Who shall I be in the social domain

[Illusory Self]

I told myself "this year I really want to get good with women & socialization". I joined all the online dating sites, going out to nightclubs 2x a week to practice (barely did any approaches). I did manage to sleep with a few women suprisingly considering my social skills are atrocious. I did get lucky with the genetic lottery though. I do HATE going to nightclubs so much, I find it terrifyingly toxic & not fun (especially when one is such a deep introvert). 

I want to get good at this area of my life as it feels horrible sleeping with women & having them reject you after. It just makes me feel like I display this loser persona. It makes me not want to partake in the social domain of life, everyone seems to be playing these games on how they want to be perceived by others.

I question this further to the point where I don't know what my own persona is.

How do I respond in certain situations?

What shall I say?

Who am I?

It feels like a real head mess because I want myself to be a highly social person, likeable, charasmatic but at the same time it all feels so fake.

How do I forge my own character? I feel like a blank slate, not knowing who I am. This happens in every single interaction I have. A lot of the times when someone says something to me, my mind will just naturally be blank & I am like 'what shall I say' or 'how do I cohere the best possible sentance. I don't find myself getting any pleasure or satisfaction in any kind of social situation whatsoever. I view it as a waste of time, it achieves nothing. 

But I really like sex & you need to be sociable in order to get that. I find the craving for sex way to much sometimes, to the point where I neglect every single other aspect of my life in the pursuit of that. 

This social dating game always seems to affect my emotional state, based on past experiences. I find going on dates very mentally draining, any move you make, any word you say. All attention is on you. It feels hard when you don't enjoy socializing. Sometimes my mind just goes blank on the date, I am just sitting there in peace, enjoying the silence.

I can get loads of matches on tinder, bumble etc.. I will even get girls numbers but I tend to say the 'wrong' message a lot of the time & they don't respond. Sometimes I do not even reply back to there message because I genuinely do not know what to say so I just leave it.

How do I navigate the social domain?

I genuinely do not know what kind of personality to forge

A part of me just wants to ignore the whole social domain of life but I know that will be unhealthy as I clearly have certain cravings.

I even feel this goes way beyond just dating

[something_else]

9 minutes ago, Illusory Self said:

I want to get good at this area of my life as it feels horrible sleeping with women & having them reject you after

I'd say this is pretty common for girls you meet on Tinder and in places like clubs btw, you shouldn't feel too bad about it. A lot of the time girls there aren't gonna be looking for something long term and they're caught up in the moment on the night

11 minutes ago, Illusory Self said:

How do I forge my own character? I feel like a blank slate, not knowing who I am. This happens in every single interaction I have. A lot of the times when someone says something to me, my mind will just naturally be blank & I am like 'what shall I say' or 'how do I cohere the best possible sentance. I don't find myself getting any pleasure or satisfaction in any kind of social situation whatsoever. I view it as a waste of time, it achieves nothing. 

This is pretty much exactly how I feel. In fact your story matches up with mine almost uncannily, almost every word you wrote here describes my situation as well. Although I do find that I can enjoy socialising if I get in the right mood. I don't have a reliable way of doing that (besides maybe alcohol) but I have noticed that as I socialise more, this state has started to occur more often at least

12 minutes ago, Illusory Self said:

I can get loads of matches on tinder, bumble etc.. I will even get girls numbers but I tend to say the 'wrong' message a lot of the time & they don't respond. Sometimes I do not even reply back to there message because I genuinely do not know what to say so I just leave it.

Again, this is also normal. It isn't that you're saying anything wrong, it's just the nature of the game online

The overall impression I get from you here is that you want to control your social interactions such that they always go well no matter what. I do the same. I'm unlikely to say something in a social situation unless I am 90%+ sure of the reaction it will get from others. And if I say something even slightly stupid or weird like to the baristas at my local coffee shop who I often talk to daily, it can actually ruin my whole day.

Compare this to naturally sociable people who just blurt out whatever's in their mind without too much thought. If something doesn't land, they don't care because they're already onto the next thing and they don't ponder what they've said in the past much. 

The solution is pretty much to give less fucks in social situations and not be too dependant on certain outcomes, not trying to force certain outcomes. Let things unfold. Obviously this is much much easier said than done.

[Terell Kirby]

9 hours ago, Illusory Self said:

going out to nightclubs 2x a week to practice (barely did any approaches).

Well .. you severely limit your prospects without approaching. Unfortunately there is no way around it, confronting your limiting beliefs and fears is imperative.

