Black America Ravaged by Feminism

[Raptorsin7]

13 minutes ago, Terell Kirby said:

At least you’re an honest racist. I wish more racist humans would let it be known. All of your points are being influenced by your racism, you are deluding yourself by thinking otherwise. You are debating from emotions, not truth.

Your racist sentiments is influencing how you perceive Black culture.

How about you learn to not be racist in 2022. It’s quite hard to live as a racist and misogynist in the 21st century. Do yourself a favor and seek therapy and counseling to resolve your self-hate, which you project into black people and women.

Why don't you address my points rather than shut down the conversation with buzz words.

Racism is an evolutionary byproduct we have an instinct for in group preference, and aversion to the out group. But that still doesn't change the points I brought up. 

If i was motivated purely by hatred of the black community I would actually agree with you because what you're espousing does not work and is part of the reason black America is in the state it's in.

If what you're speaking is the truth then why don't you deal with my arguments and show specifically what's not true

 

Edited December 30, 2021 by Raptorsin7

[Terell Kirby]

Just now, Raptorsin7 said:

Why don't you address my points rather than shut down the conversation with buzz words.

Racist are ignorant and don’t think critically. Therefore it’s no point conversing with them. Bye.

[Raptorsin7]

9 minutes ago, Terell Kirby said:

Racist are ignorant and don’t think critically. Therefore it’s no point conversing with them. Bye.

Lol. Devils always run from the truth.

[captainamerica]

26 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

I acknowledge that I have some racism but I'm aware of it and it can be separated from my points. And none of what I've wrote has implied that black people's problems are due to their race. This is specifically about cultural factors.

@Raptorsin7 Hi. 

I have been researching this subject recently.

Can you please tell me by what definition or action(s) did you think of in-the-moment that made you write that? If not well-defined then perhaps a sudden flash of thoughts at the moment that made you write that. 

It would help me piece together a few things and get a better understanding. 

Edited December 30, 2021 by captainamerica

[Raptorsin7]

@captainamerica I know what it means to live from conscious presence. So I am grounded in the truth of being. And I act and think from this space.

I wanted to acknowledge his point because its the elephant in the room, I have some racism and it influences my interest in this topic. But that's why I wanted people to engage specifically with my points so we can develop the conversation. But devils will be devils.

I don't really "think" hard about these posts, I just write spontaneously what I believe to be true and what makes sense.

What kind of research are you doing?

Edited December 30, 2021 by Raptorsin7

[Tim R]

Please maintain a discussion free of discriminatory comments, or this thread will get locked.

[captainamerica]

21 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

What kind of research are you doing?

@Raptorsin7 I was inspired by Ray Dalio's work and his Stage Yellow thinking to look for the middle of the road solutions and conversations we can have to resolve our differences. 

I found that there is so much possibility in the middle that it even includes abundant possibilities of collective exponential growth beyond the imagination of most people. This may be counterintuitive. Looking for extreme paths is not needed, in fact, we will reach the limits of Physics before we exhaust our full potential in this manner and are forced to go down some extreme path. It is also clear to me now that 70 percent of the country will rather go with middle-of-the-road solutions despite all the apparent differences and divide created by the media and social media organized narratives as well as eco-chambers. 

Research focuses on understanding and discovering this potential and includes topics of Racism, Feminism, Communism, or Communism disguised under "Socialism", Sane Economics, etc. A wide range of topics also because a holistic understanding is needed even if solutions are required in any one narrow domain at a given point in time. 

There is a wide range of solutions available to us. Like for Wealth Inequality just stoping the reckless printing of money and dealing with the residual effects from the decades of printing money will give the results people want, no communist revolution or extreme (counter-productive) tax policy is needed. Or for at scale addiction recovery of homeless people, there are EEG training protocols that cost like 250-500 USD per person. Education costs can be reduced quite significantly making world-class education avail. to a majority of the population using technology. We are already rapidly solving our Climate Change problems regardless of the narrative by the far-left, in fact with an orange-green spike we will make such progress that is impossible with a Solid Green spike as of today or for the next 100 years. In terms of narratives and ideologies as well it is actually somewhat easy for us to avoid both the extremes of any ideology (like victim shaming or victimhood worshiping) as a society and choose healthier beliefs and narratives, on Social Media it looks like an impossible task but talking to real people gives ample hope about the possibilities in this direction. 

