Leo, can you talk more about the 2 directions of spiritual work?

[wildflower]

5 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Everything you're conscious of, everything you experience, is YOU.

Very simple. There's no trickery to it in that sense.

The trickery occurs when you start expecting something outside yourself.

Here let me see if we can get on a level, Im trying to articulate your position fully for others:

Everything in your direct conscious experience is you, the ego/pysche/self is just an arbitrary imposition inside of this bubble on part of the objects of this bubble that is has identified with, based on a paradigm of utility for its ego own survival. This identification is ultimately arbitrary and imaginary

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, wildflower said:

Here let me see if we can get on a level, Im trying to articulate your position fully for others:

There are no others. Only you. You are talking to yourself.

5 minutes ago, wildflower said:

Everything in your direct conscious experience is you, the ego/pysche/self is just an arbitrary imposition inside of this bubble on part of the objects of this bubble that is has identified with, based on a paradigm of utility for its ego own survival. This identification is ultimately arbitrary and imaginary

Yes

But that's only the tip of the iceberg. It's not God-realization.

[Thought Art]

It’s me, but appears to be us. 
 

isn’t it unity through division? 
 

Leo, I don’t yet fully believe it’s just one bubble in a void. But… trips seem to point there.

I’ll grasp it in time. Right now things seem to be possibilities to me and nothing definitive.

not sure how you are using the word ‘you’.

 

there is nothing outside of God, ‘you’

 

But there appears to be a world outside this avatars skull “you” and “you” inner outer you.

Edited December 10, 2021 by Thought Art

[Leo Gura]

@Thought Art Your consciousness is Absolute. That means: if you don't see it, it doesn't exist.

What you see is the totality of reality. Reality begins and ends with you.

You ARE reality.

[Leo Gura]

13 minutes ago, Judy2 said:

@Leo Gura

Yes.

The point i was trying to make is that said identity is not as rigid as usual connotations of the word suggest.

Fluidity itself is the identity, one might say.

I get what you're communicating.

It's fluid because God is an Infinite Identity. It shapeshifts into every possible finite identity, or whatever identity it wants. It can manifest an infinite number of different human identities. It can even manifest an infinite number of different Judy identities. Judy1, Judy2, Judy3, etc

[Thought Art]

9 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Thought Art Your consciousness is Absolute. That means: if you don't see it, it doesn't exist.

What you see is the totality of reality. Reality begins and ends with you.

You ARE reality.

So, their being a planet, other people, etc is just a back story for the present moment?

[Leo Gura]

11 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

So, their being a planet, other people, etc is just a back story for the present moment?

Of course.

You are even imagining sleep.

Your imagination has no limits and it manifests as "physical reality".

You are imagining entire classes of objects like atoms, microbes, animals, dinosaurs, planets, history, future, humans, etc.

You can imagine having a dog in childhood, and this will be indistinguishable to you from actually having had a childhood. You will actually start to believe you had a childhood. But your entire childhood is imaginary.

[wildflower]

9 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Of course.

You are even imagining sleep.

Your imagination has no limits and it manifests as "physical reality".

You are imagining entire classes of objects like atoms, microbes, animals, dinosaurs, planets, history, future, humans, etc.

You can imagining have a dog in childhood, and this will be indistinguishable to you from actually having had a childhood.

That's why Buddhism is the best system of embodiment, as it literally systematically trains no-self, no identity, renunciation etc

 

[Shin]

Just now, wildflower said:

That's why Buddhism is the best system of embodiment, as it literally systematically trains no-self, no identity, renunciation etc

 

Yeah but no.

It trains to disconnect from everything, as if you were something outside of everything else.

That's just a coping mechanism, Buddhism is a coping mechanism !

[Leo Gura]

12 minutes ago, wildflower said:

That's why Buddhism is the best system of embodiment, as it literally systematically trains no-self, no identity, renunciation etc

If this was true then I would not have met so many deluded and clueless Buddhists.

The best Buddhist teachers still don't realize God. You have no hope as a Buddhist student. You will waste 40 years and still not know God. But by that point you will have been so brainwashed with Buddhist dogma that you will think you're enlightened.

Buddhism is a hallucination within the mind of God. It's a huge fucking trap.

[wildflower]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

If this was true then I would not have met so many deluded and clueless Buddhists.

