After the club - When I have the number pt.2

[Leo Gura]

19 minutes ago, FlyingLotus said:

But if she keeps saying no no no, you should focus on a different girl or gracefully bow out.

Depends on the emotions behind the no.

Many times a girl is interested but has doubts. This is where objection-handling comes in.

If she is not attracted then obviously move on. The attraction has to be there.

[ValiantSalvatore]

@Leo Gura That is good advice/feedback thanks again.

I can come up with smth. original just finding a girl that was not entrenched in stereotypes like her was so nice. 

It was also late. Close to 7am. Imagine going to a Berlin party... has more game members then Vegas and is cheaper. (Should)

----

@FlyingLotus  It was a weird situation imagine. I still lead afterwards as she said no and indicators of interest where all still there. Dialted pupils, holding hands, touching her hips, followed my lead, kissing was apparently even an option. She also said it with a nice and sweet undertone like she almost can't, yet has to. It sounded to surreal. That is why I persisted and still lead I also wanted to bring them home, because this city can be quite obnoxious.

Imagine the dude that was making out with her friend came back from the club. After seperating from us somehow. With a rowdy bunch of people in a silver mercedes. 3-4 guys polyandry 2.0. Snipping at me subtle cues I already wanted to befriend that guy in the club, but he was just not the brightest. 

Imagine I had close to a perfect setup and this guy is to stupid to follow me thanks to his pride. My lord. I am going to start dating Eve soon. I tapped his shoulder I would have all bought us a drink for fun etc.

Hottest guys in the club are with me surrounded by attractive women. I was super social talking to different people and women and men alike but sometimes...

 

 

Edited December 14, 2021 by ValiantSalvatore

[ValiantSalvatore]

I make it sound more melodramatic then it actually was. But the undertone was rather open and sweet let's say it like that.

[mememe]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Depends on the emotions behind the no.

Many times a girl is interested but has doubts. This is where objection-handling comes in.

If she is not attracted then obviously move on. The attraction has to be there.

this is so much open for interpretation - you need a really good social judgement/empathy (which of course every guy writing in this forum has) the self deception regarding that can be enormous depending on the narcissism/ego factor of a personality. 

Edited December 14, 2021 by mememe

[mememe]

@ValiantSalvatore if in berlin you probably need to be more creative than a drink. ask her to do sth fun.

don’t do the classic pic up stuff, it only works if you don’t have to talk much. superficial does usually not work out for long in berlin, too many options and already difficult to make longterm friends/relationships. also read the atmosphere of the club - it was probably not a dark room. so she robably went there for dancing.

ask her to do sth fun, berlin fun, if she ghosts you afterwards don’t take it personal. people also sometimes hunt for one night experiences.

Edited December 14, 2021 by mememe

[ValiantSalvatore]

@mememe Creativity would not be the issue as well as planning for fun and doing fun things. I lived in two other cities that are bigger by population size/figure.

I just think Berlin parties are freaking crazy as well as I just like electronic music. So plenty of options. As well as having access to psychedelics faster. I have a couple of friends there and been there last year, it would be to good for me dude. If I was fit I'd be to flexible for this city. This felt like my hometwon and it bored me lmao felt like I explored everything in 3 days. 

Besides cycling I could handle some cycling training that shit looks scary.

[ValiantSalvatore]

Just working in a bigger city could help with day game as I am still a total newb to this basically been out two times with knowing what game is.

Edited December 14, 2021 by ValiantSalvatore

[Mada_]

My wing who I regularly go out with, who has had sex with girls in bathroom stalls and on a dance floor (lol), says that "making out with girls is like fools gold, it isn't really a close until you are in bed having sex with her, girls make out will make-out with guys fairly frivolously". 

 

[Leo Gura]

Yes, makeouts are easy to get.

You can go into a busy club and get 5 quick makeouts. But what good does that do you? It's only good for showing you how easy escalation can be and how bold you can be.

