How do you get an idea of where you are at on this path?

[Cathal]

no enlightened beings just enlightened action

so how has your actions differed?

that is all there is to it, you might have filled ur head up with so much spiritual shit but what do you actually do differently? that is the real measure

[gettoefl]

what bernadette roberts says is:

1. have to get to the blissful zero point, your center, the god spot, this is contemplation and meditation

2. then go back to the market place and love like your life depends on it

3. this leads to end of ego which is no self which is the end of the dream since god no longer has someone to work through

[Nahm]

13 hours ago, Loba said:

How do you get an idea of where you are at on this path?

By how you feel, not by ideas, not by comparative thinking. 

Quote

I had some insights and experiences recently around spirits, reincarnation, plant medicine and the Buddhist wheel - so that would make me new to Buddhism.

I am not looking for enlightenment, I find the other stuff more interesting.  If I get it, I get it, if I don't in this life, I am okay with that.

You are seeking. It feels better to be earnest about this. 

Quote

But what I want to know, is when communicating with someone, what is a good way to determine how far we each have gotten?  I don't like the idea of talking like I know more than I do to someone; what is a good measurement?  Surely there must be something. 

You are already doing that. It feels discordant until you acknowledge it, then it’s aligned. 

Quote

I'm more into shamanism, so, for me, it won't be enlightenment or present awareness that I would be adept at, but traversing spiritual planes of existence I can do very well; albeit, always room for improvement.

That is aversion via spiritual ego. It’s focusing on concepts to maintain being ‘the one who is adept at traversing’ (traversing, concepts). 

Quote

I'm at the point where I know more than I thought about myself, but certainly not much, still, when compared to how much there is to understand about reality.

This is thought attachment, believing thoughts, believing you are the knower (spiritual ego). That uninspected belief leads to the second belief of the separate self, the ‘understander’…  the belief that there is a you & a reality (belief in separation), which you could understand. 

Quote

So now I have no idea; I over-humbled myself and don't want to over-do what I "think" I know, either, as that's a recipe for not learning anything new.

It is not possible to over humble yourself. Much conjecture & group think at play here. The blind leading the blind into pride, vanity & arrogance, via thought attachment 

 

[Loba]

20 minutes ago, Nahm said:

By how you feel, not by ideas, not by comparative thinking. 

I guess I feel excited, interested and intrigued.

You are seeking. It feels better to be earnest about this. 

I suppose, but I am not seeking in a way as well.  I am more interested in the weird and wacky stuff that happens then the more quiet aspects of ego death;  so I feel as though, because I don't put my all into spiritual seeking - enlightenment wise - that is would be more earnest to say that I am not seeking it as opposed to actually seeking - as there are people who are much more rigorous about it than I am.

You are already doing that. It feels discordant until you acknowledge it, then it’s aligned. 

That is aversion via spiritual ego. It’s focusing on concepts to maintain being ‘the one who is adept at traversing’ (traversing, concepts). 

I am confused.  Have you done shamanic journeying before?  Maybe I am not reading what you wrote properly - it doesn't feel like aversion, it feels like going inwards.  Like an extactic union, how Leo mentions it.  I use something called a "sonic driver" to get into those states of being.

This is thought attachment, believing thoughts, believing you are the knower (spiritual ego). That uninspected belief leads to the second belief of the separate self, the ‘understander’…  the belief that there is a you & a reality (belief in separation), which you could understand. 

It is not possible to over humble yourself. Much conjecture & group think at play here. The blind leading the blind into pride, vanity & arrogance, via thought attachment 

What I mean is, in order not to get ahead of myself, I made assumptions that I was not far along at all, and put myself down in order to keep from ... I guess, the possibility of being more adept.  I think because with that comes the responsibility of what I am doing now, which is that one needs to have a good assessment of their progress so they don't get into a Dunning Kruger state.
Where is the group think and play here, I'm trying to look into myself and I don't see it.
I do understand what you mean by there being no way to over-humble yourself, as that seems to work in bringing a person closer to awakening - so I rewrote what I said above in order to try to explain a bit better.

 

[RMQualtrough]

You do realize, that you could sit around shooting up heroin every day, and you're never NOT going to be "existence itself".

