Everything Is Interpretation

[BlueOak]

3 hours ago, RMQualtrough said:

@BlueOak Usefulness has no bearing on truth; properties aren't physical objects but descriptors of how the allegedly real object behaves. None prove the object is actually externally real.

The object isn't really out there, that is the important part.

You would never will away the weight of the apple, it'll always be present. Its weight, texture and things like usefulness or flavor are subjective, not the fact its in your hand and has mass.

Physical properties of matter are one of the most useful reference points for reality. Survival, security, safety etc.

Edited January 16, 2022 by BlueOak

[RMQualtrough]

6 hours ago, BlueOak said:

You would never will away the weight of the apple, it'll always be present. Its weight, texture and things like usefulness or flavor are subjective, not the fact its in your hand and has mass.

Physical properties of matter are one of the most useful reference points for reality. Survival, security, safety etc.

A property isn't itself a physical object. It says nothing about the reality of a "physical" object really being there any more than the fact I don't fall through floors in dreams.

I don't believe free will exists in any space, mental or otherwise. I never choose the thoughts that come into my head.

[BlueOak]

On 1/16/2022 at 6:25 PM, RMQualtrough said:

A property isn't itself a physical object. It says nothing about the reality of a "physical" object really being there any more than the fact I don't fall through floors in dreams.

I don't believe free will exists in any space, mental or otherwise. I never choose the thoughts that come into my head.

If you were outside of your mind yes, but you are in your mind, while there something exerting mass on your hand isn't subjective. How you then go to describe it or interact with it is. I've gone out of the body before and in that state yes, but for 99.999999% of my life the apple will have mass when in my hand, I will be aware of it and though I could call that word mass - anything, it will still be present. I could lie to myself and say I don't feel the apple in my hand but that wouldn't be truthful.

By the way thank you for the back and forth discussion.

Edited January 18, 2022 by BlueOak

[BlueOak]

Apologies for two posts but I should comment on free will.

You have free will all the time. You can respond here or not. You can choose to stop thinking a thought at any time, follow it through, or redefine it. You can choose what that thought means, if it means anything at all, and what connections it'll bring. The mind works like a ball of string, connecting one thing to the next, depending on how you define it. A bit like this conversation.

Edited January 18, 2022 by BlueOak

[Mirror]

@Inliytened1 That's exactly correct 

[RMQualtrough]

15 hours ago, BlueOak said:

If you were outside of your mind yes, but you are in your mind, while there something exerting mass on your hand isn't subjective. How you then go to describe it or interact with it is. I've gone out of the body before and in that state yes, but for 99.999999% of my life the apple will have mass when in my hand, I will be aware of it and though I could call that word mass - anything, it will still be present. I could lie to myself and say I don't feel the apple in my hand but that wouldn't be truthful.

By the way thank you for the back and forth discussion.

The apple could permanently have mass, but it's more about what the apple actually is. What matter actually is. Things like mass, speed, whatever else, they're just descriptors of an object's behavior but don't tell us anything about what the object is in terms of its fundamental substance.

Which is to say, we recognize the actual images we imagine (the image itself) is not made out of anything. Usually people think of it as a sort of hologram, where there is some real matter called the brain, but that the image itself is just a mirage that itself is not made of things... Matter is also fundamentally not "made out of" anything in the same way. Once you get to the smallest particle, when there's nowhere deeper to say "it's made from atoms, atoms are made from electrons" (w.e. the case is), and you have to actually confront "okay so what actually is that, fundamentally speaking".