On mine & leo's spiritual path

[Danioover9000]

@lostingenosmaze

4 hours ago, lostingenosmaze said:

@Danioover9000 Searching that exact quote doesn't bring anything up but I did remember him saying something similar

   I see, although the context is a bit different, he was replying to @Evoke

   Aren't psychedelics supposed to make a person a bit more peaceful?

[Whatever]

Since Leo doesnt have authority to speak for the universe that sentence is translated to "I dont care about your excuses". Thats not exactly synonymous to warning on dangers of psychedelics or honoring ones own judgement. Comes accross as indifference with a sense of superioriority (which is love if you believe what he says). Not a good look.

Edited February 5, 2022 by Whatever

[Neph]

@Leo Gura The meditation techniques you have taught if somebody follows that & goes deeply into that their kundalini will automatically rise..If you have taught how to start it it's also your responsibility to go further into this & teach how to deal with it...Before teaching those meditation techniques you should know what it can lead to otherwise you're playing with people's life here

[WelcometoReality]

@Neph What do you want Leo to say?

If someone attempts suicide then it seems like an appropriate response to tell him to seek professional help.

Mental issues can be hard to deal with and no answer that Leo makes will be adequate.

When I had mental issues (depression) I went to an hour long session once a week for 2 years. 

[happyhappy]

4 hours ago, Neph said:

@Leo Gura The meditation techniques you have taught if somebody follows that & goes deeply into that their kundalini will automatically rise..If you have taught how to start it it's also your responsibility to go further into this & teach how to deal with it...Before teaching those meditation techniques you should know what it can lead to otherwise you're playing with people's life here

yup! as a teacher,at least  a part of responsibility falls on him as well.  he had  many warnings and disclaimers  but I don't think they were enough.

I remember Sadhguru saying that these days these teachings are even given on the street corners and said that 100s of people  come every month for help cuz of misguided reckless meditative and yoga practices. there are reasons why this kinda teachings were kept esoteric for centuries.

I myself have fallen in to suicidal levels of depression by tryna rack my mind over  spiritual truths.  and hey, you should find somebody ASAP who has expertise on Kundalini and get back ur mind first.   

much love!

 

 

[roopepa]

17 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It should be obvious that my spiritual teachings are DIY -- Do It Yourself.

Then stop calling it "teaching".

[Whatever]

Just now, roopepa said:

Then stop calling it "teaching".

Yep, good catch. Leo has pretty developed skill set to weasel out of responsibility. Teaching do it yourself while making hundreds of hours of claims of nature of reality and its ramifications. And saying God or universe doesnt care or views things as this or that, not himself, he is but a messanger.. isnt a guru or cult leader yet seems to be very important to him to be seen as someone who speaks for God and possessess highest knowledge. Sneaky dude.

[roopepa]

@Neph I hear you. I've experienced something quite similar to what you describe here. Same thing, I listened to Leo and got more confused than clear.

A while ago I posted this. Maybe you find some clarity there:

 

[Neph]

@WelcometoReality I sought professional help afterwards for my mental condition... But all these happened because I started this spiritual journey otherwise my life would have been normal.. I heard about it from leo & followed all his teachings.. As he promoting the benefits of this spiritual work he should also cover the downsides of it.. Cuz what I have learnt now that this spiritual work is really dangerous & one should not do it without proper guru Or guidance.. So if he's teaching this stuff he should cover it all step by step from the beginning.. There's a saying little knowledge can be harmful or dangerous something like that

[Neph]

@lostingenosmaze I sought

[Whatever]

1 hour ago, Neph said:

@WelcometoReality I sought professional help afterwards for my mental condition... But all these happened because I started this spiritual journey otherwise my life would have been normal.. I heard about it from leo & followed all his teachings.. As he promoting the benefits of this spiritual work he should also cover the downsides of it.. Cuz what I have learnt now that this spiritual work is really dangerous & one should not do it without proper guru Or guidance.. So if he's teaching this stuff he should cover it all step by step from the beginning.. There's a saying little knowledge can be harmful or dangerous something like that

He has his own interests of doing this and doesnt consider himself with what happens outside his agenda. If it was purely him practicing his spiritual life he could do it privately.

Edited February 5, 2022 by Whatever

[Luca001]

I don't think Leo is wrong in the content of his response,is quite obvious that he can't help everybody who injure themselves after following his teachings,given also the fact that he repeatedly states that are dangerous.But.

But,you (Leo) could at least show some compassion,some humanity. Alright,you probably speak the truth,and truth sometimes hurts,but you also once beautifully said:

"You should give others as much truth as much you think will benefit them.".

As a teacher you should know that (yeah we shouldn't,but that's what happens) you are seen as an authority and being that raw with a fragile person that trust you could emotionally crush him.

 

[Matt23]

I have similar frustrations with him as well. 

He's not changing though, so, I suppose it's better to assume that and not try to hold him to the standards you want in this domain.  Like in terms of how he shows up in his interactions with others here.  I just don't think he feels much responsibility or obligation for people/the community he created.  I dunno.  Though he may say it, in terms of how I've seen him respond to people's issues and desires for his help, it's been pretty shitty imo.  Lol.  Like blunt one-off replies of things like you quoted.   Not always I'm sure.  But often enough I feel aggravated by it.  

Aaaannnyyyways.  

Ya.  Just take him as someone who, yes, I think has awesome information and great wisdom n' stuff.  And I no doubt believe he does care deeply and feels that in his work.  In terms of how he interacts with others, try not to see him showing up to the same level as you see him show up in his videos and content.  Two separate things and domains of mastery.  