Edited December 31, 2021 by captainamerica

[captainamerica]

20 minutes ago, captainamerica said:

ike for Wealth Inequality just stoping the reckless printing of money and dealing with the residual effects from the decades of printing money will give the results people want, no communist revolution or extreme (counter-productive) tax policy is needed.

Make Saving Money Great Again! 

I am yet to meet a genius who can list all the negative effects and struggles that people in the US are going through because saving money is practically disincentivized.

Edited December 31, 2021 by captainamerica

[snowyowl]

21 minutes ago, captainamerica said:

saving money is practically disincentivized.

Yes, that's the point of having low interest rates. Quantitative easing too. Trying to 'stimulate the economy' ever since the credit crunch recession. Spend don't save! Don't tie up your cash in your savings account, give it to the retailers, spend it on expensive houses or invest in shares. But don't keep cash. 

Then when the economy starts overheating, put up interest rates to encourage the opposite behaviour and keep inflation within targets. 

Trouble is many folks don't plan their finances long-term, don't have enough in savings or pension investments, and get trapped into debt and living hand to mouth, from one paycheck to the next (if you even have a decent job). We need less income disparity, more financial education, and more encouragement of things like prudent living and self-reliance. How to break our dependency on the big corporations and consumer society for everything. 

Edited December 31, 2021 by snowyowl

[Scholar]

On 30.12.2021 at 2:48 AM, Raptorsin7 said:

This is something I've been reflecting on recently and I'm curious to hear thoughts. This is not a strong view, so I'm very open to honest criticism and alternative views, but please engage specifically with the topic.

Basically, due to a push for gender equality and racial equality many black woman have been vaulted into positions of authority in education, corporations etc. Companies are incentivized to hire POC woman more than just POC men.

So you end up with a large number of successful black woman, who now have difficulties finding partners and husbands because men do not value a womans economic position in the way woman do.

But if the position was reversed, and black men were given access to these positions preferentially over black women it would lead to more successful relationships in the black community because men do not have nearly as big of an issue with partnering with a woman of lower socio economic status.

It seems clear that black America would be much better off if affirmative action was way more targeted towards men so it could enhance the formation of productive black families. Instead they empowered their woman without taking into account the differences in how men and woman pick partners and start families 

I don't think what you suggests is politically viable or even practical. Another solution here could be to change social norms, or be patient and watch them adapt. Women and men will have to change how they pick their partners, as the world is changing.

 

And I don't see how this problem is unique to Black People, is that not happening in pretty much all demographics?

Edited December 31, 2021 by Scholar

[Ulax]

@Raptorsin7 Women in contemproary society have that issue. Not women.

[captainamerica]

 

2 hours ago, snowyowl said:

Yes, that's the point of having low interest rates. Quantitative easing too. Trying to 'stimulate the economy' ever since the credit crunch recession. Spend don't save! Don't tie up your cash in your savings account, give it to the retailers, spend it on expensive houses or invest in shares. But don't keep cash. 

Then when the economy starts overheating, put up interest rates to encourage the opposite behaviour and keep inflation within targets. 

Trouble is many folks don't plan their finances long-term, don't have enough in savings or pension investments, and get trapped into debt and living hand to mouth, from one paycheck to the next (if you even have a decent job). We need less income disparity, more financial education, and more encouragement of things like prudent living and self-reliance. How to break our dependency on the big corporations and consumer society for everything. 

 

[Raptorsin7]

3 hours ago, Scholar said:

I don't think what you suggests is politically viable or even practical. Another solution here could be to change social norms, or be patient and watch them adapt. Women and men will have to change how they pick their partners, as the world is changing.

