Changing therapists, what to look for?

[StarStruck]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

Therapy isn’t confusing. It’s for expression. Therapy is experienced as confusing, like any other relationship, by trying to make people do anything. Doubly confusing, if the trying to make people do anything is really, so you can feel better. Doubly, as in, expressing in therapy is the very means to feeling better. Therapy isn’t about the therapist understanding you, it’s more about you understanding yourself, so to speak. 

There has never been and never will be one understood by their parents. It’s impossible. 

Ok. But what you do you mean with the lady paragraph? I know people who see eye to eye with their parents and they feel totally understood. 

[Nahm]

50 minutes ago, StarStruck said:

Ok. But what you do you mean with the lady paragraph?

Not sure what you are talking about there. 

Quote

I know people who see eye to eye with their parents and they feel totally understood. 

But you don’t know that. You think or belief that. You don’t really know.   They might think or believe that, but there is no actual direct experience of it.

Nonetheless, that’s a great orientation though. It sheds light on what you really want, which is not to be understood, but the feeling of being understood. 

You could inspect that. Is there a ‘feeling of being understood’, or is there the thought of being understood, which feels good? 

That ‘seeing eye to eye’ very likely involved expressing, and not expecting. 

[StarStruck]

@Nahm I meant last paragraph. Not lady paragraph. 

I have never thought about the difference between the feeling and thought of being understood. 

Being understood feels great but that is not why I go to therapy. I also want the therapist to understand me on a mental level and help me out.  

My current therapist showed me a lot of compassion but she didn't understand me mentally and didn't help me out. Although her showing compassion did help me somewhat. I have to give her that. 

Edited December 29, 2021 by StarStruck

[soos_mite_ah]

On 12/28/2021 at 3:14 PM, StarStruck said:

When looking back at my therapy with her I came to the conclusion that she really didn't help me. I helped myself. I read the books, did the work, did the journaling and meditation. She was only there to give me mental and emotional support which I don't take for granted. It was definitely something I didn't have and something that I needed.

The majority of the work you put in yourself is outside of the therapist's office. There are things you need to do in between sessions in order to actually see progress. They aren't going to do the work for you or walk the path for you but they will be a good guide that will make you question your biases to make sure you're staying on the right path. 

On 12/28/2021 at 3:14 PM, StarStruck said:

She has her credentials: bachelor, master and PHD. And I was shocked how uneducated she was. She didn't knew anything about Freud or Jung. Why? Because her teachers never asked her to study the topics. Why did she even study psychology for almost a decade? All she does is ask me how I feel about things. I never caught her giving me ground breaking advice or any advice really. 

Freud and Jung aren't the only people who are impactful in the field of psychology. Not only that but on top of that, a lot of Freud's work as been critiqued and disproven by additional studies so he isn't exactly what a lot of people see as a credible source. People who study psychology have much more important and broader topics they need to cover instead of just studying the work of Freud an Jung. 

Also, I was about to type out a whole nother paragraph but someone already beat me to it lol. I agree with the below especially the stuff that is bolded. 

8 hours ago, tsuki said:

The premise of therapy is that you are discovering yourself, and the role of the therapist is to facilitate this discovery. A therapist is not supposed to tell you what to do, or give you insight into the mechanics of psychology. She is supposed to facilitate your self-discovery by being open, receptive and supportive. It is a person that is well-versed in her own self-discovery and is willing to sit by while you do this yourself, and learn alongside you. The benefit comes from the difference in experience. Good psychotherapist can interpret your whole-body reactions while you share yourself, and spot lies, inconsistencies, wounds, and other things that are not apparent to you. Some of them are hidden from you because you are conditioned to avoid them, or because you don't have the language to name them, or awareness to notice them. She does this to listening to her own feelings in reaction to what you are saying.

Psychotherapist is not supposed to talk about psychoanalytical knowledge with you, discuss Freud, Jung, or philosophy. This is a distraction and a defense mechanism. If this is what you are doing in therapy, then you are avoiding doing the real work.

[Thought Art]

@StarStruck I'd say, simply use this as a chance to shop around for the next 5-10 sessions and don't settle right away. Once you have tried a few out, then maybe select the one you resonate both with.

You want a high level therapist for sure. Not exactly sure how to find them, but I am sure they exist out there.

Most of my therapists I've worked with was basically just someone to talk to and get things off my chest.

Like talking to dry wall but more helpful.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Thought Art

[hyruga]

You don't need a therapist. 

The fast way for you to grow is you turn the tables. You become the therapist and she becomes your patient. Lol the end.

