Philosophy > Spirituality

[Leo Gura]

6 hours ago, axiom said:

@Leo Gura Do you wonder whether this distillation of the methods used to approach God consciousness, no matter how precise you try to make them, may ultimately fall prey to Axiom's axiom? : that all methods, descriptions, hypotheses or realisations - no matter how basic or how advanced - must, by definition, be an equal distance from infinity?  

This just isn't true.

You can stick a cucumber up your ass, or you can smoke some 5-MeO-DMT. One of them will definitely get you closer to God.

Method matters. No one is saying that a map of the method is the Ultimate Answer itself.

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Do you think we are really allowed to know ultimate truth?

Of course! You ARE Ultimate Truth.

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As you have hinted at before yourself, the endless rabbit hole of Incompleteness and its implications likely contributed to Godel starving himself to death and to Cantor's incarceration. They crossed the Rubicon and burned the bridge.

They were not even close to awakening, so they are bad examples.

Yes, you can reach full God-realization. It's not some pipe dream you never reach. If it couldn't be reached I wouldn't be talking about it.

5 hours ago, softlyblossoming said:

Thanks, @Leo Gura and @UnbornTao. If you don't mind me asking, is there a clear-cut way to distinguish conceptual and logical conclusions from spiritual insights, and spiritual insights from meditative states like jhana's/samadhi's? Is there a book on your list that discusses this, and would you be open to making an episode about how to distinguish these three?

There is not going to be a clear distinction between these things. They are deeply entangled.

5 hours ago, UDT said:

No, philosophy is the love for wisdom. 
Wisdom is not the ultimate answer.

Don't be so literal.

The spirit and point of philosophy is a search for truth and the deepest understanding of reality possible. Well, that's God-realization.

A competent philosopher is an awake philosopher, and all others are incompetent. It is philosophy's job to show the fly the way out of the bottle.

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By the way - even following your train of thought here,  the ultimate answer then is, do not spoil the movie. 

No, the Ultimate Answer is: spoil the movie and enjoy it.

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You put the ultimate answer on a pedestal, which is your bias.

"But it is the ultimate answer, how can something be more important?" Fool!

What does it matter for Super Mario to know he is in a 2D game developed by some japanese weirdos? 
It does not matter. It is a hobby when he as some spare time or when he is high on the big shrooms. 

It matters.

Yes, caring about Truth is a bias. Sue me.

4 hours ago, PeaceOut96 said:

Makes sense but you are neglecting that contemplating and using your intelligens requires a higher state,

Yes, the highest intelligence is only available in trans-human states of consciousness. State is critical.

[Yali]

What's the point of extracting wisdom from spiritual books when you have 5-MeO? 

@Leo Gura

 

Edited February 21, 2022 by Yali

[Leo Gura]

11 minutes ago, Yali said:

What's the point of extracting wisdom from spiritual books when you have 5-MeO?

Indeed

[Yali]

@Leo Gura 

You've recommended reading at least 300 books to successfully self-actualize. Do you retract that given your experience with psychedelics?

Edited February 21, 2022 by Yali

[Leo Gura]

46 minutes ago, Yali said:

@Leo Gura 

You've recommended at least 300 books to successfully self-actualize. Do you retract that given your experience with psychedelics?

There is much you need to learn about life besides awakening.

[Ulax]

On 19/02/2022 at 10:13 PM, UDT said:

If the world actually would be better, there would be less need for escapism into the mind. 

Sure. How does one individual spending their time on prac philosophy over spirituality change the world significantly for them or anyone else?

[Hello from Russia]

13 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

There is much you need to learn about life besides awakening.

Would you recommend studying cosmologies? 

[axiom]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

This just isn't true... No one is saying that a map of the method is the Ultimate Answer itself.

The map is not the territory, yes... so:
Q: How much bigger than an ant is infinity?
A: Infinitely bigger.
Q: How much bigger than "God realisation" is infinity?
A: Infinitely bigger.

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You can stick a cucumber up your ass, or you can smoke some 5-MeO-DMT. One of them will definitely get you closer to God [realisation]

You have also said: 

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You ARE Ultimate Truth.

Talking about one particular method getting you closer to God realisation, whilst also saying that you already are God, suggests that you consider realisation to be on a different level to being. This is entirely logical. I have also always considered realisation to be a second-order (and therefore finite) phenomenon.

In which case, "realising infinity" or "God realisation" is oxymoronic. Infinity will always escape realisation. 

Speaking in relative terms, you can get much further along the path than someone who only realises that they are not the body, for example. You seem to have gone much further along this path than most.

But speaking in absolute terms, any form of realisation is an equal distance from infinity. As you attempt to close that distance, it will always be further away, always slightly out of reach. Achilles and the tortoise.

Edited February 21, 2022 by axiom

[UDT]

@softlyblossoming  You are weird 

 

 

 

[UDT]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Yes, caring about Truth is a bias. Sue me.

I got my 6 dimensional lawyers ready for take-off

[softlyblossoming]

8 hours ago, UDT said:

@softlyblossoming  You are weird 

What did you find the strangest?

8 hours ago, UDT said:

I got my 6 dimensional lawyers ready for take-off