Let’s we all stop calling WOMEN over 18 girls

[Preety_India]

22 minutes ago, LastThursday said:

 When you are referring to strangers, implied closeness should be seen as weird.

I wasn't referring to strangers though. I was referring to acquaintances and friends. Should they call a woman as woman too? Why such alienation? 

 

[LastThursday]

1 hour ago, At awe said:

Word is neutral. Unless you let the culture to connect a certain “weight “ to it.

I think you completely misunderstand how words work. Using language is part of culture not separate from it. All nouns and verbs have "weight" to them. To say it's simple or neutral is a misunderstanding.

1 hour ago, At awe said:

My intention is NOT to insult. So there’s no attack here. 

Well apologised. I'm sure your need to not insult or attack is happening "inside you" and inner work is needed?

1 hour ago, At awe said:

Should the whole vocabulary get reworked or could the protester sit down and wonder:

This is an overreaction. Language is flexible, we can all change the way we speak without it causing us much pain and in the process improve the lives of others: I'm sure you don't use racist language in every day life? I'm sure you don't see not being able to use racist language an imposition?

[LastThursday]

5 minutes ago, Preety_India said:

I wasn't referring to strangers though. I was referring to acquaintances and friends.

I know. But you have to assume that @Jennjenn is referring to strangers, she's talking about women in general - and so am I. Definitely context has to be taken into account, personally I'm not against using "girl" in the right situations.

[At awe]

@LastThursday I guess I’m questioning culture also in that case and all that comes with it. 

I’m aware how words work, I also see that they influence people differently. So there’s no need to pretend that it’s possible to carve something as abstract as word in a stone. I have lived in three different societies 21, 6 and 15 years and thought myself five languages so there has been 20 + years of observing cultural norms etc. That is my conclusion. Yours is different and that’s fine.

There’s no attack, as I said. No need for one. I have very deep respect for women. At the same time life is not serious. Why not tease someone with rock hard opinions. 

No I’m not racist. Was though when I was a teen. It was a learned behavior because of growing up in a backwards society. 

Can one overreact if there are no emotions involved?

[At awe]

@LastThursday

I’ll create a fictional character Mike who loves birds. Die hard fan. Loves all of them. But for some reason he thinks that they SHOULD always fly in flocks of six. So he’s upset most of the time because it hardly ever happens. Is it birds fault or is it Mike’s? 

[Danioover9000]

@Jennjenn

19 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Jennjenn

   I'm confused. Are you asking us all to stop calling women over 18 girls, or are you asking yourself to stop calling women over 18 girls? And what are you going to do when that woman prefers to call herself an over 18 girl?

   The main issues I see with this is scale, whose being asked, and rights issues. If you mean just in this forum, we all should stop calling women over 18 girls, ok, but do you mean just this forum? How about other forums? Do you also include all men too? How about all women? This is the problem with your post, it's weak and vague.

   Also, do you include yourself to this standard as well?

   And the social ramifications of this is also a factor, and whose being asked to refer to other women not as over 18 girls matters too. If you're asking a guy not to call over women over 18, you're semi justified, but you're also infringing on that person's right to how he speaks to women. If you're asking a woman not to refer to other women as over 18, you are also infringing on that woman's right to speak how she speaks to others of her same sex. Considering also who you are in relation to who the person you asked to not refer to other women as over 18, will make your request sound strange and out of context. Also context is important, because you don't have enough information as to why somebody referred to a woman as an over 18 girl. You don't know if that was an insult, or an inside joke, or if all that was in a theatre, or in a dream. So don't go demanding how others refer to others, you don't know enough.

[Jennjenn]

17 hours ago, LastThursday said:

I suspect the discomfort or reluctance to use the word woman, or denial that there's even a problem, is ultimately all to do with how women are perceived. If the two words were really interchangeable, then why would @Jennjenn even have bothered posting?

Exactly, thank you for understanding. People here are saying things like “why does it bothers you?” Without even trying to understand. 
Also, they’re the ones who seem triggered by the suggestion, and implying that I have some type of trauma lol. Why does it bother them that I am a woman who wants to be refer as such? Where does that resistance comes from? 

[Jennjenn]

17 hours ago, Random witch said:

But those who know that I'm over 18, and still call me a girl usually treat me as if I'm a kid and not an adult. 

Is unconscious patronizing. It’s not even cute. 

[Jennjenn]

12 hours ago, At awe said:

The reason why Jennjenn reacted is that she sees the word as demeaning. But the word is neutral. The reaction is in her. It’s learned behavior. The child that sees a polar bear at the zoo has most likely different feeling than a person that lives on Svalbard and lost half of the family in polar bear attack.

Fascinating how you psychoanalyze me with just a few words in an online post. 

[Jennjenn]

6 hours ago, Preety_India said:

Some things are just blown out of proportion. 

Because it’s not important for you, that doesn’t mean it’s not important to others. We can respect is neutral for you, as you should also respect other people’s experiences without dismissing them. 

[At awe]

@Jennjenn If i insulted You I apologize. Was I wrong?

