Second Girl To Bed, Still No Sex

[K Ghoul]

@Gesundheit2 Healing an unresolved trauma can be a long process, and being gentle with yourself and having others offer emotional comfort by just acknowledging that you are in distress even for just a brief moment when they see you are in pain is all good.

I know the pain may come in waves at random times, and it’s important to tune into it as it comes. What helped me to resolve mine was to little by little start feeling the stored pain, staying with it, first for just brief moments, a few minutes. It took me 4 years to begin being able to have those periods of staying present in the pain extended until I was comfortable enough to fully give into those painful stored emotions and experience them fully for as long as needed (days at a time) until they could eventually and finally move out of body (for me it was through crying)

 

1 hour ago, Gesundheit2 said:

That being said, I'll take a break from posting for a couple of days in which I will reflect and try to improve. In the meantime I will also be reading the rest of this thread if there's gonna be any.
Ciao for now.

Have a nice weekend! Come back soon 

[Leo Gura]

@Etherial Cat There are so many things wrong in your preception of my attitude towards women, and guys getting better with women, that I don't have time to correct it all.

You're not going to understand how to get better with women until you go out there and do it. So I am not going to bother explaining it because you're not out there trying to get laid. You're not a guy and you don't understand what it takes for a guy to get good in this area.

I frame things from a guy's POV because that's who will be applying it, not you ladies. You ladies have your own agenda and POV, and that's fine and valid to a degree, but it is not useful for guys who struggle to get laid.

So what happens is I tell a struggling guy something useful, you ladies hear it, it hurts your ears and you want to yell, "No! No! No!" I get that. But it doesn't help the guy. When it comes to this area of self-help I'm simply very pragmatic about it because it's mostly a pragmatic problem and its what produces results for guys.

I don't have an ideology on this stuff, I look at what works and what doesn't by testing it in the field. But of course your POV will even take issue with talking pragmatically about this topic. I understand all that. This is a matter of difference in survival agenda. If you were a guy you would see things very different. But I don't expect you to be a guy. You will keep being a girl. It is simply not suitable for girls to be closely listening to dating advice for guys. Why waste your time ice-skating uphill? This is a meta problem. It is not solved at the level of content, like giving guys different advice. But hey, feel free to keep hitting your head against that brick wall.

[Tim R]

@Gesundheit2 Not everybody deals with trauma the same way. If you are tough enough to withstand a civil war without being traumatized, you're lucky and tough as nails. Even though the way you speak, I think you're rather repressing your own emotions. That too is a way of dealing with traumatic events. 

But that doesn't mean that others are able to do the same. You can't just project your resilience / way of dealing with trauma onto others and expect them to deal with (even 'far less') stressful situations the same way. 

[LSD-Rumi]

@Etherial Cat Have you ever seen those birds in the Amazon where the male performs a dance to attract the female? Leo is just teaching us how to dance! In nature, it is almost always the responsibility of the male to attract and sell itself to the female. Our culture and parents sadly failed to teach us how to (as males) attract females, We are like these beautiful birds but we don't know how to dance and we feel deficient and miserable until we learn how to dance. Now you are concerned about Selfish people using Pick up teachings to manipulate and use females, right? Yes, it is a valid concern but this is where it comes your part as females. You need also to learn how to judge males properly and filter those who are selfish assholes, Which is a much easier task ( in most cases) than learning how to attract women. 

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by LSD-Rumi

[PurpleTree]

3 hours ago, Etherial Cat said:

@Leo Gura

 

I'll stick to other parts of the forum. 

I think it's great that you told the story, good to hear another POV especially if it's balanced and not on some man-hating trip and in some ways important for this part of the forum, i learned something. So keep it coming

Also pretty brave to tell it since you're not a faceless newbie or whatever. 

Some of you seem to think you can change Leo's mind though, which i don't see happening in a big way and which is fine.

 

[K Ghoul]

23 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Some of you seem to think you can change Leo's mind though, which i don't see happening in a big way and which is fine.

 

@PurpleTree I hope we fail in our efforts because then he would have become a woman ? 

I’m still gonna get triggered though every time he says something unpleasant 

[integral]

1 hour ago, K Ghoul said:

I’m still gonna get triggered though every time he says something unpleasant 

Try to understand that what hes saying and what your interpreting are not the same. 

Edited February 19, 2022 by integral

[K Ghoul]

5 minutes ago, integral said:

Try to understand that what hes saying what what your interpreting are not the same. 

I don’t know which part of my autistic brain I would need to activate in order to be able to do that.

[Roy]

Reality has divided us in two (male<>female). Both are looking to merge together again and be in union, two pieces of a puzzle trying to complete a picture.

The problem is we fundamentally disagree about how those two different pieces are supposed to fit together, and what angle makes the picture. One wants it this way, one thinks its another.

So here we are, arguing 

[LSD-Rumi]

1 hour ago, K Ghoul said:

I’m still gonna get triggered though every time he says something unpleasant 

I like it actually when I get triggered or confused cause I know there is something new here to learn!

[PurpleTree]

2 hours ago, K Ghoul said:

@PurpleTree I hope we fail in our efforts because then he would have become a woman ? 

