable for me to eat healthy and exercise frequently and i feel a lot less fear in situations that i know i would have felt crippled over not long ago. i know i have a lot to learn of course but i feel as if i have broken one of the bars off the prison of my mind and it's opened a whole new realm of possibilities.