Ya, I'd love to see more of an effort in terms of replying to people's desire for help and issues in a more personal, caring, and understanding way.  

But also, it might be difficult to do that and maybe it literally is too much for him to be concerned with that stuff.  I dunno.  I've never run a business or a forum so, ya.  It can be difficult to understand what pressures and senses of balance people have if you've never done what they're doing.  Hard to know.  

Also, being alone so much, he may not have tons of personal feedback.  Like sure, he's got the internet and the forum.  But that's a different beast than 1-on-1 communication and feedback.  So maybe he's in a bit of a bubble.  Again though, this is just hypothesizing.  I have no idea. 

But, anyways.  I still do think he could show more compassion and skillfulness in replying to people, especially with mental health issues n stuff (I have no doubt he feels compassion and cares, I don't want to take that from him... but I in terms of how he shows that... ummm haha... not the most skilled or w/e).   That seems obvious to me.  Maybe not to him.  

So, as per your issues n stuff with him.  Maybe lowering your standards and views of him in terms of his abilities or desires to be what you want him to be.  Nobody is perfect.  Just try to let it go. 

Consider treating him and his content like a book:  Great information and resource and even inspiration.  Absolutely.  But if you're looking for some sort of connection or feeling of personal caring, don't look there.  

Edited February 5, 2022 by Matt23

[Vincent S]

I would advise people to lower their expectations. Transformation may happen when walking the pathless path.
But at some point, it will become the choice of the indvidual to let: What has been given to him/her: Transform them in to a more loving and compassionate being. Not everyone will be turned in to a saint. Doesnt really give people the rights to be completely reckless. But you see, even some monks and gurus who have "realized" turn in to devils, rapists and maniacs (Not saying Leo is one lol)
Enlightenment, awakening in to reality and all that, doesnt necessarily make you in to a Godly being. It can, but isnt always the case. It will always be the choice of each "individual"

To be fair, Leo have been telling us not to keep him to some Godly standard. Even if he goes around telling everyone and him is God <3
True, but for the "worldly" indvidual, dont expect much

 

Edited February 5, 2022 by Vincent S

[Danioover9000]

@Neph

4 hours ago, Neph said:

@WelcometoReality I sought professional help afterwards for my mental condition... But all these happened because I started this spiritual journey otherwise my life would have been normal.. I heard about it from leo & followed all his teachings.. As he promoting the benefits of this spiritual work he should also cover the downsides of it.. Cuz what I have learnt now that this spiritual work is really dangerous & one should not do it without proper guru Or guidance.. So if he's teaching this stuff he should cover it all step by step from the beginning.. There's a saying little knowledge can be harmful or dangerous something like that

   How did it go? Could you tell us what kind of professional help you sought? Was it therapy?

[Whatever]

3 minutes ago, Vincent S said:

To be fair, Leo have been telling us not to keep him to some Godly standard. Even if he goes around telling everyone and him is God <3
True, but for the "worldly" indvidual, dont expect much

 

He also frequently responds to people that he is the possesser of highest realisation and others who dont get it are just little children. Then asking people who believe that to not keep him in godly standards is just him again wiggleing out of responsibility of what he says.

[Vincent S]

6 minutes ago, Whatever said:

He also frequently responds to people that he is the possesser of highest realisation and others who dont get it are just little children. Then asking people who believe that to not keep him in godly standards is just him again wiggleing out of responsibility of what he says.

True. But as Osho once said: "We dont have time and energy to live all possible lives and learn from each tiny mistake we make. Learn from others "mistakes" and be a better example"
If you dont like something Leo is doing or not doing, learn from that and be better. But this isnt a competition with "others" its just about taking your own responsibilities. A life spend on keeping people accountable for their way of acting and taking care of others. Is a life spent very poorly.
Just do you and stop caring what some dude who thinks he has reached the deepest waters say.
We are all fishes in this huge ocean. Everyone has access to the same depths.

Edited February 5, 2022 by Vincent S

[Whatever]

7 minutes ago, Vincent S said:

True. But as Osho once said: "We dont have time and energy to live all possible lives and learn from each tiny mistake we make. Learn from others "mistakes" and be a better example"
If you dont like something Leo is doing or not doing, learn from that and be better. But this isnt a competition with "others" its just about taking your own responsibilities. A life spend on keeping people accountable for their way of acting and taking care of others. Is a life spent very poorly.
Just do you and stop caring what some dude who thinks he has reached the deepest waters say.
We are all fishes in this huge ocean. Everyone has access to the same depths.

I dont relate as indifferently as that when I see someone harming people. Think its important to point these kinds of things out and put responsibility where it belongs. Im taking mine, and now its me setting boundaries and calling out bs. 

Taking care of others also I find exactly to be the way out of self centeredness. 

Osho was a cult leader too but thats fine. He could still have something to say. Think this quote is pretty bad in this situation. Unless dedicating ones life to encoursging people to potentially fuck up their life on area he himself doesnt understand to make followers and pose as highest guru counts as "Tiny mistake".

[Vincent S]

Im not arguing against you. Im just saying that even though people walk this path. They will still have an ego to a certain degree.
And expecting people to change their ego. Is a time waste on your part. Just saying.
 

[Whatever]

16 minutes ago, Vincent S said:

Im not arguing against you. Im just saying that even though people walk this path. They will still have an ego to a certain degree.
And expecting people to change their ego. Is a time waste on your part. Just saying.
 

Not really. Unless people are complitelly closed off to dialogue. We can be mirrors to eachother. People arent autonomic closed circles, we affect eachother and need that in order to put things in perspective. If you are saying that im wasting my time with Leo because he is too stubborn, that might be true. Generally I dont agree with you tho.