Violents Video-games And Visualisations: Why There Is No A Direct Correlation?

[Ray]

We all know that visualisations techniques are really effective and leads us to "implant", "transform" and "reprogram" our mind to reach what we want; and they work (accordingly to most Personal development material and our experience etc...). And we all know that violent videogames do not cause a boost of violence or likewise emotions/behaviour etc... 

But videogames really looks like a form of visualization! Think for example to a first-person-shooting like Call of Duty or even GTA. Isn't that a sort of visualizations? in fact we would say that it could be some kind of effective and entertaining guided visualisation. 

So why violent videogames dosen't affect our violent behaviour? 

Do we consider them something else? Our subconscious is aware enough that this are just game? Dose other part of the brain activate while we do visualizations than when we play videogames? 

It's interesting

 

[Soulbass]

I wondered the same questions when I bought "Agony" on kickstarter^^.

The subconscious do not know that it is a game/movie but just pick the mood of it, IMO.

Drama in theater is known to help people express theirs feelings with mirror neurons, which is "catharsis", may help with the polarization of psyche.

I know someone very "competitive" and he plays only "beat them all" & "shoot them up" 2D scroll games with many enemies. This makes me think that he like to "fight against others, or various problems in life". This reflect in his work/personality, he's very sociable and effective at bursting every kind of little problems in a project/team work.

Since I'm not an AAA gamer, I prefer things such as "Proteus" or "Space Engine" without enemies or goals.

Edited January 18, 2017 by Soulbass

[Ray]

@Soulbass but don't you find that is weird that the subconscius is not effected by it and is really effected by visualization? Like it must be a little and subtle gap that in reality plays a huge role for distinguish the 2. And we can't really put a finger on it, we can only say that yes he can distinguish it because if he wouldn't we would be all serial killer... but how precisely he can do that? and why? this is what interest me... 

 @brovakhiin Yes for now it's my "first hypothesis"; but I would like to have a more precise answer . 

20 hours ago, brovakhiin said:

I don't think videogames are like visualizations. Don't really have any reasoning, but I don't think it's the same mental process.

I love too minimal beautiful games like Journey, Abzu, and Proteus, such an experience, they are almost like an interactive beautiful movie.  But right now I'm trowing my life away with The binding of Isaac Afterbirth ahah

 

[Soulbass]

@Ray I mean, sure the subconscious is affected by video games.

Edited January 19, 2017 by Soulbass

[FindingPeace]

On 18/01/2017 at 0:06 PM, Ray said:

And we all know that violent videogames do not cause a boost of violence or likewise emotions/behaviour etc... 

How can you be so sure of this?

People may not go out in to the world and act out the themes from their video games, but that doesn't mean that these games are not, subtly, influencing their psyche. Encouraging a certain attitude towards reality that, in subtle, insideous, ways will be manifested in negative and innapropriate ways.

All media/movies/games etc have an effect on the human mind. It may not be as obvious as copying what is seen, but it could be significant nonetheless. It affects people's attitude which will ultimately manifest itself in the way they ultimately behave.

Incidentally, you have to ask why people are interested in such games in the first place. We all agree that violence is an unwelcome phenomenon in the world yet people seek to pursue in a 'fantasy' way through video games. So there must be an inherent interest in violence within that person. Providing them with a game to indulge in this behaviour only reinforces the mindset.

 

[alyra]

visualizing with the interest of pursuing long-term goals and understanding short-term tasks is fundamentally different than sitting down and playing a videogame because you want to release stress or relax. 

[Principium Nexus]

I must acknowledge that I get slight symptoms of PTSD because of First Person Shooting games like Counterstrike. Some of the games require a huge amount of skill, focus and can be quite nerve wrecking. After playing for some hours (sometimes with some coffee) I feel very alert but also get disturbed by loud noises and get somewhat put back into this really alert state which is annoying because you cannot relax. This is also the main reason I'm playing less and less FPS games.

[Leo Gura]

Video games don't really make you violent (same as violent movies don't make you violent), but they DO lower your consciousness, same as TV.

I don't think video games make people violent because they aren't murder simulators, they are GAMES. When you kill an elf in World of Warcraft, you don't do it with violent intent, you do it for fun as a role play.

If you actually used games with the intent to hone your cruelty and anger, then they probably would help you become violent. But 99% of people don't play games that way. Most people play games just for fun, to escape reality.

Video games are also different than visualization because in visualization you're actually flexing the mind, whereas in a video game you're just seeing violent images, which isn't the same as consciously generating them.

But the bigger question is: Are video games harming your consciousness? And the answer is definitely YES! Not because of the violence factor, but because you're using it as an escape from reality. Video games are basically anti-mindfulness training. You're getting lost deeper in Maya as you play.

And notice that every video game -- no matter how great -- ends with a sense of hollowness and lack of fulfillment. Which is what drives people to seek out the next great game, and the next great game, and the next, creating a cycle of addiction but never fulfillment.

