Leo featured in suicide cult article

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, Jahmaine said:

Yellow - Bordering turquoise, only because I respect what a true “spiritual master” is. 
But I’m multi-perspectival, can easily detach and not shoot the messenger, I can meet people where they’re at without getting into conflict and I do see the interconnectedness of everything and how it all works together, plus various mystical experiences as to why I said bordering turquoise (as would be described in the model), I wouldn’t say I’ve fully embodied it in a way I’d expect from an Eckhart tolle, Dalai Lama or such like though. But yeah yellow primarily if I have pick one.

Nice.  I struggle with embodiment.

[Breakingthewall]

22 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

But you are God dreaming up this dream and thus you have the ability to manipulate it as God - not as the ego. 

As God I'm already doing. Everything is my will, each atom is exactly where it should be, everything constantly changing according my infinite will, so more than saying that miracles exist, we should say that absolutely everything is a miracle

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, Breakingthewall said:

As God I'm already doing. Everything is my will, each atom is exactly where it should be, everything constantly changing according my infinite will, so more than saying that miracles exist, we should say that absolutely everything is a miracle

Yeah agreed.  That you exist at all is a miracle.

[Breakingthewall]

4 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Yeah agreed.  That you exist at all is a miracle.

So saying: I am going to access God's consciousness and cure my cancer means that you, inlyitened, as an ego, are going to modify God's will and impose your own, since as an ego you don't like having cancer. nonsense in my opinion, there are no such miracles

Edited March 10, 2022 by Breakingthewall

[zurew]

17 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

Once you stop worshipping knowledge and being owned by thought, you stop worshipping people you think posses knowledge. Or demeaning or belittling them for not possessing it for that matter. Because there aren't any, and no one possesses anything, no one actually knows anything. 

I don't particularly agree with Leo's behaviour, when he said something along the lines of, that he accessed such states, to which no one has ever had access before. I do have my own critisism of Leo, and i agree with you, that if someone wants to make it self to look like they are special,then, it can be a problem. Even if it is not intentional, it could create a dynamic where some people starts to worship that particular person.

 

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, Breakingthewall said:

So saying: I am going to access God's consciousness and cure my cancer means that you, I inlyitened, as an ego, are going to modify God's will and impose your own, since as an ego you don't like having cancer. nonsense in my opinion, there are no such miracles

 As an ego no you won't.   As Mandy said you cannot see God's face and live.  It cannot come from selfishness.  

[Inliytened1]

4 minutes ago, zurew said:

I don't particularly agree with Leo's behaviour, when he said something along the lines of, that he accessed such states, to which no one has ever had access before. I do have my own critisism of Leo, and i agree with you, that if someone wants to make it self to look like they are special,then, it can be a problem. Even if it is not intentional, it could create a dynamic where some people starts to worship that particular person.

 

The funny thing is when you do access these states there is no one else but you

 

[RMQualtrough]

20 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

God does not posses the ability to manipulate. God does not possess anything at all, because it is all God. You ARE creation, creating, and creator. 

"Manipulate", what is already manifestation, assumed to be separate from what I think I am. But manifestation and manifester are not two, not separate, no line between them. 

That would be the accurate interpretation, "Brahman without attribute" (Nirguna Brahman). When people only memorize Leo videos without actually having been through any sort of serious ego death, there is great misinterpretation.

The last video I saw with Leo he was discussing riding the wave of a reality which is simply unfolding. This state of being is the stereotypical "zen" state. Ideas of power and control are bizarre, twisted, and often delusional. Desire for control is very un-zen. The entire new age movement is jam packed with magical claims which take serious insight and turn it into a "soccer mom bookshelf bestseller".

The type of things James Randi debunked have nothing to do with genuine spiritual realizations. You don't smoke some DMT then gain magical powers like Hogwarts or some shit.

An example of a genuine realization might be that literally every form is subjective. A tape measure can read 30 inches, but the perception of how large that 30 inches seems can alter, because of course the tape measure itself is a tool in physical space. So you see that while the measure still reads 30 inches, there is a subjective element to it.

I used that in particular as it relates to "how you dream up reality".

[zurew]

22 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

Is there really a "way" to look at IT though? 