 

And I don't see how this problem is unique to Black People, is that not happening in pretty much all demographics?

It's not unique to black people, but I just think it's an issue that alternative explanation for some of the issues faced by the community that I don't see brought up in most spaces.

I know it's not feasible but I just thought it was a phenomena worth discussing 

[Terell Kirby]

1 minute ago, Raptorsin7 said:

It's not unique to black people, but I just think it's an issue that alternative explanation for some of the issues faced by the community that I don't see brought up in most spaces.

Could it be that the the severity of issues for African American community, compare to other races, is high because of years of slavery and Jim Crow?

I feel as though you are denying this for some reason. Like I said earlier, the issues are not innate to Black people themselves, but the systemic oppression behind those issues. Whatever cultural issue you can come up with, is influenced by years of oppression.

I am Black, but I would encourage you to make Black friends (one's that specifically don't share your worldview), and make an honest attempt to understand things from their point of view. You are doing yourself a dis-service by not doing this, and will never reach the truth of the matter.

[Raptorsin7]

18 hours ago, Terell Kirby said:

Could it be that the the severity of issues for African American community, compare to other races, is high because of years of slavery and Jim Crow?

I think this is part of it, but I don't think this line of reasoning gives a complete picture nor does it provide the best insight into the best path forward.

18 hours ago, Terell Kirby said:

I feel as though you are denying this for some reason. Like I said earlier, the issues are not innate to Black people themselves, but the systemic oppression behind those issues. Whatever cultural issue you can come up with, is influenced by years of oppression.

 

You may be right, there's likely parts of what you're saying that I am not fully appreciating, but i'm not saying that there are not lingering effects from slavery and the subsequent years that followed.

But I just think it's not true that blaming slavery, jim crow etc for the current issues is a good or productive way to address the issues now. It seems disempowering because it suggests that if you are a black person in the usa now you are where you are because of systemtic issues and so if you want to solve those issues there needs to be structural change and an overhaul to the system, which is seems unrealistic given how slowly politics moves in the USA. 

But if the narrative was more focused on individual choice and responsibilities then people have a fighting chance because they could look at themselves and say what role am I playing in all of this, and what can I do now to move myself forward and make changes. My perception of what you're saying is that you're not almost pushing a victim narrative that allows people to place blame and responsibility outside of themselves, which is what I see a lot when these issues are discussed at least on popular political channels.

18 hours ago, Terell Kirby said:

I am Black, but I would encourage you to make Black friends (one's that specifically don't share your worldview), and make an honest attempt to understand things from their point of view. You are doing yourself a dis-service by not doing this, and will never reach the truth of the matter.

I agree, but part of me is worried that it would just create conflict and there wouldn't be anything productive happening because I can't be fully honest. I've watched a lot of left wing political commentary and I think if I presented ideas like this a typical leftist millennial I would simply get shouted down and shamed for holding my view.

But I can see that this may not be true for every person. It's something to consider in the future for sure.

[Fearless_Bum]

If you focus on shit, then all you'll see walking on the street is dog turds. 

You're seeing all the dog turds and missing out on that awesome weather.

[Raptorsin7]

40 minutes ago, Fearless_Bum said:

If you focus on shit, then all you'll see walking on the street is dog turds. 

You're seeing all the dog turds and missing out on that awesome weather.

Hmm. So could we say to that disenfranchised communities too?

Like if you're a hardcore BLM supporter and you dedicate your life to fighting injustice and combatting the system would it be true to say you're focusing on just the negatives and that's why you're saying injustice at every corner?

 

[Ves]

2 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

I think this is part of it, but I don't think this line of reasoning gives a complete picture nor does it provide the best insight into the best path forward.

I agree that this does not give a complete picture, but I think it is important to acknowledge and plays a large role. You are not purely an individual, nor are you purely determined by the environment. The two are interrelated and so both places seem like valid areas to make changes in.

