The female vs male friendzone

[Gesundheit2]

10 minutes ago, soos_mite_ah said:

I'm just saying that the way that society has conditioned men into thinking they are owed everything is a big problem and explains why men get so butthurt and bitter over being friendzoned to where they develop "nice guy" syndrome.

The "nice guy" is by definition a stereotypical guy who is overly respectful of other people's boundaries, whether man or woman or baby. Otherwise, he would be called the jerk guy or something.

 

[patricknotstar]

5 minutes ago, soos_mite_ah said:

I'm talking about how we have been socialized differently. If this behavior is the product of learned behavior and socialization, that by definition means that it isn't something that is innate or inherent to a person. 

If I say for example that a particular ethnic group is involved in more violent crimes than another and proceed to describe them as bitter and entitled and explain that my people aren't like this. You don't see something wrong with that... It's the same thing you're doing , disguise it behind whatever context you like.

It creates nothing but tension between people... Why does it have to be "men need to learn to be more respectful, because us women already are" Why not just say us as humans in general need to be more respectful and considerate towards eachother. You see what I mean?

Edited March 2, 2022 by patricknotstar

[soos_mite_ah]

1 minute ago, patricknotstar said:

If I say for example that a particular ethnic group is involved in more violent crimes than another and proceed to describe them as bitter and entitled and explain that my people aren't like this

...

It creates nothing but tension between people... Why even go there?

Things like bitterness and entitlement comes from things like constructed power dynamics, privilege, and systemic violence being normalized.  It's important to call out those power dynamics and the things that cause them to exist if we ever want to progress both collectively and individually. Having these discussions is the very thing that alleviates these tensions because  it gives justice to those who are treated as second class citizens. 

[soos_mite_ah]

7 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

The "nice guy" is by definition a stereotypical guy who is overly respectful of other people's boundaries, whether man or woman or baby. Otherwise, he would be called the jerk guy or something.

The "nice guy" is a person who has this image of himself being a good person when really he is a people pleaser who thinks that just being nice to people will have them give him whatever he wants. He exchanges niceness not as base level human decency rather he does it to manipulate women into doing what he wants. He will be "nice" to you and do all of these things just to get in your pants, be possessive etc. And when you say "hey i'm not really interested in xyz," he isn't going to respect that boundary. He is going to lash out at you and call you a bitch, a whore, etc. and then complain about how all women are the same and how he is always friendzoned. That's why "nice" is in quotes. Because a "nice guy" isn't actually nice at all. He isn't even a good man which is why people try to avoid him like the fucking plague. A good man in this same position will think "that sucks, let me go process my emotional feelings for a little bit and appreciate the friendship for what it is, just friendship. Because I still like being around this person and I wasn't just trying to be her friend to get into her pants"

[John Paul]

@soos_mite_ah women play games.

[patricknotstar]

29 minutes ago, soos_mite_ah said:

Things like bitterness and entitlement comes from things like constructed power dynamics, privilege, and systemic violence being normalized.  It's important to call out those power dynamics and the things that cause them to exist if we ever want to progress both collectively and individually. Having these discussions is the very thing that alleviates these tensions because  it gives justice to those who are treated as second class citizens. 

yes but bitterness and entitlement isn't male-exclusive... Heck even animals show these qualities. You ever seen the monkey jealously expirement? Check it out.

We all need to evolve more. Regardless of gender,race,looks etc...  So why try to call out a specific group?

Here's an example, women test higher statistically for emotional jealousy than men (proven) . That doesn't mean we should draw broad stroke generalizations that women are more jealous than men... because they aren't it is much more nuanced. 

 

Edited March 2, 2022 by patricknotstar

[Gesundheit2]

16 minutes ago, soos_mite_ah said:

The "nice guy" is a person who has this image of himself being a good person

It's not just his own perception, women actually reject him and sweep in "you're a really nice guy" as kind of a consolation prize.

Quote

when really he is a people pleaser who thinks that just being nice to people will have them give him whatever he wants. He exchanges niceness not as base level human decency rather he does it to manipulate women into doing what he wants. He will be "nice" to you and do all of these things just to get in your pants, be possessive etc. And when you say "hey i'm not really interested in xyz," he isn't going to respect that boundary. He is going to lash out at you and call you a bitch, a whore, etc. and then complain about how all women are the same and how he is always friendzoned.

Not true. The nice guy will "respect" the boundary and then keep trying to creep in through the back door of the girl he's interested in, hoping that someday he'll buy her, or that she'll just change her mind about him or something. He's not bitter, just desperate and needy and lacking sex appeal.

Quote

That's why "nice" is in quotes. Because a "nice guy" isn't actually nice at all. He isn't even a good man which is why people try to avoid him like the fucking plague. A good man in this same position will think "that sucks, let me go process my emotional feelings for a little bit and appreciate the friendship for what it is, just friendship. Because I still like being around this person and I wasn't just trying to be her friend to get into her pants"

I agree. I don't respect weak men, either.