The best Buddhist teachers still don't realize God. You have no hope as a Buddhist student.

It's not a Buddhist student, is a student of training to embodying and becoming Nothingness (which is Infinity which is God), this is what the Buddha taught, you know the destination now, when do you start the journey boss?

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, wildflower said:

It's not a Buddhist student, is a student of training to embodying and becoming Nothingness (which is Infinity which is God), this is what the Buddha taught, you know the destination now, when do you start the journey boss?

That's cute, but actually you're just repeating ideology you heard.

Notice that you in fact never validated any of the Buddhist stuff you heard. You just believed it, like any other religion.

I am not going to keep telling you this. If you don't wise up soon, you'll be stuck in that forever and I will not do anything further to help you. Because you are not serious about realizing God and I don't have time for your games.

[SonataAllegro]

@Leo Gura in my last mushroom trip I died, I realized I imagined every person I know, and that I'm all alone (there is nothing other than Self). A big realization was actually that I tend to believe I can't question you as a teacher but I realized I created you to teach me and it made so much sense. I realized every spiritual teacher is none other than a figure in a textbook and that any method is a distraction from direct realization. I realized I'm imagining that other people are more "awake" than me, which gets in the way of my realization in this moment. And I realized being in This Moment, in complete sobriety (for grounding purposes), is the only practice worth adopting. Eckhart Tolle was right all along lol.

Which "direction" is this? I can't even take on the concept of directions without realizing it's bs. Whether there is no mind or caffeinated mind there is stillness and love behind it.

Edit: could you also respond to my message about my account? thx

Edited December 10, 2021 by SonataAllegro

[mandyjw]

In Bible school I shit you not, we sang this line, "It's the blessed belief that baffles the Buddhists." Cause Christians obviously are above all that shit. 

Not that Buddhism is above any shit either.

[wildflower]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

That's cute, but actually you're just repeating ideology you heard.

Notice that you in fact never validated any of the Buddhist stuff you heard. You just believed it, like any other religion.

I am not going to keep telling you this. If you don't wise up soon, you'll be stuck in that forever and I will not do anything further to help you. Because you are not serious about realizing God and I don't have time for your games.

No boss, I have achieved the first Jhana in retreats, and can 100% confirm that by practicing to become nothing (renunciation, selflessness (no self)) directly correlates with joy happiness and Love, but sustainable, not peak like psychedelics.

I dont speak about that which I do not know

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, SonataAllegro said:

@Leo Gura in my last mushroom trip I died, I realized I imagined every person I know, and that I'm all alone (there is nothing other than Self). A big realization was actually that I tend to believe I can't question you as a teacher but I realized I created you to teach me and it made so much sense. I realized every spiritual teacher is none other than a figure in a textbook and that any method is a distraction from direct realization. I realized I'm imagining that other people are more "awake" than me, which gets in the way of my realization in this moment.

Yes, this correct.

1 minute ago, SonataAllegro said:

And I realized being in This Moment, in complete sobriety (for grounding purposes), is the only practice worth adopting. Eckhart Tolle was right all along lol.

Maybe, maybe not.

1 minute ago, SonataAllegro said:

Which "direction" is this? I can't even take on the concept of directions without realizing it's bs. Whether there is no mind or caffeinated mind there is stillness and love behind it.

It's a solid direction.

But you're not even close to done tripping. Go deeper.

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, wildflower said:

I have achieved the first Jhana in retreats, and can 100% confirm that by practicing to become nothing

Lol

You have never even been to a retreat. You're dreaming that up, silly.

I'm done reasoning with you. Enjoy your Buddhist cosplay.

[SonataAllegro]

10 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

But you're not even close to done tripping. Go deeper.

Aye aye. Could you respond to my pm about my account? thx

 

Edit: I fixed the issue, ignore this

Edited December 10, 2021 by SonataAllegro

[wildflower]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Lol

You have never even been to a retreat. You're dreaming that up, silly.

I'm done reasoning with you. Have it your way, Buddhist.

You never even started reasoning with me, Im not a Buddhist either.

As well as your spiritual work have you ever considered working on communication and social skills? 

[Leo Gura]

6 minutes ago, wildflower said:

Im not a Buddhist either.

After 40 years of chasing your Jnanas and listening to wise old Buddhists -- when you are sick of all those games -- come back to me and I'll tell you exactly how to realize that you are God.