Yes, there is always a way to look at it. Especially, if we are talking about perspectives. I think reality is sort of perspectival. From a human's pov it could seem like that miracles are happening, you could say that is is not true, because from the so called absolute pov it is this or that. We can dismiss the so called relative povs, or we can say that every pov has an element of truth in it.

[Inliytened1]

4 minutes ago, RMQualtrough said:

That would be the accurate interpretation, "Brahman without attribute" (Nirguna Brahman). When people only memorize Leo videos without actually having been through any sort of serious ego death, there is great misinterpretation.

The last video I saw with Leo he was discussing riding the wave of a reality which is simply unfolding. This state of being is the stereotypical "zen" state. Ideas of power and control are bizarre, twisted, and often delusional. Desire for control is very un-zen. The entire new age movement is jam packed with magical claims which take serious insight and turn it into a "soccer mom bookshelf bestseller".

The type of things James Randi debunked have nothing to do with genuine spiritual realizations. You don't smoke some DMT then gain magical powers like Hogwarts or some shit.

An example of a genuine realization might be that literally every form is subjective. A tape measure can read 30 inches, but the perception of how large that 30 inches seems can alter, because of course the tape measure itself is a tool in physical space. So you see that while the measure still reads 30 inches, there is a subjective element to it.

I used that in particular as it relates to "how you dream up reality".

Yeah but what you are missing is that God is everything and that also includes manipulation.  It just can't come from ego or selfishness. 

[RMQualtrough]

7 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

So saying: I am going to access God's consciousness and cure my cancer means that you, inlyitened, as an ego, are going to modify God's will and impose your own, since as an ego you don't like having cancer. nonsense in my opinion, there are no such miracles

A lot of the lunacy might come down to the choice of wording? I prefer the term creation over imagination, as imagination carries with it some implied control.

People go off the rails thinking if they just smoke some 5-MeO and "become God consciousness" they can perform magic like Harry Potter or some shit.

Of course, when there are no boundaries or limits whatsoever, there is nothing to grab. Any border of thingness you may expect to grab in order to manipulate you find is simply not there. You're at the full mercy of unstoppable creation, of Brahman. Experientially it is very frightening and just about the most alien thing anything could ever experience.

[zurew]

10 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

The funny thing is when you do access these states there is no one else but you

Thats fine, if i want to say that those states are more true compare to the other states. However, most arguments are around 'from which state of consciousness can i make sense of reality the best' or 'How could i know, what is True?'. I know its a problematic statement, because it assumes a lot, but because langauge is limited and relative it will always be problematic.

We can make every claim relativistic, even the God ones if we want to. If you truly want to be objective, why would you put more emphasis on the God levels of consciousness compare to the other states. If i change my brain chemistry enough with 5 meo dmt, then my ego could be crushed and my perception of reality can change and also my knowledge about my identity as well. But why would you put more value on a certain state compare to the other states.

10 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

The funny thing is when you do access these states there is no one else but you

Also, i want to add here, that from that state, there is no one else but me. But again, why would i appretiate that state more to derive the Truth compare to the other ones. 

Edited March 10, 2022 by zurew

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, zurew said:

Thats fine, if i want to say that those states are more true compare to the other states. However, most arguments are around 'from which state of consciousness can i make sense of reality the best' or 'How could i know, what is True?'. I know its a problematic statement, because it assumes a lot, but because langauge is limited and relative it will always be problematic.

We can make every claim relativistic, even the God ones if we want to. If you truly want to be objective, why would you put more emphasis on the God levels of consciousness compare to the other states. If i change my brain chemistry enough with 5 meo dmt, then my ego could be crushed and my perception of reality can change and also my knowledge about my identity as well. But why would you put more value on a certain state compare to the other states.

Thats a key trap.  One state of consciousness is not more special than another.  However there are higher - not better - states of consciousness.  Right now we are in a finite state.  But we can also be in an infinite state - though as you mentioned the ego will die in such a state.  It is here though, in an elevated state of consciousness that miracles can occur.  Miracles of course is a relative term.  But I mean here where the dream has the possibility of being altered in some fashion.

[mandyjw]

12 minutes ago, zurew said:

Yes, there is always a way to look at it. Especially, if we are talking about perspectives. I think reality is sort of perspectival. From a human's pov it could seem like that miracles are happening, you could say that is is not true, because from the so called absolute pov it is this or that. We can dismiss the so called relative povs, or we can say that every pov has an element of truth in it.