Closing is several orders of magnitude harder.

Still. If you've never done a few instant makeouts, it's worth doing just as a learning experience.

See how far you can push it in the club. I have a photo of me walking out of the club with white pussy juice soaking my pant legs.

You can go far

[Lyubov]

Make outs mean less with girls you just met at the bar/club. You should have a very high close rate for girls you made out with on a date, etc. 

[something_else]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

See how far you can push it in the club. I have a photo of me walking out of the club with white pussy juice soaking my pant legs.

Now there's a good tinder pic 

[ValiantSalvatore]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

See how far you can push it in the club. I have a photo of me walking out of the club with white pussy juice soaking my pant legs.

I had to laugh so hard reading this. 

[mememe]

@ValiantSalvatore perfect to ask her to do sth she likes to do in berlin. you could tell her you are still exploring the city. because believe me, if you think you saw it all in 3 days, you did not really see it.

it‘s like the imaginary metaphoric photograph leo probably never took (no one took of him).

try ordering „pussy juice“ at a bar, it will be difficult to get, except for some places.

by the way if you both went for the music, you could equally make it a random club date. (unfortunately its covid time)

Edited December 15, 2021 by mememe

[something_else]

On 13/12/2021 at 6:03 PM, Leo Gura said:

Yes, just ignore whatever happened before and text her afresh like you're setting up a casual date.

As long as she's responsive, she's interested. Be patient and go game other girls while she drags her feet.

You need to have a constant flow of new leads, new numbers, so that you are not invested into any one number. The problem is that you are not getting enough new numbers every week. Which is why you got needy with this girl. If you got 10 new numbers per week you would not care about this girl's feet-dragging. You are investing too much into each girl. They invest nothing in you. This is the crux of the matter.

It worked, she's def still interested. Turns out she was annoyed that I teased her about wearing red or pink if she wanted to drive me crazy and that's what made her bail  lmao. I made a joke about her only being allowed to wear highlighter orange or fluorescent yellow this time around and she asked me where I'm taking her.

Cheers for telling me to message her again @Leo Gura, you just got me a date with a hot girl 

[Leo Gura]

@something_else Tone down your gameyness. Act normal and chill. You don't need to game her any more. Just execute a solid date, build connection, escalate, and LEAD.

With all of your bullshit that she put up with, she is clearly interested in sleeping you with. You just need to not act weird and lead her to a bedroom.

Good luck.

[Ulax]

Nice dude!

I really dislike the use of 'last minute resistance' in general though. Boundaries ought to be respected, particularly with lower self-esteem girls. Otherwise, you're falling into abuse territory. I get it is tough in the moment though.

Sounds like your first meeting was fun, and went well!

I'd send a text which shows your an empathetic/ caring human being, whilst having the boundary that other people's emotions are theirs' to deal with. Something like, 'Hey, was fun hanging with you the other night! I'd be up for a drink soon. What's your schedule like? (Hope your friend was okay in the end btw  )'.

Also, I'd say work on trusting your intuition with these things too. And, also if your mind's eye is developed, imagine the end of the evening as though you were her consciousness, and what the experience was like for her, i.e. what she must have thought when she decided to kiss you, at the end when she went for number instead of letting you in. I usually tend to find it a lot more positive than I'd imagined.

Anyhow, good luck and hope this helps.

[mememe]

38 minutes ago, Ulax said:

i.e. what she must have thought when she decided to kiss you, at the end when she went for number instead of letting you in.

@ValiantSalvatore i‘d also not bet on closing after the next date. depends on what you want or expect of this.

a lot of women won‘t sleep with any guy no matter the hotness scale, before at least the third date. if she invests she‘d expect you to invest as well. (don’t know about that scarcity mode you mentioned before but it sounds like you expect the wrong currency for pay offs)

both of you have fun! is the most important part about it.