I’m still gonna get triggered though every time he says something unpleasant 

 

1 hour ago, LSD-Rumi said:

I like it actually when I get triggered or confused cause I know there is something new here to learn!

i also get triggered quite often by all sorts of things and it's fine, gotta deal with that ?

 

[integral]

2 hours ago, K Ghoul said:

I don’t know which part of my autistic brain I would need to activate in order to be able to do that.

Its interpreted as hes telling guys to wear a mask, this is the prime fear woman are facing. But thats not quite it, hes explaining how attraction works, there's a difference. 

The meta perspective here is all human socialization is smoke and mirrors, to speak in a way that maintains the integrity of the ego your speaking to.  Game = basic social educate, Its a dance many men aren't socialized enough young enough to learn and there mind are filled with a dance that doesn't work. 99% of what hes saying are subtle things, but interpreted by woman in a stereotypical way.

---

Leo talking about being persistent doesn't equal Etherial Cat rape story persistent. 

Etherial cat hears the word persistent and can only understand it from the frame of reference of that one guy. (im sure she is more nuanced then this im over simplifying)

Leo means to be persistent to escalate intelligently and empathetically, to create a comfortable caring environment, that lets her relax into her feminine nature, that can then extend into a healthy relationship.  

It sounds like deception or manipulation because its the explication of romance, but its just what is happening explicated. 

To explicate romance in a practical way is a train wreck to read and interpreted as low consciousness.

Edited February 19, 2022 by integral

[something_else]

@Etherial Cat When you're a dude and you do what girls tell you to do and it doesn't work... and then you do what guys tell you and it does work... what other conclusions can a guy come to?

When it comes to 'men attracting women' you can only ever give theoretical advice to men about it because you've never actually experienced having to attract a women as a man. Not once in your entire life. Never. Zero times. Compare that to someone like Leo or some of the other experienced guys here who have done it thousands of times. Whose advice would you take?

The equivalent is almost like men giving a woman makeup or dress style advice. We can tell you whether we like the end product but not really anything practical about how to achieve it, because it's not something we have any experience with at all. Yet somehow you girls think you're qualified to give guys attraction advice despite never having had to do any of it yourself

Honestly, I'd say that's more arrogant

Edited February 19, 2022 by something_else

[K Ghoul]

@integral  What do you think about this guy’s advise:

 

1:57 he says in order to get laid  “Just make yourself sexy. Just become sexy”

 

Here’s transcript for the echo part:

"The shortest possible and most important general advice about women is that they are that they are disposable as toilet paper. That's not- that's not not what i mean. What I mean is um women are the most special and important people. The most important people in my life are definitely women. Um, except for mike, except for (dota?) mike *laughs*. Um, *clears throat* however if you tie your validation- if you tie your like security and validation and stuff to women, you become like a beta male pussy and get in dependent relationships you're gonna be miserable, you should kill yourself. That's the worst and it's a hard lesson to learn and you can blow a lot of time being in relationships with, um, uh, shitty women so just be careful and try to, like, be a man like uh, you don't have to be like an "Alpha male" like misogynist, you don't have to treat women like trash, just have a sense of, um.. of um, a sense of self, like know who you are and have some self worth."
 

[integral]

@K Ghoul Basically don't make relationships the center focus of your life, be independent, secure and content exactly as your life is. Sounds good +1. 

[K Ghoul]

@integral Yep, being in touch with oneself gives off very strong magnetism and charisma, you will no longer need to resort to schemas and techniques- women will want to be around you themselves.

 

PUA is more like solving a problem (women don’t want to fuck me) at a surface level. Shifting focus to the inside and addressing the issue from within oneself is a much more stable, reliable and a permanent solution. At least that’s how I see it and how I would approach this.
 

Edited February 20, 2022 by K Ghoul

[integral]

53 minutes ago, K Ghoul said:

Shifting focus to the inside and addressing the issue from within oneself is a much more stable

Ideally yes, but 99% of the time this stuff needs to be learned from experience. They are so behind that they need anything to get there foot in the door first. 

But leos isn't promoting strate PUA it just comes off that way because he explains things in a masculine way.  

Edited February 20, 2022 by integral

[K Ghoul]

@integral oohh I see. Yea, it makes sense! I did notice that sometimes he’s literally leading them by the hand (telling exactly what to text word-for-word etc.). I understand now the baseline of this approach better. Thank you! 

[integral]

@K Ghoul haha surprising response i cant tell if its sarcasm lol.

25 minutes ago, K Ghoul said:

telling exactly what to text word-for-word etc.

Hes giving them examples of how to be playful, they are just clueless! lol but it can be interpreted by readers as hes helping the guy manipulate, thats really not the intention. 

Leo tailors the advice he gives to the person hes speaking to. Matching them at the level they are at. Advice is so tricky to give, what works for one person doesn't work for others. 

Its all to help them grow up, one step at a time. 

Edited February 20, 2022 by integral

[K Ghoul]

@integral haha no, no sarcasm. I’m learning to understand a new perspective, this is an uncharted territory for me so I appreciate you taking the time to break it down for me so I can maybe see in it something I didn’t see before