Black America Ravaged by Feminism

[Raptorsin7]

This is something I've been reflecting on recently and I'm curious to hear thoughts. This is not a strong view, so I'm very open to honest criticism and alternative views, but please engage specifically with the topic.

Basically, due to a push for gender equality and racial equality many black woman have been vaulted into positions of authority in education, corporations etc. Companies are incentivized to hire POC woman more than just POC men.

So you end up with a large number of successful black woman, who now have difficulties finding partners and husbands because men do not value a womans economic position in the way woman do.

But if the position was reversed, and black men were given access to these positions preferentially over black women it would lead to more successful relationships in the black community because men do not have nearly as big of an issue with partnering with a woman of lower socio economic status.

It seems clear that black America would be much better off if affirmative action was way more targeted towards men so it could enhance the formation of productive black families. Instead they empowered their woman without taking into account the differences in how men and woman pick partners and start families 

[Terell Kirby]

Sounds like you are in favor of a patriarchal society where men are the breadwinners, and where the womens primary purpose is to serve men.

Hate to break it to you, but that is not where society is evolving to. Its an old paradigm and way of being that will perish as new generations blur what we deem “traditional” gender roles and the nuclear family.

Regressive forces cannot stop this, it’s part of nature .. an evolution towards higher consciousness and love.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Terell Kirby

[Raze]

4 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

This is something I've been reflecting on recently and I'm curious to hear thoughts. This is not a strong view, so I'm very open to honest criticism and alternative views, but please engage specifically with the topic.

Basically, due to a push for gender equality and racial equality many black woman have been vaulted into positions of authority in education, corporations etc. Companies are incentivized to hire POC woman more than just POC men.

So you end up with a large number of successful black woman, who now have difficulties finding partners and husbands because men do not value a womans economic position in the way woman do.

But if the position was reversed, and black men were given access to these positions preferentially over black women it would lead to more successful relationships in the black community because men do not have nearly as big of an issue with partnering with a woman of lower socio economic status.

It seems clear that black America would be much better off if affirmative action was way more targeted towards men so it could enhance the formation of productive black families. Instead they empowered their woman without taking into account the differences in how men and woman pick partners and start families 

I don’t think the main cause is affirmative action, it’s probably the welfare state encouraging single motherhood. After the major welfare increases the rate of out of wedlock birth rate also increased.

3 hours ago, Terell Kirby said:

Sounds like you are in favor of a patriarchal society where men are the breadwinners, and where the womens primary purpose is to serve men.

Hate to break it to you, but that is not where society is evolving to. Its an old paradigm and way of being that will perish as new generations blur what we deem “traditional” gender roles and the nuclear family.

Regressive forces cannot stop this, it’s part of nature .. an evolution towards higher consciousness and love.

Not remotely this simple. There have been plenty of regressions in history. In order for advancement to happen there has to be a solid base built by stage blue and stage orange values, the African American community is massively lacking this because of the weak family structure.

[Terell Kirby]

3 minutes ago, Raze said:

In order for advancement to happen there has to be a solid base built by stage blue and stage orange values, the African American community is massively lacking this because of the weak family structure.

Weak family structures are often the result of systemic racism caused by toxic/regressive elements of stage blue and orange, through years of oppression of minorities in the U.S. 

Slavery, Jim Crow, the war on drugs and racial wealth gap disparities are but a few examples. Be careful in thinking that there are innate moral issues with an entire race of people, without seeing the system elements behind it.

Going too far with this kind of disposition gets you into racist territory.

[Raze]

5 hours ago, Terell Kirby said:

Weak family structures are often the result of systemic racism caused by toxic/regressive elements of stage blue and orange, through years of oppression of minorities in the U.S. 

Slavery, Jim Crow, the war on drugs and racial wealth gap disparities are but a few examples. Be careful in thinking that there are innate moral issues with an entire race of people, without seeing the system elements behind it.

Going too far with this kind of disposition gets you into racist territory.

Some of the family issues were caused by oppression and racism. However that can’t be blamed for all or even the majority, because in many ways it’s gotten significantly worse, even though racism and oppression has reduced.

I’m not saying their are moral issues with a group of people, they are reacting the same way and in the same patterns anyone would in the same situation.