[Jennjenn]

8 minutes ago, At awe said:

@Jennjenn If i insulted You I apologize. Was I wrong?

I think it was you or someone else who said that that we put to much “weight” on words. Yet you created a whole world an a mental diagnosis out of a stranger’s post. Maybe psychoanalyze yourself as to why this topic is annoying you.   

[At awe]

@Jennjenn I’m taking it very lightly. Just curious. I’m trying to understand how others perceive the “world”. Would You care to share what is it exactly that bothers You when someone uses the word girl when referring to You? Help me understand...so that I can see it from your perspective...

[Preety_India]

2 hours ago, Jennjenn said:

Because it’s not important for you, that doesn’t mean it’s not important to others. We can respect is neutral for you, as you should also respect other people’s experiences without dismissing them. 

I'm not dismissing your experience. At the same time you're not understanding that you don't represent all women. If you had titled it as "I feel offended if I'm called a girl," it would have been perfectly alright because it only relates to you and women who think like you. But you made a very generalized statement on the behalf of all women by saying "let's stop calling women...."  You talked about all women. Well, how are you exactly sure that all women want the same as you? Did you suddenly decide that you are entitled to every woman's preferences and choices. This question is a matter of personal preference and not general preference. It's almost like saying "let's ban coffee," just because you don't like coffee doesn't mean that everyone should agree with you. With that attitude you're dismissing the preferences of coffee lovers. It doesn't matter if you feel dismissed because coffee lovers obviously have the right to express their preferences. Your statement is very authoritarian. If it bothers you doesn't mean it bothers every woman nearly the same as you? It's totally a matter of personal preference. If someone calls you a girl, you can politely tell them not to. But don't impose your preferences on how you wish to be referred/called on the entire female population. Because there are a gazillion women who don't have any problem with being called a girl. Also this does not mean that you're somehow more intelligent or superior or that the other women lack self respect, don't try to imply that either, it's just that they aren't offended by it so they don't see it the way you do. Respect other's perspectives and don't impose yours on others through generalized statements.  If you are going to make such statements then expect a negative response as well because you aren't speaking only for yourself. Obviously others have the right to offer their perspective. If it dismisses yours, then I feel dismissed by default because my perspective was never taken into consideration in the first place. Do you see how your approach sounds authoritarian? Also you attacked my perspective instead of appreciating it. You could have easily said -" hey I understand and appreciate the fact it doesn't bother you. However I'm different but I respect our different preferences.“ Instead you cornered me by implying that I'm being insensitive to your problem and that I should take others into consideration? Why shouldn't my opinion be weighed equally? Does it not count? Be careful about how you communicate ideas to the general public if you want them to accept your generalized suggestion aimed at all women, because you're feeling offended when some women don't agree with you. If you made this sort of a statement on social media, you would meet massive disapproval from large number of women. Are you simply going to ignore those who disagree with your statement? That's not how such things work. If you are going to make a statement meant for the public, learn to expect a reaction without feeling dismissed. 

If the title reflected how it personally bothers you, I would have definitely respected your personal experience, no problem. However the way you decided to do it, (as though you're speaking for all women), I have every right to object because I don't feel my perspective was even considered let alone appreciated. Speak for yourself. 

 

Edited December 3, 2021 by Preety_India

[Jennjenn]

@Preety_India got it, baby girl 

[LastThursday]

6 hours ago, At awe said:

No I’m not racist. Was though when I was a teen. It was a learned behavior because of growing up in a backwards society. 

No problem. I'm not accusing you of being racist at all. Apologies if you took it that way. My intention was just to give an example of where being prescriptive with word usage, is actually for the benefit of all; everyone agrees not to use racist language.

[Username]

So many girls got triggered..

Currently I'm not living in English speaking country so it's 1 to 1 translation. Female/woman is more formal, girl is informal. If I like a girl she's a girl. In work related situations using word girl would be less appropriate. It makes her seem younger and less qualified/experienced. If a female is super old.. like 25 years old it's very unlikely that I will call her 'girl'.

In most cases females/girls mentioned on this forum are dating material, not co-workers. That's why they are being called girls.

[Danioover9000]

@Username

6 hours ago, Username said:

So many girls got triggered..

Currently I'm not living in English speaking country so it's 1 to 1 translation. Female/woman is more formal, girl is informal. If I like a girl she's a girl. In work related situations using word girl would be less appropriate. It makes her seem younger and less qualified/experienced. If a female is super old.. like 25 years old it's very unlikely that I will call her 'girl'.

In most cases females/girls mentioned on this forum are dating material, not co-workers. That's why they are being called girls.

   Sounds about right. 

[Jennjenn]

 

[Jennjenn]

15 hours ago, At awe said:

@Jennjenn I’m taking it very lightly. Just curious. I’m trying to understand how others perceive the “world”. Would You care to share what is it exactly that bothers You when someone uses the word girl when referring to You? Help me understand...so that I can see it from your perspective...

If you take this the right way it will change your life and improve your sex life: Toxic masculinity