[Extreme Z7]

3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

And notice that every video game -- no matter how great -- ends without a sense of hollowness and lack of fulfillment. Which is what drives people to seek out the next great game, and the next great game, and the next, creating a cycle of addiction but never fulfillment.

I think you got a typo there.  You probably meant "with a sense of hollowness and lack of fulfillment".

[Leo Gura]

@Extreme Z7 Indeed, my bad

[The White Belt]

@Leo Gura I was wondering, without meaning to sound even a little accusatory, what your feelings are now, seeing as video games were such a big part of your life, that you now know that it lowers people's consciousness, leads to addiction, and leaves people unfulfilled. Like was it wasted time for you as a career, or do you still have a soft spot for video games? 

[Leo Gura]

@BeginnerActualizer I don't engage in video games almost at all any more.

For me video games were my art, like painting. It was about creating beautiful things and being creative.

I might even make some video games at some point. But they wouldn't be mainstream commercial products. More artsy.

Nothing is inherently evil. Entertainment does have value when not overused. And all artistic pursuits are valid so long as you feel that it's art that you're doing and you're passionate about it.

One of the reasons I got out of video games is because I felt most games were too shallow and commercial, and it's not easy making artsy games and surviving in that industry. The work practices of the industry are also extremely unhealthy and consciousness-destroying.

If I ever return to making video games, it would be 100% on my terms. The reason I started my first business was because I was so disgusted by not having 100% creative autonomy over my work. When I comes to my work, I'm a total control freak.

[Principium Nexus]

@Leo Gura You have to check out this game currently under development called Hellblade: Senua's Sacrifice, it's unlike any game I have seen before and is about schizofrenia. What's really cool is that people are able to see how something like that disease is experienced.

 

[Peace and Love]

@Ray

On 1/18/2017 at 7:06 AM, Ray said:

We all know that visualisations techniques are really effective and leads us to "implant", "transform" and "reprogram" our mind to reach what we want; and they work (accordingly to most Personal development material and our experience etc...). And we all know that violent videogames do not cause a boost of violence or likewise emotions/behaviour etc... 

But videogames really looks like a form of visualization! Think for example to a first-person-shooting like Call of Duty or even GTA. Isn't that a sort of visualizations? in fact we would say that it could be some kind of effective and entertaining guided visualisation. 

So why violent videogames dosen't affect our violent behaviour? 

Do we consider them something else? Our subconscious is aware enough that this are just game? Dose other part of the brain activate while we do visualizations than when we play videogames? 

It's interesting

 

When we play video games, or reading a book, watching tv or even driving we can go into something called a heightened state of awareness (aka self hypnosis or guided visualization).  We can become hyper-focused on something and tune everything else out.  That's why when you are playing WOW or Star Craft, etc, and someone walks in the room and asks you what you want for dinner, and you don't hear them, that is a form of hypnosis/guided visualization/heightened state of awareness.   Hypnosis/Guided Visualization is a natural state of mind that we go into by ourselves every day.  Guided visualization works with our subconscious mind which is 90% of our brain that primarily focuses on our habits, behaviors and beliefs.  With guided visualization it is not mind control.  If you won't do something out of guided visualization you won't do it in guided visualization either.  That's why when we play video games we don't become violent, unless it is something we have the intention to do before we played them. You can't be forced to do something.....you have will power.

[Peace and Love]

@BeginnerActualizer

6 hours ago, BeginnerActualizer said:

@Leo Gura I was wondering, without meaning to sound even a little accusatory, what your feelings are now, seeing as video games were such a big part of your life, that you now know that it lowers people's consciousness, leads to addiction, and leaves people unfulfilled. Like was it wasted time for you as a career, or do you still have a soft spot for video games? 

I have a bachelors degree in video game design and worked in the field for a year before the economy crashed in 2008.  

I agree with Leo.  Nothing is good or bad but the personal value you give something.  It's like a knife....are you cutting your steak and vegetables or are you stabbing someone with it?   The same with video games!  I used to have an extreme addiction to video games when I was younger and used it as a coping mechanism because I was so antisocial and didn't get along with other people.   I would use it to cover up my problems and not deal with them head on like you would in personal development. Now when I play video games I usually play it as a form of entertainment if friends come over and very sparingly. ...like maybe once a week.  Two very different perspectives on video games. The key is the emotions, thoughts and any childhood vows that may be behind the actions/addiction that you have. Do you allow video games to control your life?  Do you use video games as an emotional crutch?

I don't regret going into gaming. I learned a lot, had fun, and met a lot of very interesting people in the field.  Including Rob Pardo the head game designer from WOW, and Andrew Jones who worked on Metroid, Square Enix people, etc.  At the time when I was in the field...as a woman....I felt out of place.  I would go to the Austin Game Conference and be the only girl there that was interested in the gaming side of things as most women worked in human resources,  or they were a booth babe! lol etc.  I didn't stay long in the field because of the hardships of working in gaming and the economy.  There was this huge survey done by the International Game Developers Association that talked about how many of the game designers were leaving in their early 30's and going into other lucrative fields because they were so over worked....long hours, working holidays because of milestone deadlines from publishers etc.  At that age people want to settle down, have relationships, get married,have kids....and at that time in the gaming industry that's what the life style was.  I don't know what is now, since I've been so out of the loop.  Hopefully things have gotten better.