 

[Terell Kirby]

12 minutes ago, Raze said:

Some of the family issues were caused by oppression and racism. However that can’t be blamed for all or even the majority, because in many ways it’s gotten significantly worse, even though racism and oppression has reduced.

Wouldn't the above statement imply that African Americans and their culture are to blame for this "worsening" ? (in actuality, Blacks are more successful and prospering than ever .. relative to the previous centuries in the history of the United States).

I am curious to what your reasoning is behind such a statement.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Terell Kirby

[Raze]

4 hours ago, Terell Kirby said:

Wouldn't the above statement imply that African Americans and their culture are to blame for this "worsening" ? (in actuality, Blacks are more successful and prospering than ever .. relative to the previous centuries in the history of the United States).

I am curious to what your reasoning is behind such a statement.

I don’t understand what you mean. I’m saying oppression and racism caused some of the problems, but other problems are caused by unintended effects of the welfare state and more modern issues. Where does that say they are inherently to blame, as opposed to the blame being effects of larger societal factors? 

I realize they are doing better in many ways, but in some areas it is declining. For example the rate of out of wedlock births has swelled to 70 percent, which correlated to a high rate of single motherhood, which also correlates to crime. Currently the crime rate among African American’s is abnormally high compared to other demographics.

The racial wealth gap is also large and widening. https://www.brookings.edu/blog/up-front/2020/02/27/examining-the-black-white-wealth-gap/

There is also a large amount of prime working age males who are out of the workforce and not looking for work, and they are disproportionally black, and this is bad for the economy and their health for various reasons.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Raze

[Raptorsin7]

1 hour ago, Terell Kirby said:

in actuality, Blacks are more successful and prospering than ever

By what metrics are Blacks as a group more successful and prospering then ever? 

Single motherhood, incarceration rates, violence and incarceration, wealth gap, etc. It seems like most of the metrics by which you assess the strength of a community show Black America is worse off now than any time since the end of slavery.

4 hours ago, Terell Kirby said:

Sounds like you are in favor of a patriarchal society where men are the breadwinners, and where the womens primary purpose is to serve men.

I would argue this for Black America as they transition to stage blue. But I would not say this is necessary across the board for all groups. Men are better able to compete and succeed than woman, especially at any spiral stage below Yellow. 

A stage blue/red matriarchy will never be able to succeed and compete against groups that are predominantly a patriarchy. Hence why if you look at a group like Sikh's in Europe/North America they are one of the most successful groups across every relevant metric. 

Edited December 30, 2021 by Raptorsin7

[Raptorsin7]

3 hours ago, Raze said:

I don’t think the main cause is affirmative action, it’s probably the welfare state encouraging single motherhood. After the major welfare increases the rate of out of wedlock birth rate also increased.

I didn't mean to imply that affirmative action is the cause of the dysfunction. I meant that the push for gender equality and prioritizing putting Black females in positions of power has actually had a negative effect on the community, and it would have been wiser to give those privilege's primarily to Black men.  

[Terell Kirby]

6 hours ago, Raze said:

I’m saying oppression and racism caused some of the problems, but other problems are caused by unintended effects of the welfare state and more modern issues.

Capitalism and systemic racism has been the root of many problems in the African American community, as well as other minority groups. The “welfare state”, backed by government, has done more for these communities with various federal assistance programs, not to mention voting rights, affirmative action, etc. I don’t see how any of this hurts Blacks in any significant way. What you are talking about is a basic conservative talking point that has no depth to it.

Even the use of the term “welfare state” says you have some kind of bias against socialism, making you a pro capitalist. I am not saying one is better than the other, but to think more systemically about the issues. Capitalism in the U.S. needs reform through increased regulation to fight corruption of all kinds.

6 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Men are better able to compete and succeed than woman, especially at any spiral stage below Yellow. . 

You should really do a deep study into misogyny, to see if it resonates with you.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Terell Kirby

[mandyjw]

Oprah was not "given" power. Then her influence made Obama and Eckhart Tolle well known. Empowered women empower men AND women, which empowers more women and men, which... ya know? No one has to lose out. No one is "ravaged" or made less than by the success of another. 