[Thought Art]

@hyruga stahp 

[Nahm]

@StarStruck

I was too one sided in my responses to you on this thread, sorry about that. This morning I was reminded jut how sleepy some, many, probably most therapists are. 

[Lyubov]

I wouldn’t say most therapists are unconscious or in a “blind leading the blind” sort of situation. I think it’s 50/50 from my own experience. I would say relationship aspects come into play as well kinda like how different people get along better with different people. For me I’ve had sessions with therapists I didn’t jive with at all and some that helped a tremendous amount, helped me transform into a different person.

I would say just keep an open mind and keep looking. You can feel out a few different therapists and decide on one after meeting with a few. You can bring some questions you want to ask them and get an idea for how accepting and open minded they are. For me I look for a therapist that gives me signs of high emotional intelligence and isn’t trying to push or “teach.” I prefer a more hands off approach because I realize such a person isn’t there to be my parent or teach me how to live my life. I also take into account that the therapist is human too and has their own strengths and weaknesses. Some topics the therapist can handle better than others. I look for a therapist I feel safe around disclosing everything to and if they are a good communicator, so they subtly communicate with judgement or do they have a strong grasp on how shame works and are very careful and compassionate. I basically look for a therapist that feels emotionally strong to me, safe to talk to, open minded and is not shaming. 
 

The one I’ve seen that helped a lot really facilitated for me letting go of a lot of shame and negative beliefs about myself formed from past experiences.  How to handle OCD mind symptoms usually through expressing and talking about what lies behind them. From my experience obsessive/compulsive thought experiences usually have a deeper fear or trauma bellow them. The obsessive thoughts is sort of a very crude and unconsciously constructed defense mechanism to the stuff bellow it. When the defenses are safely let down and the stuff behind the obsessive thoughts is explored, a tremendous amount of mind clarity, grounding and a sense of embodiment with the present moment returns, kinda like leaving a self imposed prison for presences and well-being. It can be scary to leave this stuff sometimes because it’s familiar and there can be lots of defense mechanisms that can’t be just forcefully disarmed but slowly unraveled.

I can relate to what you are saying about the obsessive mind. I struggled with that for years but really healed and brought back a tremendous amount of clarity and shame free self esteem and grounding/embodiment through therapy so I do proclaim that I think it’s probably the best treatment for a person really wrapped deeply in shame and strong negative self beliefs and trauma. It’s not something I’ve seen many people handle or heal on their own. Many people who say otherwise can’t appreciate just how entangled things can get. When you have a broken leg you need a surgeon to help you realign it. When you have a cut you can take a bandaid from cabinet.  It took thousands of people to build beautiful buildings. Your emotional well-being is similar. We are all in this together and getting help and support for something you have problems doing on your own is not a problem. You may even find yourself stronger and more mentally healthy letting go of the heavy self responsibility to do it on your own and open up more where real change and healing can take place. 

[Jacob Morres]

You can definietely find therapists that fit these needs 

Just a thought but maybe a therapist that has training in life coaching. Especially since your goal you said to self actualize 

I'd suggest to read people's bios and get a sense of people's style and see if it's a fit (through reading bios, speaking with them (consultation), or doing a session)

 

Edited January 1, 2022 by Jacob Morres

[StarStruck]

18 hours ago, Nahm said:

@StarStruck

I was too one sided in my responses to you on this thread, sorry about that. This morning I was reminded jut how sleepy some, many, probably most therapists are. 

No problem. I agree with @Lyubov . Therapists are there for my  self reflection and to establish my own axis mundi. Last year I had wrong expectations about therapy. I believed it was a magic pill but it is not.

16 hours ago, Lyubov said:

The one I’ve seen that helped a lot really facilitated for me letting go of a lot of shame and negative beliefs about myself formed from past experiences.  How to handle OCD mind symptoms usually through expressing and talking about what lies behind them. From my experience obsessive/compulsive thought experiences usually have a deeper fear or trauma bellow them. The obsessive thoughts is sort of a very crude and unconsciously constructed defense mechanism to the stuff bellow it. When the defenses are safely let down and the stuff behind the obsessive thoughts is explored, a tremendous amount of mind clarity, grounding and a sense of embodiment with the present moment returns, kinda like leaving a self imposed prison for presences and well-being. It can be scary to leave this stuff sometimes because it’s familiar and there can be lots of defense mechanisms that can’t be just forcefully disarmed but slowly unraveled.

