Overthinking Mechanisms

[Alicja_]

I've been thinking about the nature of thinking, or, perhaps, overthinking (not daydreaming).

Could overthinking be a hindrance on the way to self-actualization? Is the investigative, curious mind a nice characteristic of a person, a mark of intelligence? Or is this an ambush carrying people away from the real, individual authenticity? Carrying oneself away from reality and simplicity of life? 

What are your thoughts on this? What  are your reasons / motivations behind overthinking? 

For example, I think deeply  about varius aspects governing people's behavior patterns. About mechanisms of my thoughts creation machine. Why I think the way I think. Or why others think the way they think. Overthinking brings  a lot of satisfaction, as the brilliant, investigative  mind spots the patterns, motivations behind actions, personality traits, the ways in which fears/limiting beliefs emerge in my mind, or in the minds of people around me. I observe myself, I observe others, I investigate in detail, predict after-effects. So when I spot some interesting phenomenon,  I shift my focus from the present moment, from the reality around me, to the illusionary reality of my mind where I play with this concept, bisect it, tear it apart, chew it up, put it back together, see how it is mobilized. It's just an overall sketch. Often, I find this process enjoyable, though it may morph into a fantasy.

Then, I wonder, what am I doing? Why am I doing this? Is it good? Is it bad? Is a deep thinker who I really am, part of my authentic self? Or is it a trap, some sort of illusion/exit door I've created for myself as a defense mechanism, or something. It's somewhat scary when I start questioning the authenticity. 

Edited January 17, 2017 by Alicja_

[alyra]

from what I understand the authentic self is nondual. reality is nondual. there is no carrying away from reality, nor is there individual authenticity. but then, if there is no difference, what words we say are arbitrary and confusing. so what am I even saying lol.

Leo is as silly for wanting to be a monk as we are silly for wanting to be artists catering to a materialistic market. 

Something which I currently consider often is, how "heaven" is "benefaction" and "hell" is "destruction". that which is heavenly is that which creates, and that is what we call good. that which is bad is that which is hellish is that which destroys. 

 

but there is balance in heaven in hell. If I want a spoon, I must destroy the form of the iron ore. destruction begets creation and creation begets destruction. 

I dunno how to reconcile the desiring of good versus evil tho. that - we want a world without terrorists. I haven't figured that out yet. 

 

but I am digressing. wait - what am I even here to say. something about how you're asking about if overthinking is bad.

 

the real thing I can say is that I do not know. I am wondering about the same thing you wonder about here and I do not know either. I just wish to preserve my belief that I am interested in this topic by posting. aren't I a silly! I am sorry if this causes you distress, but I am too much of a monkey to resist posting now. ugh I am sorry!

 

 

PS. I guess, that doing a lot of one thing has diminishing returns. when overthinking gets past the point where adding more is actually reducing average output.... but where is that point, we cannot measure it except through awareness.

 

pps. and there will be times where the added effort, despite being so inefficient, is still our only way of accomplishing so much work... though I have heard that a person who works overtime would be more efficient time spent if they go home and rest until the morrow. that only in an emergency is it worth putting 20 hours of overtime to get 7 hours of effective worker hours of results. so if it isn't an emergency and we've reached the point where we're being inefficient, it is smarter to take time to rest. 

Edited January 18, 2017 by aryberry

[alyra]

I am back - sorry. I feel bad for being confusing so I'm gonna make up for it by dumping more of my thinkings onto you! hope this is fun and not annoying

do not mind if I sound like I am telling you what to do. I trust that you understand that words are just words, and the understanding you discover as inspired by your experiences is what matters. 

6 hours ago, Alicja_ said:

I've been thinking about the nature of thinking, or, perhaps, overthinking (not daydreaming).

Could overthinking be a hindrance [1] on the way to self-actualization? Is the investigative, curious mind a nice characteristic of a person, a mark of intelligence? Or is this an ambush carrying people away from the real, individual authenticity? Carrying oneself away from reality and simplicity of life? 

What are your thoughts on this? What  are your reasons / motivations behind overthinking? 

For example, I think deeply  about varius aspects governing people's behavior patterns. About mechanisms of my thoughts creation machine. Why I think the way I think. Or why others think the way they think. [2] Overthinking brings  a lot of satisfaction, as the brilliant, investigative  mind spots the patterns, motivations behind actions, personality traits, the ways in which fears/limiting beliefs emerge in my mind, or in the minds of people around me. I observe myself, I observe others, I investigate in detail, predict after-effects. So when I spot some interesting phenomenon,  I shift my focus from the present moment, from the reality around me, to the illusionary reality of my mind [3] where I play with this concept, bisect it, tear it apart, chew it up, put it back together, see how it is mobilized. It's just an overall sketch. Often, I find this process enjoyable, though it may morph into a fantasy. [4]

Then, I wonder, what am I doing? Why am I doing this? Is it good? Is it bad? Is a deep thinker who I really am, part of my authentic self? [5] Or is it a trap, some sort of illusion/exit door I've created for myself as a defense mechanism, [6] or something. It's somewhat scary when I start questioning the authenticity. 