 

[Boethius]

11 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

It seems clear that black America would be much better off if affirmative action was way more targeted towards men so it could enhance the formation of productive black families. Instead they empowered their woman without taking into account the differences in how men and woman pick partners and start families 

Who said the purpose of affirmative action, in the first place, is to improve the "condition" of the Black community? I'm not convinced that companies, politicians, or academics are thinking that affirmative action is going to "equalize" the Black community with the dominant white community, let's say. Most of the decision-makers involved are white people, after all, who probably don't have a refined understanding of the needs of the Black community.

Instead, it seems to me that most institutions are primarily interested in increasing the representation of people who have been historically marginalized and oppressed, not least of all because it makes these institutions look progressive, equitable, and inclusive. Following this goal, it makes sense that  institutions would elevate Black women into positions of power over Black men since Black women suffer a larger number of intersecting oppressions.

I will say that it would be very interesting to see whether Black Americans generally feel that affirmative action has helped their community. It could be that your criticism (as I am reading it) of affirmative action is more widely shared.

[Raptorsin7]

1 hour ago, mandyjw said:

Oprah was not "given" power. Then her influence made Obama and Eckhart Tolle well known. Empowered women empower men AND women, which empowers more women and men, which... ya know? No one has to lose out. No one is "ravaged" or made less than by the success of another. 

 

Can you address my topic please. You didn't even acknowledge or address the points I made 

[Raptorsin7]

@Terell Kirby One of the main reasons the Black Community is at the bottom is due to rampant single mother households. Woman leading families and communities is a disaster for society.

Virtually every other group of people has figured this out, and until black America addresses that root issue they will continue to regress and suffer.

 

[mandyjw]

I love you, but your points are very racist, sexist, demeaning and disempowered for literally everyone. I don't care to address things like that as if I agree and also assume that they are true, I instead prefer to introduce another perspective. You might think that the shoe fits if you're used to wearing shoes that pinch, until you try on a pair that does fit. 

[vizual]

Positive discrimination is discrimination, period. Put people in power and positions with responsibility because they have the competence and skillset to handle it, not because they are of a certain gender or skin color. Because if you don't, it's like pushing down on a water filled balloon, you may suppress the water in a certain area, but it's going to pop up in another one. By thinking you solved one problem, you are just creating another. The problem now becomes, you don't know where it exactly will create problems.

So engaging in positive discrimination the government is pushing buttons of which they don't know the full societal ramifications of. But they can point to numbers and statistics; 'see guys, we solved discrimination!'. No you didn't, you just moved the problem.

[Terell Kirby]

2 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Virtually every other group of people has figured this out, and until black America addresses that root issue they will continue to regress and suffer.

Seems quite racist. Black America is not regressing, but you seem to prefer to think that way to make you feel better about yourself. You need serious help.

[Raptorsin7]

@mandyjw What you are expressing isn't love or truth.

You have a huge spiritual ego and huge shadow that has not changed in years of you posting on this forum. 

 

[Raptorsin7]

11 minutes ago, Terell Kirby said:

Seems quite racist. Black America is not regressing, but you seem to prefer to think that way to make you feel better about yourself. You need serious help.

Look at the crime rates, single motherhood, wealth gap with and without of the community. How are all these metrics worse now than in the past for the community?

I acknowledge that I have some racism but I'm aware of it and it can be separated from my points. And none of what I've wrote has implied that black people's problems are due to their race. This is specifically about cultural factors.

You need to learn what it means to be honest 

[Terell Kirby]

1 minute ago, Raptorsin7 said:

I acknowledge that I have some racism but I'm aware of it and it can be separated from my points.

At least you’re an honest racist. I wish more racist humans would let it be known. All of your points are being influenced by your racism, you are deluding yourself by thinking otherwise. You are debating from emotions, not truth.

3 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

And none of what I've wrote has implied that black people's problems are due to their race. This is specifically about cultural factors.

Your racist sentiments is influencing how you perceive Black culture.

4 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

You need to learn what it means to be honest 

How about you learn to not be racist in 2022. It’s quite hard to live as a racist and misogynist in the 21st century. Do yourself a favor and seek therapy and counseling to resolve your self-hate, which you project into black people and women.