Also, make sure this is something you really want. I notice when Leo says “jump!” .. people go right to jumping without deeply contemplating if it’s right for them at their stage in life. And by jump, I mean his advice on various aspects of personal development and spiritual growth.

[Matthew85]

9 hours ago, Illusory Self said:

I do HATE going to nightclubs so much, I find it terrifyingly toxic & not fun

@Illusory Self What social activities do you enjoy? Some of my most fulfilling relationships came from me following my interests. Not necessarily trying to meet people. Just pursuing different things I was interested in. 

[soos_mite_ah]

On 2/7/2022 at 11:30 AM, Illusory Self said:

I do HATE going to nightclubs so much, I find it terrifyingly toxic & not fun (especially when one is such a deep introvert). 

I agree with @Matthew85. If this is not your domain, it's best not to force it. The most growth comes when you embrace yourself and work with what you have rather than forcing something that doesn't feel authentic. I'm kind of in the same boat where I don't really like parties and I find them to be really loud and overwhelming to where I find it difficult to connect to others. I'm generally really good with people, that is just not the setting or the crowd for me. And that is ok. 

On 2/7/2022 at 11:30 AM, Illusory Self said:

I question this further to the point where I don't know what my own persona is.

I think this answer comes from being true to yourself and being mindful in your social interactions when you are naturally yourself. Figuring out your person if you will has so much to do with your own sense authenticity and making yourself fit into a limitted carciacture of your identity would be really limitting and likely won't be as fun for you because you always would have to keep up with appearances. 

On 2/7/2022 at 11:30 AM, Illusory Self said:

A lot of the times when someone says something to me, my mind will just naturally be blank & I am like 'what shall I say' or 'how do I cohere the best possible sentance. I don't find myself getting any pleasure or satisfaction in any kind of social situation whatsoever. I view it as a waste of time, it achieves nothing. 

On 2/7/2022 at 11:30 AM, Illusory Self said:

I will even get girls numbers but I tend to say the 'wrong' message a lot of the time & they don't respond

Dude... you really need to get out of your head. There is no "wrong" way to socialize so long as you aren't manipulating, exploiting, or otherwise harming people. No wonder socializing is so draining for you. You are spending all of this emotional labor to craft certain responses instead of acting in a way that comes naturally to you. It's ok if you are a blank slate of sorts and it's ok to have period of silence. It might seem awkward to you but trust me, a lot of people see it as a breath of fresh air during an interaction because there is less pressue.  

On 2/7/2022 at 11:30 AM, Illusory Self said:

How do I navigate the social domain?

I genuinely do not know what kind of personality to forge

Don't "forge" a personality or I guess in this case perform a personality. That will lead into more of the exhaustion that you are talking about. Instead of seeing it as creating a personality, try to approach it as discovering your personality. That will help you tap into being, help you be more authentic, and help you take out a lot of the pressure you're putting on yourself. 

[something_else]

6 hours ago, soos_mite_ah said:

I agree with @Matthew85. If this is not your domain, it's best not to force it. The most growth comes when you embrace yourself and work with what you have rather than forcing something that doesn't feel authentic

The problem is that this mindset can encourage you to stick to your comfort zone a bit too much

It's super tricky to distinguish between authentically disliking something and just being plain terrified of it

If you have some kind of social anxiety your mind will produce every rational excuse in the book to make you avoid social situations and mask the anxiety. '[X] social event just really isn't authentically me' is a deadly one

For example if you'd asked me whether I like clubs before I started going, or even the first 5 times I went to one, I'd tell you I hated them. Then I started to really enjoy them. Initially I was just terrified every time I went there and couldn't relax

Of course it is possible that clubs just aren't for you, but if you are saying things like 'I HATE going to [X] social place' then that may be an indicator that it's out of fear rather than a genuine dislike of it

[soos_mite_ah]

12 hours ago, something_else said:

For example if you'd asked me whether I like clubs before I started going, or even the first 5 times I went to one, I'd tell you I hated them. Then I started to really enjoy them. Initially I was just terrified every time I went there and couldn't relax

If the anxiety is that overwhelming, I wouldn't recommed going to a club right away. That's like going from 0-100 without anything in between. You can practice your socialization skills at work, school, restaurants and a variety of other circumstances. Sure, try clubbing, but if it's too anxiety inducing and you're not enjoying it at all, it's best to respect those boundaries and do things gradually. 

I thought I would especially emphasize that point about not forcing things because from what I can gather from the first post, OP is acting from a place where they are trying to force having a personality instead of trying to explore the one they have. And especially when you feel like you're a blank slate, self discovery is so important and part of that is indentifying what you do and don't like rather than forcing yourself into situations that are simply not in allignment. 