Edited March 2, 2022 by Gesundheit2

[Tangerinedream]

3 hours ago, patricknotstar said:

 

It seems for a guy the friend zone is when a girl won't have sex with you whereas for a girl it's when a guy only uses you for sex and doesn't want to commit to you

 

Friendzoning is done before anything sexual happens.  Basically you get friendzoned if the other person has no attraction for you.  You feel attracted to them but it’s not reciprocated and nothing more happens.
 

 Friendzoning would be the same for guy and girl - they like someone but the other person doesn’t feel the same and nothing romantic or sexual pursues. 
   
The example you mentioned where the girl is used for sex, that’s just normally where there has been some attraction initially, but then the guy or girl doesn’t want to commit.
Maybe they liked each other at first but then one person didn’t want to pursue the relationship or something.   And that would be more of a situationship and not the same as friendzone. 

 

[Preety_India]

2 minutes ago, Tangerinedream said:

The example you mentioned where the girl is used for sex, that’s just normally where there has been some attraction initially, but then the guy or girl doesn’t want to commit.
Maybe they liked each other at first but then one person didn’t want to pursue the relationship or something.   And that would be more of a situationship and not the same as friendzone. 

Yea I agree with this. It looks more like a situationship than a friendzone thing. 

 

[Tangerinedream]

Friendzone isn’t also the same as being rejected outright by someone you don’t know well.  Friendzone is so infamous because It usually happens after 2 people have been hanging out together a lot in a friendly way, then one person makes a move, and then they are told ‘sorry but I only like you as a friend and nothing more’  and that’s when you have been friendzoned. 

[patricknotstar]

30 minutes ago, soos_mite_ah said:

The "nice guy" is a person who has this image of himself being a good person when really he is a people pleaser who thinks that just being nice to people will have them give him whatever he wants. He exchanges niceness not as base level human decency rather he does it to manipulate women into doing what he wants. He will be "nice" to you and do all of these things just to get in your pants, be possessive etc. And when you say "hey i'm not really interested in xyz," he isn't going to respect that boundary. He is going to lash out at you and call you a bitch, a whore, etc. and then complain about how all women are the same and how he is always friendzoned. That's why "nice" is in quotes. Because a "nice guy" isn't actually nice at all. He isn't even a good man which is why people try to avoid him like the fucking plague. A good man in this same position will think "that sucks, let me go process my emotional feelings for a little bit and appreciate the friendship for what it is, just friendship. Because I still like being around this person and I wasn't just trying to be her friend to get into her pants"

the whole purpose of my original post was to show women can struggle a lot with relationships too and feel frustrated and lonely because incels always tell me " well women can always get laid", but I know girls who struggle in dating that get used by guys and who feel like no one wants to commit to them. They exist and I know a few personally, and I deeply sympathize with them. I don't deny their struggle to find a partner that is patronizing "oh you're a woman you have it easy. " Just not true and I've seen women struggle first hand.

It's just what they struggle with that's different, for men its usually sex and for women, its usually commitment but the struggle is ever so real. So we should be more sympathetic towards each other and not make it seem one has it easier

That was the purpose of my post, however, this whole thread has degraded...

[John Paul]

@soos_mite_ah @patricknotstar they secretly like each other....

[Spence94]

@Preety_India @Tangerinedream

A situationship. Interesting term. Never heard of that term before.

Edited March 2, 2022 by Spence94

[kamwalker]

I have friendzoned many girls who wanted something romantic from me and I just wanted friendship. 

[Random witch]

It's sad that many men aren't aware enough of women's struggles.

Some of them think that just because women can get laid easily and are more communicative than men, it means women's life is perfect.

They are unaware that even those "benefits" create other problems that they as men have no clue about and might never have because they are so stuck in their paradigm of victimhood. They are also unaware and in denial of their own benefits and privileges in society, that women are lack.

 

Edited March 2, 2022 by Random witch

[something_else]

19 minutes ago, Random witch said:

It's sad that many men aren't aware enough of women's struggles.

Some of them think that just because women can get laid easily and are more communicative than men, it means women's life is perfect.

They are unaware that even those "benefits" create other problems that they as men have no clue about and might never have because they are so stuck in their paradigm of victimhood. They are also unaware and in denial of their own benefits and privileges in society, that women are lack.

 

Grass is always greener

[PurpleTree]

1 hour ago, Random witch said:

It's sad that many men aren't aware enough of women's struggles.

Some of them think that just because women can get laid easily and are more communicative than men, it means women's life is perfect.

They are unaware that even those "benefits" create other problems that they as men have no clue about and might never have because they are so stuck in their paradigm of victimhood. They are also unaware and in denial of their own benefits and privileges in society, that women are lack.

 

that goes both ways though