Do you have a perspective though? Is there a you that can posses a perspective? The only reason you can think a thought is because you are not a thought. The only way you can entertain a new "perspective" (or as directly experienced think a new thought) is because you do not HAVE a perspective that you are. 

It's not about being open-minded. There's no you that possesses a mind that can be closed or open. It's that "mind"
is a thought and "you" are a thought. What's always there aware of thought, is the true You. That foundation which is Nothing and Open, and not knowing, is the only Love/Truth. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks of it because it can't be thought. Matter=thought. 

[zurew]

1 minute ago, Inliytened1 said:

One state of consciousness is not more special than another.

Yes, but isn't most claims on this forum comes from the place, or from the claim, that the so called infinite levels consciousness pov is the "right", and from that pov we can basically allow ourselves, to make absolute claims, but on the other hand if someone disagrees with a certain position, then it can be dismissed or shut down, because he/she doesnt use the same level of consciousness as a basic foundation, to derive truth from.

[Inliytened1]

1 minute ago, mandyjw said:

Do you have a perspective though? Is there a you that can posses a perspective? The only reason you can think a thought is because you are not a thought. The only way you can entertain a new "perspective" (or as directly experienced think a new thought) is because you do not HAVE a perspective that you are. 

It's not about being open-minded. There's no you that possesses a mind that can be closed or open. It's that "mind"
is a thought and "you" are a thought. What's always there aware of thought, is the true You. That foundation which is Nothing and Open, and not knowing, is the only Love/Truth. It doesn't matter what anyone thinks of it because it can't be thought. Matter=thought. 

I think your sliding into the neo-advaita trap.here.  there is a you it's just that the ego you doesn't really exist.  You are just Mind.

[Breakingthewall]

48 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

God does not posses the ability to manipulate. God does not possess anything at all, because it is all God. You ARE creation, creating, and creator. 

You could say: God has infinite ability to manipulate. all reality is god and is being infinitely manipulated by itself

[Inliytened1]

3 minutes ago, zurew said:

Yes, but isn't most claims on this forum comes from the place, or from the claim, that the so called infinite levels consciousness pov is the "right", and from that pov we can basically allow ourselves, to make absolute claims, but on the other hand if someone disagrees with a certain position, then it can be dismissed or shut down, because he/she doesnt use the same level of consciousness as a basic foundation, to derive truth from.

There are facets of the Absolute that can be absolutely realized.  These are indeed Absolute Truths.  Such as that reality is indeed non-dual and Infinite at the deepest level.   But it doesn't make someone special to be God realized.  

[mandyjw]

 

1 minute ago, Inliytened1 said:

I think your sliding into the neo-advaita trap.here.  there is a you it's just that the ego you doesn't really exist.  You are just Mind.

You have five senses, you know this, yes?

You directly experience separate senses? Yes, or no? Without thinking, right now, do you have separate senses?

Are you aware, right now?

If you are aware does it seem that when thinking, that awareness (not separate) is filtered through 5 separate senses? 

Mind is a filter. 

Do not mistake the filter for the water. Don't mistake the slide on the projector for the light. The projection and the projector are only light. The slide is not. 

You cannot KNOW yourself, you are the Knowing itself. Once misunderstanding (there are 5 senses and a separate me) is seen to be misunderstanding that is it. It cannot be called knowing or understanding, because it is not an "it", YOU are Aware. 

 

 

[zurew]

4 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

Do you have a perspective though? Is there a you that can posses a perspective? 

Do you think, that what you say is not just a perspective? Because , so far what i have seen about these enlightenment arugments, is that there is so much disagreement between person and person, that it suggest, that there is much more place for not knowing compared to knowing.

7 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

The only way you can entertain a new "perspective" (or as directly experienced think a new thought) is because you do not HAVE a perspective that you are. 

But again, how do you arrive at the claim, about what I am. You are using the so called infinite consciousness, to derive at the conclusion that I am God. So you put more emphasis on that level of consciousness compared to the other ones. And now you can say, but at that level there is no one to have a perspective, but again, why do you want to make it out to be that it is more objective?

The level of consciousness which one use is the gatekeeper here. It basically changes everything.