You can't NOT be no matter whether you want to be or not...

The aftermath of a high dose breakthrough was very bizarre for me. I am very glad it faded. I think it probably always does... I've heard Rupert Spira say that happens, like a cloudy day, the clear sky is still there.

[Loba]

@gettoefl That is really good advice, thank you!

@Salvijus I feel like my actions are still bound by ego, and not Love as of yet, but is getting there more and more.  So there is still a way to go.

@catcat69123 I am more compassionate, thoughtful, artistic, get along better with my family.  But not empty.

 

 

[Nahm]

12 minutes ago, Loba said:

I suppose, but I am not seeking in a way as well.  I am more interested in the weird and wacky stuff that happens then the more quiet aspects of ego death;  so I feel as though, because I don't put my all into spiritual seeking - enlightenment wise - that is would be more earnest to say that I am not seeking it as opposed to actually seeking - as there are people who are much more rigorous about it than I am.

That is comparative thinking. The group think conjecture is ego death. You believe that. You never experience either. 

13 minutes ago, Loba said:

I am confused.  Have you done shamanic journeying before?  Maybe I am not reading what you wrote properly - it doesn't feel like aversion, it feels like going inwards.  Like an extactic union, how Leo mentions it.  I use something called a "sonic driver" to get into those states of being.

The confusion lies in state chasing, the belief you are in a state and there is another one which you could get to. Also group think, and conjecture. 

14 minutes ago, Loba said:

What I mean is, in order not to get ahead of myself, I made assumptions that I was not far along at all, and put myself down in order to keep from ... I guess, the possibility of being more adept.  I think because with that comes the responsibility of what I am doing now, which is that one needs to have a good assessment of their progress so they don't get into a Dunning Kruger state.
Where is the group think and play here, I'm trying to look into myself and I don't see it.
I do understand what you mean by there being no way to over-humble yourself, as that seems to work in bringing a person closer to awakening - so I rewrote what I said above in order to try to explain a bit better.

Instead of assuming, conjecture, state chasing, putting yourself down, etc, inspect. 

[roopepa]

2 hours ago, Nahm said:

You are seeking. It feels better to be earnest about this. 

I don't like the idea of spiritual seeking. Or actually it's okay, but I don't like the thought of seeking truth.

I don't like the word 'truth' at all. It makes me anxious. Probably it's due to some kind of misunderstanding.

Like you should give it all up for truth. Like it's some kind of a losing game. Like you should choose truth above all else. This just makes me want to run away, fast. I feel adrenaline in my legs, they say NO

I have no idea how some people are supposedly able to do that. The Jed McKennas and Thoreaus of the world. Yikes.

Ryōkan I get. That's what I want:

" Too lazy to be ambitious,
I let the world take care of itself.
Ten days' worth of rice in my bag;
a bundle of twigs by the fireplace.
Why chatter about delusion and enlightenment?
Listening to the night rain on my roof,
I sit comfortably, with both legs stretched out. "

Truth, blah. I just want home. They're probably the same thing. But if they're not, fuck truth for not being home.

[softlyblossoming]

Personally, here is my best guess:

• How happy we are
• How happy we can be for no reason
• How deeply/fully we can feel our emotions / how in touch we are with them
• How quickly we can go from stressed to relaxed, how long we can stay relaxed, and how relaxed we can make ourself (with our own mind)
• How ethically we act

Thanks, I enjoyed reading everyone replies. I hope everyone reading has a great day!

[BipolarGrowth]

I recommend reading Mastering the Core Teachings of the Buddha by Daniel Ingram for getting an idea of where you’re at. He has some phenomenologically-precise ways for gauging such things. You can read the whole book for free online here: https://www.mctb.org/mctb2/

Another thing I would recommend is speaking to masters directly. I’ve spoken to both Daniel Ingram and Dhammarato for free. They are both quite available if you’re interested. Send me a PM if you want details on that. I’m also happy to chat with you sometime. Dhammarato has online sangha video/voice calls on Skype multiple times per week for his UK and US sangha groups. 

[Zeroguy]

• Level 4

[Nahm]

3 hours ago, roopepa said:

same thing

?