There is nothing wrong with working in the gaming field.  If it is your life purpose to make video games, by all means go for it.  Life is too short not to do something that you love.  But usually when you study video games you are working for someone else....there really is no creativity involved because you are doing something based off the needs of the game being created.   Unless you start your own business and make your own like Leo is stating. But still .... even if you make video games for another company and you love it...what does it really matter?

 

[Ray]

Well, I think I got my answer  We can say that the topic is resolved! Thanks everybody for your contribution!! 

 

@Peace and Love Since you've mentioned no, I'm not interested on making videogames and right now I know that I'm using them as an emotional crutch, but I've plan to reducing it. I'm interested on making movies... which maybe have an industry even worst than videogames ahahah. But yeah, it's my art, so I want and I will follow it. Thanks for the reminder and I've really appreciate your detail comment 

I always felt like videogames were still something for Leo and I find really respectable that Leo admit that one day he could make videogames (saw his current situation, directions, values etc...) this it's truly a proof of open mindedness from his part I think. Great job! 

 

[Peace and Love]

@Ray

On 1/24/2017 at 11:46 AM, Ray said:

Well, I think I got my answer  We can say that the topic is resolved! Thanks everybody for your contribution!! 

 

@Peace and Love Since you've mentioned no, I'm not interested on making videogames and right now I know that I'm using them as an emotional crutch, but I've plan to reducing it. I'm interested on making movies... which maybe have an industry even worst than videogames ahahah. But yeah, it's my art, so I want and I will follow it. Thanks for the reminder and I've really appreciate your detail comment 

I always felt like videogames were still something for Leo and I find really respectable that Leo admit that one day he could make videogames (saw his current situation, directions, values etc...) this it's truly a proof of open mindedness from his part I think. Great job! 

 

What happens a lot with people that go into game design is they don't realize that playing video games and creating video games are two VERY different things.  If you're an artist you're not going to be the guy sitting around doing Q & A testing....if you're the artist you're going to be designing and creating......3D modeling, texture mapping design, animation, level design.....concept art....  The people that excel in the game industry and do well successfully really love what they do....making video games!  Yeah of course they play them...but they spend ALOT of time creating....not sitting in front of the computer playing Call of Duty, or something else.  These people love working with 3D studio Max/Maya, Adobe Photoshop, Zbrush, Softimage XSI, Unreal Level Design Editor (what I was using when I went to school), etc.  or whatever is currently industry standard. And the ones that did really well were certified in Max and Photoshop. The ones that do that best in the gaming industry are so passionate about what they do they live and breath this stuff....some of them don't even have gaming degrees...like Leo.  They just have a killer online art portfolio that's available for employers to easily see on a personal website.

As far as I know gaming and creating movies are similar in studies.  I have a friend that is interested in working on animated movies so he is currently studying Maya and animation.  Unless you're doing 2D animation which really isn't around much anymore. 

It would be cool if Leo made a video game!! (as long as he is following his heart/intuition, and he is happy, which he already knows how to do.). Life is so interesting when you make personal development a priority in your life....it can take you in so many different directions, and can turn your world upside down in a very positive way.  I can not tell you how many different occupations I've held in my life anymore....lol...but they have all shaped me to be who I am, and helped me to have a life purpose right now.  I don't regret anything that I've done.   I am content and in love with myself.

[Lorcan]

On 20/01/2017 at 8:53 PM, Leo Gura said:

@BeginnerActualizer I don't engage in video games almost at all any more.

For me video games were my art, like painting. It was about creating beautiful things and being creative.

I might even make some video games at some point. But they wouldn't be mainstream commercial products. More artsy.

Nothing is inherently evil. Entertainment does have value when not overused. And all artistic pursuits are valid so long as you feel that it's art that you're doing and you're passionate about it.

One of the reasons I got out of video games is because I felt most games were too shallow and commercial, and it's not easy making artsy games and surviving in that industry. The work practices of the industry are also extremely unhealthy and consciousness-destroying.

If I ever return to making video games, it would be 100% on my terms. The reason I started my first business was because I was so disgusted by not having 100% creative autonomy over my work. When I comes to my work, I'm a total control freak.

 

Leo sometime in the future perhaps maybe making a video game? Im excited! Im assuming it would be something like a mix of the stanley parable, journey merged with some sort of element where players have a sense of deep fulfillment/wonder after playing the game.

Potential release dates leo?

[Ray]

@Lorcan he just said that he might envision to make it one, not that he will; and as you know right now he's really busy regarding "topic" of sage so I would say that if he will do something it will be at least in 2 year, but at the same time it's completely up to his inner instinct, and probably he will never do it. The most important thing, as we were saying with @Peace and Love is being content with what we are doing, and the only thing that will make it in the end is follow our instinct and is what Leo he's currently doing. So yeah I think it's better if we forget about this topic right now