Leo featured in suicide cult article

[Thought Art]

Just now, AndylizedAAY said:

@Thought Art Who is Rob and why are you specifically asking him? You know, there was this conversation on the forum about someone seeing Andy which is my name. There are many Andys out there but although I don't remember the description of this person, it seems to fit me. I bring this up because Rob might be someone important to the conversation that I am missing out on.

Oh, Adeptus runs a channel on YouTube I thought he used the name Rob. I can make edits if we want.

[AdeptusPsychonautica]

21 minutes ago, AndylizedAAY said:

@AdeptusPsychonautica Are you the one who posted the article against Leo? I'm not attacking you, just confirming. If you have, then are you not banned because Leo claims that there will be articles a lot worse against him?

The article is not authored by me nor did I post it, however it contains quotations from me and references my channel.

I’m not sure what you mean about the banned part. The fact I am posting should indicate that is not the case, and I think you might be misunderstanding Leo’s comment about worse articles. He was saying there COULD be, not that there WILL be.

[AdeptusPsychonautica]

19 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

Rob, what is the building block of reality?

(love your channel btw)

I have no idea. I quite like Donald Hoffmans theory of he puts out in The Case Against Reality, and I like James Cook’s Living Mirror Theory. I also occasionally find myself dipping  into panpsychism and animism - particularly when I’m on retreat in the Amazon. 
 

Like I said I have no particular dog in this game of who is correct about reality, and so I reserve the right to flip flop as I see fit or to not give a fuck ?

[AndylizedAAY]

4 minutes ago, AdeptusPsychonautica said:

The article is not authored by me nor did I post it, however it contains quotations from me and references my channel.

I’m not sure what you mean about the banned part. The fact I am posting should indicate that is not the case, and I think you might be misunderstanding Leo’s comment about worse articles. He was saying there COULD be, not that there WILL be.

Where are the references to your channel? Obviously, you're not banned but I thought that you posted it based on people mentioning you a lot on this topic. I was guessing why you are not banned if your quotations and your channel could be seriously damaging spreading actualized.org (although I don't just blindly follow Leo like people normally would if this were a cult nor am I trying to defend him).

[Thought Art]

1 minute ago, AdeptusPsychonautica said:

I have no idea. I quite like Donald Hoffmans theory of he puts out in The Case Against Reality, and I like James Cook’s Living Mirror Theory. I also occasionally find myself dipping  into panpsychism and animism - particularly when I’m on retreat in the Amazon. 
 

Like I said I have no particular dog in this game of who is correct about reality, and so I reserve the right to flip flop as I see fit or to not give a fuck ?

Ahah, I like the relaxed approach. I’ll take a look at those books and folks ?

[Danioover9000]

@Thought Art

1 hour ago, Thought Art said:

@mandyjw 

1. First one it probably a good point. Still need to observe more and contemplate more on the teacher thing. I think those teachers have different goals. It’s not obvious to me yet how “awake” people are. 
 

2. The usage of .org is used primarily for non-commercial platforms and education platforms and does not imply a group of people. Google that.

3. Enlightenment isn’t for most people. But, seems to me he is making it more accessible than it would be otherwise. Also, he has stated in videos that enlightenment is not a single mountain but a mountain range with many facets and different peaks. 

4. teaching pickup in a healthy way (which I think he does…) is important for men who would other wise remain creepy sexually frustrated men. I think learning how to mate is a skill set men don’t just magically have and are born with. We have to learn somehow… relationships and dating is a set of skill sets and there are male and female teachers who teach every aspect of dating and sexuality. Learning pickup is healthy. You may not agree.

5. Authority. You are the only authority. Leo has taught me to take back my own authority. . 

 

 

   You have a nice profile. Did you make it yourself?

[Thought Art]

@Danioover9000 pic? No

[mandyjw]

1 hour ago, Thought Art said:

2. The usage of .org is used primarily for non-commercial platforms and education platforms and does not imply a group of people. Google that.

I am aware of this, however the ".org" is not just what the site happens to ends in, it's a big part of the branding. The logo is not just "Actualized", it's Actualized.org. 

1 hour ago, Thought Art said:

3. Enlightenment isn’t for most people. But, seems to me he is making it more accessible than it would be otherwise. Also, he has stated in videos that enlightenment is not a single mountain but a mountain range with many facets and different peaks. 