[ValiantSalvatore]

@Ulax @mememe
 

6 hours ago, Ulax said:

'Hey, was fun hanging with you the other night! I'd be up for a drink soon. What's your schedule like? (Hope your friend was okay in the end btw  )'.

This might set the nice guy frame. Winks in general are very bad. Also this gives her control. Which can be an issue from what I consumed till now. As you are not leading. You consistently have to say and do let's do this and let's do that. For instance a female friend of mine told me she likes it when I do this. As well as dislikes it that her boyfriend is not leading. I do this with guy friends too because they can't come to a decision often and they just like it when I lead because I take literally everyone every single fking time into consideration till I forget myself. So overall good intentions I don't think this is solid advice. It's well meant. 

6 hours ago, Ulax said:

I'd send a text which shows your an empathetic/ caring human being, whilst having the boundary that other people's emotions are theirs' to deal with.

I basically respected her boundries by not forcing to go with her and obnoxiously nagging and crying etc and needily asking for example. To go with her as would already requires consent from both parties. She basically initiated a kiss at the end and just has more options because she was good looking this was more an opportunity for a fling. She told me she is going to a party next week and I asked her what she is up to because I wanted to setup a date right of the bat. This was her answer.

I do hope this is good content for others to reflect or it might not be. The heavy escalation part ruined it and I ruined the intimacy part at the end. If I had space for both of them I could have just bunkered them at my place. That would have worked pretty sure in hindsight. 

6 hours ago, Ulax said:

Also, I'd say work on trusting your intuition with these things too. And, also if your mind's eye is developed, imagine the end of the evening as though you were her consciousness, and what the experience was like for her, i.e. what she must have thought when she decided to kiss you, at the end when she went for number instead of letting you in. I usually tend to find it a lot more positive than I'd imagined.

Way to conscious advice you missed the entire context. I was drunk she was drunk there was nothing very conscious about the experience at all. 

I appreciate your compassion and empathy!
----

5 hours ago, mememe said:

i‘d also not bet on closing after the next date. depends on what you want or expect of this.

a lot of women won‘t sleep with any guy no matter the hotness scale, before at least the third date. if she invests she‘d expect you to invest as well. (don’t know about that scarcity mode you mentioned before but it sounds like you expect the wrong currency for pay offs)

both of you have fun! is the most important part about it.

Fun is the last issue all dates I had so far basically said it was exciting and fun, yet the connection part is missing. All of them unequivocally. I can get into way to elaborate "bullshit theory" to explain, yet they all had fun. Physical escalation during the day is my main issue as well as this region.

Also, yes! Without quoting. I did not experience Berlin fully I was just out with a friend once and did some sightseeing and meet with another friend during the day for sight seeing. I did not experience the night life at all, it's just compare it 3mill ppl. approxx to 20mil ppl. approx. in Beijing and Shanghai. So, Berlin seemed rather small to me. I lived in Beijing and visited Shanghai.

My friend basically had the option to call some dude for psychedelics they would come by in a car and bring it to you basically a drug delivery service. I have no idea what goes up in the "underground"/night life in Berlin, yet apparently this was an option.  We just went for a beer and kebab.

Edited December 15, 2021 by ValiantSalvatore

[ValiantSalvatore]

Just to set this clear I received 0 response. So the heavy escalation and Leo basically saying I am paraphrasing that she will not meet up. Was true in this case.

 

[mememe]

@ValiantSalvatore didn’t you say you contacted her and she was asking about where you would take her? it sounded like you had a date.

oh sorry - that was @something_else i confused you both for this and the last post. was not expecting a second similar story.

if you have fun, you should go with that flow for a while until it’s basically satisfying for you to having fun without the need of closing. a lot of women really can feel that as a pressure, if it’s too intense it doesn’t matter if they liked your overall appearance (physical and basic vibe) they will opt out because they don’t like to be trophies. you might underestimate how women likewise might have a hunting instinct at dating and don’t really have fun with being a prey for an end result.

Edited December 16, 2021 by mememe