[somegirl]

19 hours ago, soos_mite_ah said:

If this is not your domain, it's best not to force it. The most growth comes when you embrace yourself and work with what you have rather than forcing something that doesn't feel authentic

This sounds true in some situations, however sometimes it is important that you go out of your comfort zone and challenge yourself. I am an introvert as well, but I have come to enjoy socializing and partying/dancing, even though I hardly imagined myself being that way before. It's good that he's putting himself out there. He's deliberately going against his thoughts that say "No, go back, this is unfamiliar territory...". I would recommend @Illusory Self that he keeps doing those "uncomfortable" things until he comes to enjoy them. And I only give this advice because he said he wishes to be good at approaching women and socializing. Otherwise he could just drop everything and stay home. 

12 hours ago, something_else said:

It's super tricky to distinguish between authentically disliking something and just being plain terrified of it

This is so true lol. I don't even know myself sometimes if I'm doing something "to grow myself and throw myself out of my comfort zone" (so my "suffering" is justified) or am I genuinely hating something and I genuinely don't wanna do it, and it doesn't help me grow myself.

I guess the difference is... One needs to go deeper and introspect. Ask questions... Why do I hate this... Is it because I am just not used to those situations/people or because I just don't genuinely want to do any of that stuff because it doesn't authentically interest me. 

@Illusory Self You're block yourself out. You think/worry too much. You want to be someone you're not, that's why it is hard for you to just authentically be you and answer in your manner to those girl's messages. 

I have figured that part of socialization is being able not to overthink (which we introverts love to do). You just say and do what you feel at the moment and not care what others say. You care if you're having a good time. Have that change of perspective. Change your framing. And you just have to keep going out and doing this. Who cares if they don't respond/if you say something awkward? People forget it in the next few minutes/hours. You just move on. This is how extroverts behave. They just go with the flow. 

[Kalki Avatar]

It has a price and it is becoming somewhat fake. Its a fake it until you make it process, then it becomes normal, part of you and even genuine. You have to tought it up and force yourself and situations until they also become normal, then feel genuine. Its a freaking painful process of changing your inner structure. 

At best, try to find female friends that are spiritual and hot. Closer you a higher vibration. That would be the ideal case, but its hard to manifest. 

[something_else]

22 hours ago, soos_mite_ah said:

If the anxiety is that overwhelming, I wouldn't recommed going to a club right away. That's like going from 0-100 without anything in between

Meh, clubs are actually not that bad. They're so busy that you become anonymous. Your social anxiety acclimates to that quite quickly

Moderately busy or quiet venues are a million times worse in terms of anxiety

Most social anxiety isn't about the amount of people around you but the amount of eyes on you

The problem is that most people with social anxiety also (wrongly) assume everyone is looking at them all the time, so in their head the idea of a club is still very terrifying.

It takes a few visits to a club to realise no one gives a fuck about what you're doing for the most part, and that's an incredibly good lesson to learn for socially anxious people

[soos_mite_ah]

@something_else I guess it can depend from person to person. I know for me personally, loud areas where I can't actually engage with a person and where I'm constantly getting over stimulated can be pretty overwhelming. I suppose I need to draw more of a distinction from generalized anxiety an social anxiety since for me, they tend to go hand in hand. 

[something_else]

2 hours ago, soos_mite_ah said:

@something_else I guess it can depend from person to person. I know for me personally, loud areas where I can't actually engage with a person and where I'm constantly getting over stimulated can be pretty overwhelming. I suppose I need to draw more of a distinction from generalized anxiety an social anxiety since for me, they tend to go hand in hand. 

Fair enough, of course it differs from person to person. I was over generalising for sure

I love loud, crazy, high energy environments. But I struggle to actually be anything other than an observer in them because the moment I’m involved my anxiety dials up to 100

[Nahm]

 

Quote

I even feel this goes way beyond just dating

Prior to. 

What’s felt are self referential thoughts. What’s projected is the discord therein. What doesn’t feel good doesn’t feel good to others either. 

“I told myself”, “I want myself to be”, “my own persona”, “I don’t find myself getting”, “a part of me”. 

These are thoughts about an idea of you… but the thoughts are felt by you. 

[Ulax]

Sounds like you have toxic shame.

I think you're going to need to focus on your inner game quite a lot.

The dudes at the r/pickup discord are helpful for that. (Note: Mods lmk pls if its within the rules to reference this).

I'd just caveat that by saying be aware of the toxic masculinity at that place.

Also, IFS therapy is the best inner game stuff ik of.