Enlightenment isn't for anyone. It's not a thing that's for some and not others it's prior to all dualities, people, inclusion or exclusion, separation, etc. 

1 hour ago, Thought Art said:

. teaching pickup in a healthy way (which I think he does…)

I highly, highly disagree about the "healthy way." Any woman pointing this out is shut up with some comment along the lines of "don't listen to women". Any man pointing this out is belittled for being "not man enough", or fill in the  ________. 

1 hour ago, Thought Art said:

5. Authority. You are the only authority. Leo has taught me to take back my own authority. . 

I'm not saying there aren't some great lessons, intelligence and wisdom being taught here. But the attitude has taken a turn for the worst and kept going on that trajectory for over 3 years are so. Also to be kind of nit picky here, (but also it's important I think), you can't really say SOMEONE taught YOU to take back your authority without throwing away your authority. You realize you never gave it away in the first place. 

 

 

[Danioover9000]

@mandyjw

6 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

I am aware of this, however the ".org" is not just what the site happens to ends in, it's a big part of the branding. The logo is not just "Actualized", it's Actualized.org. 

Enlightenment isn't for anyone. It's not a thing that's for some and not others it's prior to all dualities, people, inclusion or exclusion, separation, etc. 

I highly, highly disagree about the "healthy way." Any woman pointing this out is shut up with some comment along the lines of "don't listen to women". Any man pointing this out is belittled for being "not man enough", or fill in the  ________. 

I'm not saying there aren't some great lessons, intelligence and wisdom being taught here. But the attitude has taken a turn for the worst and kept going on that trajectory for over 3 years are so. Also to be kind of nit picky here, (but also it's important I think), you can't really say SOMEONE taught YOU to take back your authority without throwing away your authority. You realize you never gave it away in the first place. 

 

 

   Off topic, but do you think a large part of why this place is a 'cult' is because of some people unable to put down a video?

[mandyjw]

2 minutes ago, Danioover9000 said:

@mandyjw

   Off topic, but do you think a large part of why this place is a 'cult' is because of some people unable to put down a video?

Put down a video, by that you mean that people are addicted to the videos? 

[mandyjw]

I grew up in Christianity. Christianity teaches a lot of amazing and fantastic lessons. "Do unto others,", the Sermon on the Mount, basically all of Jesus' words. It helps people let go of the fear of death, it helps them realize that they are "forgiven and washed of sin", (the premise is flawed but still, the letting go of guilt is real for many). The problem is when you start making Christianity a Bastian and a stand alone exclusive truth and saying all others go to hell. As a kid I realized this belief in others and a hell could not stand any longer. I could not believe that almost every black person or African or Native American was going to or IN hell because over hundreds of years Christianity was not widely taught to them. 

It's been a very similar story with Actualized. There's been a lot of good. A lot of being willing to open my mind. A lot of interacting with some amazing, INCREDIBLE people here. But then I ran into a lot of very sticky, icky things like the belief in hell only presented in an entirely different way. But it felt awful just the same. Notions taught here like "Survival", "ego backlash", "burning through karma", "enlightenment being hard", "genetics", "spiritual talent", all of that is on the same level as sending SOME to hell, and others to heaven. Same damn thing. 

You are Love. You are Feeling/Awareness/Now. You know when something is off. You know when it stinks. Listen. If you're entertaining ideas about being better than others because you HAVE the TRUTH, (or you're hoping for it) that's a terrible thing to settle for when you could just be Love. 

One of the best things Leo is teaches is the message of something like "don't fucking settle" for less than greatness. The light is in the darkness of that. Don't settle for less than love. There's no separate one who is great in love. Just love. It's Great enough without cutting itself off the become second to and less than so it can proclaim itself greater than another part of itself. 

 

Edited March 8, 2022 by mandyjw

[Danioover9000]

@mandyjw

24 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

Put down a video, by that you mean that people are addicted to the videos? 

   Yes, like if someone had an overeating problem, they likely need to put down the fork, like that.

[mandyjw]

Just now, Danioover9000 said:

@mandyjw

   Yes, like if someone had an overeating problem, they likely need to put down the fork, like that.