I can relate to what you are saying about the obsessive mind. I struggled with that for years but really healed and brought back a tremendous amount of clarity and shame free self esteem and grounding/embodiment through therapy so I do proclaim that I think it’s probably the best treatment for a person really wrapped deeply in shame and strong negative self beliefs and trauma. It’s not something I’ve seen many people handle or heal on their own. Many people who say otherwise can’t appreciate just how entangled things can get. When you have a broken leg you need a surgeon to help you realign it. When you have a cut you can take a bandaid from cabinet.  It took thousands of people to build beautiful buildings. Your emotional well-being is similar. We are all in this together and getting help and support for something you have problems doing on your own is not a problem. You may even find yourself stronger and more mentally healthy letting go of the heavy self responsibility to do it on your own and open up more where real change and healing can take place. 

In the book "a mind for numbers" they talk about focused attention and defuse attention. Those two concepts helped me to be somewhat less OCD but I still have it because it is so ingrained. I loved to intellectualize and miss the broader perspective. It is a learning problem for me across the board in my professional and personal life.

I use this intellectualism as a harness. It prevents me from breaking into my emotional repression barrier and everything becomes dull and stale. This obviously is a big problem when dating but in therapy I'm doing the same. They call this emotional impotence or emotional flatland.

It just need somebody who understands these topics. My current therapist just didn't have clue. She doesn't address it and just do her thing (procedures). I guess I just have to keep trying it with different therapists. She was my first therapist so I was kind of emotionally depended on her.

On 29-12-2021 at 11:46 PM, soos_mite_ah said:

The majority of the work you put in yourself is outside of the therapist's office. There are things you need to do in between sessions in order to actually see progress. They aren't going to do the work for you or walk the path for you but they will be a good guide that will make you question your biases to make sure you're staying on the right path. 

Freud and Jung aren't the only people who are impactful in the field of psychology. Not only that but on top of that, a lot of Freud's work as been critiqued and disproven by additional studies so he isn't exactly what a lot of people see as a credible source. People who study psychology have much more important and broader topics they need to cover instead of just studying the work of Freud an Jung. 

Also, I was about to type out a whole nother paragraph but someone already beat me to it lol. I agree with the below especially the stuff that is bolded. 

I know the therapy office isn't a lecture about Freud and Jung. I just can't help myself.  By the way, those are not the only books I read. I mostly read up-to-date books on depth psychology.

[Ulax]

@StarStruck Brother I'd jump straight onto the IFS modality. Its the real fucking deal. And i know you're a hard hitting mf. I reckon you'll dig it.

[Lyubov]

7 hours ago, StarStruck said:

No problem. I agree with @Lyubov . Therapists are there for my  self reflection and to establish my own axis mundi. Last year I had wrong expectations about therapy. I believed it was a magic pill but it is not.

In the book "a mind for numbers" they talk about focused attention and defuse attention. Those two concepts helped me to be somewhat less OCD but I still have it because it is so ingrained. I loved to intellectualize and miss the broader perspective. It is a learning problem for me across the board in my professional and personal life.

I use this intellectualism as a harness. It prevents me from breaking into my emotional repression barrier and everything becomes dull and stale. This obviously is a big problem when dating but in therapy I'm doing the same. They call this emotional impotence or emotional flatland.

It just need somebody who understands these topics. My current therapist just didn't have clue. She doesn't address it and just do her thing (procedures). I guess I just have to keep trying it with different therapists. She was my first therapist so I was kind of emotionally depended on her.

I can relate to this experience. It seems from reading this you feel like you are misunderstood by them and you don’t feel like they are trying to understand you. You then sort of feel closed off and don’t feel like being emotionally open. Perhaps this is one aspect to it, you know if there are other layers to it but from what I read here this kinda sounds like one of them. It feels a bit unsafe and/or can feel like talking to a dog that doesn’t understand a word you’re saying and is running through the procedures. In this case I would just look for a person you “click” with. You know what I mean? You know how some people you just get along with cause you feel sort of aligned with their world view or their energy, conditions feel different, etc, whatever. Look around so to speak and open up when you feel safe and like you can trust this person. For me it becomes quickly apparent if I can work with someone after a couple sessions so just give it a bit of time. Write down your values and world views and look for a therapist that seems to hold similar stuff. I like therapists that are spiritually informed, have experience with psychedelics but also aren’t too deep into new agey stuff or are too overly esoteric when handling spiritual concepts in the sessions or pushing anything too much. Just compassion, openness, a willingness to understand, no judgment and a strong sense of containment and integrity. 

Edited January 1, 2022 by Lyubov

[ZenSwift]

I just asked my mom that's a therapist:

The strongest indicator for successful outcome with a therapist is a strong emotional connection with your therapist. Feeling heard, and building trust, and not feeling judged are essential. 

Your therapists ability to connect is outside of designations. It cannot be taught easily. It's an implicit skillset.