2 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

But I just think it's not true that blaming slavery, jim crow etc for the current issues is a good or productive way to address the issues now. It seems disempowering because it suggests that if you are a black person in the usa now you are where you are because of systemtic issues and so if you want to solve those issues there needs to be structural change and an overhaul to the system, which is seems unrealistic given how slowly politics moves in the USA. 

But if the narrative was more focused on individual choice and responsibilities then people have a fighting chance because they could look at themselves and say what role am I playing in all of this, and what can I do now to move myself forward and make changes. My perception of what you're saying is that you're not almost pushing a victim narrative that allows people to place blame and responsibility outside of themselves, which is what I see a lot when these issues are discussed at least on popular political channels.

I do agree that from an individual level, analyzing the problem like this is very disempowering since the solutions are not able to be achieved by you alone. However, forming organizations that bring awareness to these topics and try to bring structural change to the US is an important thing to do, because these things play a huge role. Also, these structural and historical things have to be at least acknowledged on the individual scale because it simply provides more information and a clearer picture as to why you're in the current situation.

I don't think I would necessarily agree that the narrative should be more focused on individual choice because individual choice is not a solution that everyone can implement. Moreover, if your goal is to make changes to "Black America", a term that is necessarily a collective grouping of many individuals, it makes sense to examine problems in a collective sense. This means examining histories and structural issues. It feels very odd and ineffective to take a problem that is necessarily collective, even in the phrasing, divide it down to the individual actors, and then try to influence each one of them by giving them general guidelines on how to improve their lives. I'm sure most people have heard these things.

It's like, suppose we made two words. One, we work on the systemic issues directly and in the other we say things like, "stop being single mothers. Aren't you aware that this is bad for many reasons? Also, commit less crimes. This is causing many issues as well. You need to take personal action to fix these problems." The former seems to be more effective since we are trying to work on a collective problem. For a single individual, the latter seems to be more effective, as the systemic issues effects on an individual are more pernicious and abstract.

3 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

I agree, but part of me is worried that it would just create conflict and there wouldn't be anything productive happening because I can't be fully honest. I've watched a lot of left wing political commentary and I think if I presented ideas like this a typical leftist millennial I would simply get shouted down and shamed for holding my view.

But I can see that this may not be true for every person. It's something to consider in the future for sure.

I agree that this may happen, however it depends on the black friends that you make. There are black people who follow, say, Candace owens or Jesse Lee Peterson who would be fully on board with the things you say, since it mimics a lot of their talking points. For this reason, I'm not sure I really like the, "make more black friends," solution, because the implication is really something like, "make more black friends that are reasonably close to my current position." And even if you did this, they would likely respond in a similar way to Terell. I think Terell's goal here is to make you more aware of the black experience or develop a higher level of empathy for black people which will inform your views better. I would need to think about this more.

[Raptorsin7]

@Ves Thanks for your response. Yeah I agree with almost all those points.

I admit my title and framing is unnecessarily provocative so it's likely if you press my view on any given point I will have an approach that tries to include both systematic and individual factors.

I think one of my main issues is a lack of balanced attention on both sides of the issue, especially in left wing thought paradigms.

I think they believe if you acknowledge that individual choice and personal responsibility is a part of the plight of black america then that reaffirms some conservative talking points, so there's a reflexive rejection of those insights out right. Once you acknowledge that individuals have some choice and power in determining their own lot in life then asking questions about why people are making certain choices and how to change those individual choices and beliefs, will necessarily prove some conservative talking points have some truth, which triggers ideological minded people.

 

[Fearless_Bum]

1 hour ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Hmm. So could we say to that disenfranchised communities too?

Like if you're a hardcore BLM supporter and you dedicate your life to fighting injustice and combatting the system would it be true to say you're focusing on just the negatives and that's why you're saying injustice at every corner?

 

@Raptorsin7 yes. All of our political actions are usually born out of fear, which is why we are always in a state of "everything is barely holding on but we are okay! ?". 

It's so simple, just move from a place of Love, but the masochistic-self needs to prove that pain makes gain. So on and on goes the cycle.