 

[1] of course it could be a hindrance. under-thinking is a hindrance too. finding the balance, is what will work best. there is no definite point of balance. a certain point past too much under thinking has enough of an effect to transcend your current level of consiousness on a meaningful path, and a certain point below over-thinking sees the same thing. and all points in between are where the balance is good. but the thing is - the lowest conscious person still develops over time. the highest-conscious person still develops over time. if you feel you need to take a step back from where you are, why not give it a try. 

 

[2] but what is thinking? 

 

[3] these are one and the same - the illusion of the physical world is the same illusion which contains the mind. I admit the physical world appears with more consistency - and it is true that manipulating it appears different than manipulating our thoughts. if a car hits us we get injured. but how that injury is real to us is the same as how our thoughts are real to us. So how this applies to your questions here - overthinking is nothing more than spending time with reality. It is less pragmatic - but it is just as real. In a way - the world around us is a higher level than our self - so if we want to think about the world, we can go out and manipulate  it and see what happens - and we can ponder what has happened and reflect upon in curiously. these are one and the same - just the manifestation appears to differ. 

 

[4] I am in my life attempting to find out how to be more directly productive in my surroundings, and spend less time in fantasy lol. I daydream, I think and then pace and think and think and think. I watch a youtube and then watch another and another, or I post in forums until 5 hours have passed. So I am learning how to work in the real world. I guess it just takes practice and time. I guess - if you want to think so much that it takes all your day, find out how to be a mystic in a monastery with a minimal lifestyle to maximize thinking time. Or find a way to turn your time spent thinking into a sellable asset in the market. but if you don't want either of those - then work to learn how to negotiate with yourself, so that you think when it's time to think and act when it's time to act. I am going for that last option hehe..

 

[5] I recently heard Leo say in a video that when he speaks of the authentic self.. he isn't talking about identity. I forget what exactly he said. so I am going to explain as best I can what I currently understand of the topic. That existence is nondual infinity. and the authentic self is that nondual infinity. In our manifestation, we are finite - so we never become authentic, because authenticity is.. well, infinity. or nothingness. or God or nonduality or whatever you wanna call it. I am that, you are that, the stone is that, our belly button is that. whatever we do in the material world is That, and in this way it is OK however we choose our actions - and reconciling the meaninglessness of infinity with our existence is more or less what pursuit of the authentic self is. As we work to figure it out, we naturally become more at peace, and in being at peace we find more satisfaction in life. Right now you think a lot. work with that - we can't make a big change all at once - it's hard to quit cold turkey. Leo said in a video or maybe in a post in the "aske leo anything" thread, that he still has the monkey mind now all the time as much as before - the difference is that he responds to it on a more enlightened level. (I am paraphrasing) So to work with your thinking and searching for authenticity: experiment, and be mindful, and work to follow where intuition leads you. 

 

[6] I have constantly thought my whole life. the only time I am not thinking is when I am asleep. For me my thoughts have naturally taken the form of direct sensation, rather than sound or words... it is like I thought with touch... and so my thoughts were always very much abstract, which meant a lot of information is represented at any moment. this doesn't mean I'm more intelligent or anything I don't think - tho I have had people comment on how it seemed I spend a lot of time thinking, which well, is true, heh. the point is - I definitely "over" think. it got to a point three years ago - where I was thinking so much it was creating a massive anxiety feedback loop, and I crashed and lost everything and hid in my parent's attic doing nothing because I was too afraid to go outside. the defense mechanism? that was - listening to 3-7 streams of music at once, playing 10-hour repeat songs on youtube on multiple tabs. and playing a lot of videogames. I needed to escape my thoughts. 

maybe thinking is an escape method - no, it is an escape method. but - well, thinking is existence. when we touch the wall, we think it - and that is how we know it exists. so if you feel that you are thinking too much - then work to think less. but what I can say is - when thinking is too much, it will prevent you from eating enough in a day, it will prevent you from cleaning your space, and it will prevent you from succeeding at work. and there's a good chance you will be trying to escape your thoughts. if you have not reached that point - then it is your decision - think less and do more, or do less and think more. I am sure that it is going to work out fine either way - because all we need to get through this world is make sure we can eat enough to keep us alive til the end, and maintain our immediate environment so that we are safe in it. if that requires thinking - then think. if that requires doing - than do. identify your long term goals, and short term goals, they aren't always the same and often compete. we work to find out how to balance those goals - but as long as we get through properly fed and secure in our environment, then we've done a good job of it. it's our choices that determine how that journey manifests. what is authentic for us is going to happen - and searching for authenticity is only working on our self to pursue what we believe is good for us. and If you are here - then you've identified that what is good for you is self actualization. 

 

 

and.. suddenly I feel as if I've said nothing in this post too. hopefully that is only an illusion. well, it is, lol... sorry lol! You said you enjoy to think, so if you mean the same thing that I mean when I say I enjoy to think, and have bothered to read all the things I said, then you appreciated it. and oh! I appreciated creating these words too. OK! now I can walk away from this moment feeling satisfied with what I've shared

 

[Son of leo]

@aryberry Lmao