Sort of, yeah, I mean if you are listening to hours of videos and reading here everyday, and you are looking to learn and improve your life, you're are going to be very steeped in certain beliefs. Then when other teachers who aim to cut through or shine the light on those beliefs are dismissed or belittled or told to stop teaching the way they teach for being too "neo advaita" or not "god realized" those beliefs are potentially strengthened. It becomes an echo chamber. Because those beliefs are upholding suffering, it's believed that by pushing through suffering, great achievement will follow. 

Enlightenment is letting go of beliefs that directly result in suffering. The suffering is the indicator that in that moment a thought is being entertained that is cutting oneself off from their true Self by thinking themselves to be separate or apart. When you chip away at a dam long enough, at some point all or part it might suddenly give way. This is spectacular to behold. Then perhaps the belief "enlightenment is a spectacular achievement" is born, when enlightenment was only ever just the destruction of an unwanted barrier. The power of the water cannot be owned or claimed by the dam. Water by its nature gives way, and takes the path of least resistance, and in that is also enormous power. 

[Thought Art]

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

I am aware of this, however the ".org" is not just what the site happens to ends in, it's a big part of the branding. The logo is not just "Actualized", it's Actualized.org. 

Enlightenment isn't for anyone. It's not a thing that's for some and not others it's prior to all dualities, people, inclusion or exclusion, separation, etc. 

I highly, highly disagree about the "healthy way." Any woman pointing this out is shut up with some comment along the lines of "don't listen to women". Any man pointing this out is belittled for being "not man enough", or fill in the  ________. 

I'm not saying there aren't some great lessons, intelligence and wisdom being taught here. But the attitude has taken a turn for the worst and kept going on that trajectory for over 3 years are so. Also to be kind of nit picky here, (but also it's important I think), you can't really say SOMEONE taught YOU to take back your authority without throwing away your authority. You realize you never gave it away in the first place. 

 

 

@mandyjw 

 

1. To me that makes sense… actualited learning platform that puts out most of its work for free

2. yet here we are 

3. Yeah, dating/ men learning to meet women is Low conscious activity. It’s a controversial thing, yet important more men to learn in my opinion. I felt like his video series was helpful for me. Wont be my only resource though. Mainly, it will be getting direct experience meeting people and having a good time with them… which was my main take away. When a guy is going out to meet women he is doing a practice or learning a skill.

4. ahah, yeah paradox. Same same but different. 
 

Hope you are well

Edited March 8, 2022 by Thought Art

[Thought Art]

50 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

Sort of, yeah, I mean if you are listening to hours of videos and reading here everyday, and you are looking to learn and improve your life, you're are going to be very steeped in certain beliefs. Then when other teachers who aim to cut through or shine the light on those beliefs are dismissed or belittled or told to stop teaching the way they teach for being too "neo advaita" or not "god realized" those beliefs are potentially strengthened. It becomes an echo chamber. Because those beliefs are upholding suffering, it's believed that by pushing through suffering, great achievement will follow. 

Enlightenment is letting go of beliefs that directly result in suffering. The suffering is the indicator that in that moment a thought is being entertained that is cutting oneself off from their true Self by thinking themselves to be separate or apart. When you chip away at a dam long enough, at some point all or part it might suddenly give way. This is spectacular to behold. Then perhaps the belief "enlightenment is a spectacular achievement" is born, when enlightenment was only ever just the destruction of an unwanted barrier. The power of the water cannot be owned or claimed by the dam. Water by its nature gives way, and takes the path of least resistance, and in that is also enormous power. 

Do you think suffering is only caused by a feeling or belief in separation?

[mandyjw]

37 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

Do you think suffering is only caused by a feeling or belief in separation?

Awareness is nondual, unconditional love. You could swap feeling for awareness, but awareness is prior to filtering through any one sense. Thinking is where there seems to be the experience of seperation. There is the "one" who experiences the world as seperate. Emotion is feeling, real time responding to thoughts. Negative emotion indicates the sense of seperation in thought. For example if I think "I'm not good enough" or this sense of unworthiness comes up in a conversation it feels bad. But if I appreciate the diversity of perspectives in the conversation and the new things that are coming from it, I feel good. 

Typically we blame people and circumstances for making us feel a certain way. But feeling is directly responding to our own thoughts and perspectives. 

[Thought Art]

Just now, mandyjw said:

Awareness is nondual, unconditional love. You could swap feeling for awareness, but awareness is prior to filtering through any one sense. Thinking is where there seems to be the experience of seperation. There is the "one" who experiences the world as seperate. Emotion is feeling, real time responding to thoughts. Negative emotion indicates the sense of seperation in thought. For example if I think "I'm not good enough" or this sense of unworthiness comes up in a conversation it feels bad. But if I appreciate the diversity of perspectives in the conversation and the new things that are coming from it, I feel good. 

Typically we blame people and circumstances for making us feel a certain way. But feeling is directly responding to our own thoughts and perspectives. 

? 

To add to this, I think that thoughts and perspectives are part of feeling. There is also a lot that has to do with muscle tension, breathing, healthy Qi etc 

Negative emotions can exist prior to thoughts IMO. They are stored in tissues, organs, and can be unconscious transference as well. 
 

 

 

[Inliytened1]

8 hours ago, AdeptusPsychonautica said:

@Inliytened1 

only the objective claims that he says resulted from these experiences. If indeed he gained the objective power to cure all diseases and ailments then this should be fairly easy to demonstrate, 

Where does he claim that he already possesses these abilities? I  went back and listened to the beginning of the "I'm leaving" video.  What he says is that reached levels of consciousness where it became evident that healing is indeed possible.  Levels of consciousness where miracles are possible.   He does not claim that he has the ability to perform these miracles yet (and specifically states so) - merely that they are possible.   There is a distinct difference there.  First off - any experience of God or expanded state of consciousness is a miracle in itself...and I've no doubt from the levels of consciousness and realizations that I have had that healing is indeed possible.   

8 hours ago, AdeptusPsychonautica said:

@Inliytened1 

 

What you demonstrate here though is deep confusion about the difference between subjective states, and the objective claims I am critical of. L

I understand the difference.  But I think you misunderstood Leo's claims because you are so quick to jump the gun.

8 hours ago, AdeptusPsychonautica said:

@Inliytened1 


Lets try another example to drive the point home. If someone on the forum was talking about killing themselves or another person then you would (hopefully) recognize these as OBJECTIVE claims and do something about it - right

Of course.  But I don't think this a fair comparison to someone claiming he could heal, when in fact that wasn't even the claim. The claim was that levels of consciousness were accessed to where this is possible.  Btw - Once you are God realized you also realize that you are creating reality, thus who else would be able to perform miracles but you at the highest levels of Consciousness.  Of course these things would be possible because you are Infinity.   Many doors open that were previously closed to you under the materialist paradigm.  Miracles in themselves are something you've created.  So..these things may seem totally outlandish to you if you come from a rationalist paradigm.  But you say you don't right? And you had had 30 or more years of experience where you have reached mystical states of consciousness.  If that is the case then how could you be so quick to denounce the fact that it could be possible.   And if you aren't denouncing that fact, then  could you really so quickly jump to criticize that one could not attain this ability?  Again, not that Leo did, nor did he claim so.... but do you see where I'm going with this?  For someone that claims to understand spirituality it seems your specific criticism doesn't measure up with what you portray.

[RMQualtrough]

@Inliytened1 Healing abilities is delusion. It resides alongside telekinesis and other forms of magick where the ego attempts to control the whole. All thoughts and desires are always going to be appearances. When the appearances think they can control what they appear in, that's when lunacy happens 

I'm reminded of when Leo in a state of psychedelic delirium attempted to levitate a candle. Then, he picked up the candle and laughed: "This is how God levitates a candle."

[Inliytened1]

5 minutes ago, RMQualtrough said:

@Inliytened1 Healing abilities is delusion. It resides alongside telekinesis and other forms of magick where the ego attempts to control the whole. All thoughts and desires are always going to be appearances. When the appearances think they can control what they appear in, that's when lunacy happens 

I'm reminded of when Leo in a state of psychedelic delirium attempted to levitate a candle. Then, he picked up the candle and laughed: "This is how God levitates a candle."

Don't take this the wrong way.  But you have no idea what you are talking about.   You are not God realized let alone had an experience of God.